4000 series hub / upright / spidle options

[shelby racer]

Originally Posted by rokndad

There are several 4700 series Cobras that were fully built in Las Vegas from the ground up, like mine. I believe my front end looks different than yours, same caliper, but the rotor comes off like a typical front disc.

I think Ron(computerworks) did a comparison of the earlier front ends vs. the later ones with pictures side by side. Might have been the CAV cars only, I can't recall.

mine is 4788 built by HST and when I talked to SAI they said that they currently did NOT have a fix or different parts to replace what I had that would solve the issue in the future. I still just don't get why they ever used this system in the fist place. I called Kirkham and they would have to sell me an entire front suspension (control arms, uprights, spindles, hubs, rotors, calipers and brake lines) for a good price (but still more than I have to spare right now).

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by shelby racer

... when I talked to SAI they said that they currently did NOT have a fix or different parts to replace what I had that would solve the issue in the future.

That's absolute crap -- and it means my original suggestion of pulling it off the control arms and sending it all back to SAI won't work either. Isn't there a rep from Shelby that rears her head on this forum from time to time? Perhaps she could confirm that there is an inherent and, apparently, "unfixable" design flaw plaguing this series? I would be mad as a hornet....

[Slither]

I would let your dealer handle the situation!

[shelby racer]

Originally Posted by Slither

I would let your dealer handle the situation!

Yeah, I wish! My dealer was a worthless steaming pile of crap. NEVER could tell me over the two years it took to get the car delivered what was going on with it, promised me installed seat belts and batteries and other things which never appeared, charged me to pick the car up in texas and deliver it to california (even though they only ended up picking it up in Las vegas), charged me an additional fee to bring it from San Luis Obispo to Santa Cruz, never did a predelivery inspection / fix like they said they would (hose clamps on the fuel fill hose loose and floating around the day it was delivered and I am still finding loose bolts on the windshield support and roll bar and quick jacks this week .....), I had to tell them what options were available if it was not in their brochure, screwed up my order.... I shouldn't get started - it raises my blood pressure too much.

[patrickt]

I'm sorry. The only option I see is to put in a complete Kirkham front suspension (control arms, uprights, spindles, hubs, rotors, calipers, and assorted hardware). You should ask Amy B. if SAI won't split the cost with you. You took a huge screwing on your car -- plain and simple; and no doubt you bought that car based on the name. The least SAI can do is share the cost with you now so that you can fix it. I'm still not clear on one issue though, was this design some sort of one-off bastard design by SAI? Or was an entire group of cars saddled with this flaw?

[RICK LAKE]

shelby racer. Sorry for the problems you have with the car. Do you have any more pictures of the setup? I can answer the question about the rotor being bolted to the hub, If you loose a wheel at high speed the rotor will hold up the car as you come to a stop. If the rotor is not bolted to the hub you could loose the whole brake system if the rotor snaps off and takes the caliper with it . If you go to a good machine shop, have 4 bolts install the other way like Japanese cars. They are #3 philips screws. They also keep the assembly from spinning out of balance. If the rotor is a loose fix, you can get either a vibration in the car in your seat or in the steering. Have had this happen with welded wieghts falling off rotors. My other concern is that you have worn out a bearing assembly in 400 miles?? Something is not right here. If your mechanic said that there is play on one side and not the other, unless you potholed the car, the assembly was not setup as to their spec. What would fix some of the problem is going to a truck 4 wheel drive hub and changing the pins to the hub and not the wheel. As far as machining rotors that are a complete unit, there are ACCUTURN brake machines that do the resurfacing right on the car. The 1 ton truck have this. The machine centers on the rotor for a true cut to stop any pulsation on the brakes. The machine can't correct for bent or worn out hub bearings. Could we see a couple more pictures of the splindle setup? Show a shot with the caliper off looking at the back of the rotor attached to the hub please. Thanks Rick L.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RICK LAKE

My other concern is that you have worn out a bearing assembly in 400 miles?? Something is not right here.

Ya think? The other side is probably just an accident waiting to happen as well.

[shelby racer]

Originally Posted by RICK LAKE

rDo you have any more pictures of the setup? Thanks Rick L.

here are more pictures - if you pop the cap off the nose of the knock off hub - it is hollow all the way to the other side

[shelby racer]

Originally Posted by patrickt

I'm sorry. The only option I see is to put in a complete Kirkham front suspension (control arms, uprights, spindles, hubs, rotors, calipers, and assorted hardware). You should ask Amy B. if SAI won't split the cost with you. You took a huge screwing on your car -- plain and simple; and no doubt you bought that car based on the name. The least SAI can do is share the cost with you now so that you can fix it. I'm still not clear on one issue though, was this design some sort of one-off bastard design by SAI? Or was an entire group of cars saddled with this flaw?

I am begining to think that replacing everything with another supplier is the only real solution. I don't know if any one else has or will have the same problems, and I originally was investigating getting new hats and rotors so that the rotors could be easily serviced. Now I am just getting more and more uncomfortable with the design of the suspension. I have contacted SAI again and am hoping for better news.

[767Jockey]

Originally Posted by shelby racer

I am begining to think that replacing everything with another supplier is the only real solution. I don't know if any one else has or will have the same problems, and I originally was investigating getting new hats and rotors so that the rotors could be easily serviced. Now I am just getting more and more uncomfortable with the design of the suspension. I have contacted SAI again and am hoping for better news.

That's the whole point of what we're trying to tell you, SR - you don't NEED another supplier - Shelby no longer uses this screwed up system, they have a fine suspension right now, they are using it as we speak on cars they are building TODAY! It will fit right onto your car with no modifications at all, and your car will still be 100% Shelby, as it should be. In order to use these properly designed parts you will need to replace everything on both sides of the car in the front from the frame attach points outward. They are telling you that they have no parts to help you because they are trying to replace your terribly engineered parts with replacements that are exactly as you have now - terribly engineered. They don't want to give you a complete new front suspension because that costs significantly more, and it may very well open floodgates of complaints with guys who have the same bogus setup that you have. It may be true that they don't want to replace your entire front suspension, but the claim that they don't have parts that fit is laughable. Ask them if they are building any cars this week, and if so where the parts are coming from. When they answer tell them to pick up the phone and order more! They're pissing on your leg and telling you it's raining!

[shelby racer]

I have spoken with Amy B who does monitor the forum occasionally and sometimes posts here (who has been a real friend and source of support for my cobra and 08 SGT-C mustang but who was unfortunately was not around when my cobra was being made or needed to be fixed the first time) and she asked Gary Davis who was the VP originally in charge of the cobras. What I have been told is that there is nothing available. My cobra is a problem child who I have had for 3 (?) years but only able to drive it for about a year (minus the 10 months down time to replace the original 66 Holman Moody side oiler that blew up a week after I finished my sb100 last april). It is well out of warrantee even if I only have 400 miles on it. The people at SAI have gone above and beyond as far as responsiveness is concerned and have always tried to help me out since Amy took over. Some of the people who were there before even tried to help me out even if it was not company policy then. I am shocked that I get almost immediate responses from Amy or Tony or Vince or Gary Patterson or any one else (if they are available). It didn't used to be this way but things have really changed. The people I have dealt with have always been great and now the company policy matches the attitude of the people. Even though it is out of warantee, they always help me if the request is reasonable. I had a problem with the header kit - they got me a new one and took the old one back - no questions. I am having a problem with my fuel pressure gauge - they offer tech support, but for now are not offering a new gauge (which is fair because we don't know what is wrong with it yet). I would honestly reccomend SAI as a company. My dealer on the other hand , not so much...... I don't know if any one has ever had the number of problems that I have with my cobra, but I also have a special relationship with all of my cars. My engine builder (who I would also highly reccomend) didn't believe me until he built the replacement for my 66 side oiler. I don't think that packing the parts off to Las Vegas is the solution since I will have the same problem in the future when I need to turn the rotors. If they had a proper replacement, I am sure they would be happy to take responsibility and send it to me. My car just had terrible build quality and no ever checked it before it was delivered to me. One of the many reasons I detest my dealer is because they claimed that pre-delivery inspection and fixes were some of the reasons why they were getting paid even though they never could give me info about my car as it was being built so I had to keep bothering poor Gary Patterson who always was friendly and tried to cheer me up. The old company didn't treat me right, the car I got was not great quality, but the new company exceeds my expectations and the people are still great - which is why I didn't want to turn this thread into a Shelby bashing session. One way or another I know they will help me out, I just don't know what the solution is or how long it will take. Right now, the cobra is sitting in the garage until I find a workable solution or find a job.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by shelby racer

mine is 4788 built by HST and when I talked to SAI they said that they currently did NOT have a fix or different parts to replace what I had that would solve the issue in the future. I still just don't get why they ever used this system in the fist place.

Bernica, the owner has already spoken with SAI and their answer per the owner is noted above in quotes.

shelbyracer, I'm sorry, but I don't understand how you can say that overall you've been very happy with SAI, when you have this HUGE problem and because it's out of warranty and SAI doesn't have a fix for this possible product defect, you're left trying to make lemonade from lemons. To bad the CA lemon law doesn't apply here, due to the nature of the beast, but personally, I would formally ask SAI to either fix it or replace it with a new roller. Just my humble $0.02.

As Rick said, you can't sell it unless you disclose the problem, and if you disclose the problem, then the value is greatly diminished.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Bernica, the owner has already spoken with SAI and their answer per the owner is noted above in quotes.

Ahh yes, the ol' "we like you, we're here for you, we understand, we feel for you, we want to help you, but we're NOT going to pay to fix it."

[shelby racer]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Bernica, the owner has already spoken with SAI and their answer per the owner is noted above in quotes.

shelbyracer, I'm sorry, but I don't understand how you can say that overall you've been very happy with SAI, when you have this HUGE problem and because it's out of warranty and SAI doesn't have a fix for this possible product defect, you're left trying to make lemonade from lemons. To bad the CA lemon law doesn't apply here, due to the nature of the beast, but personally, I would formally ask SAI to either fix it or replace it with a new roller. Just my humble $0.02.

As Rick said, you can't sell it unless you disclose the problem, and if you disclose the problem, then the value is greatly diminished.

Thanks Rod Knock - the old SAI was terrible (lots of good people - a few arrogant - "were are SHELBY" people and some back policies and situations. The new company has been (overall) very responsive and supportive with my MANY issues with the cobra (and the few I have had with my Shelby mustang - which Ford has given me hassles over). One of the things that I should disclose that will help make sense why I am not jumping on the law suit / go for blood mind set that I could very easily go for is that I have the worst luck with cars of any one alive. Every one has some bad luck, but I have been shown to have the worst of any one that anyone has ever met. It has made me more willing to work hard to to over come the difficulties. I was raging with the old company and poor service and attitude, but the company has changed, and is doing a waaaay better job. For the most part they lately have exceeded my expectations for service. I believe that they are still trying to help me. I am angry and frustrated, but yelling and throwing rocks is not going to help the situation right now. If they stop wanting to help me and want to play hard ball, which I do not think is in anyone's best interest, we can do that, but for now, they are people and I want to give them the chance to try and figure it out and come up with a solution. Do I think the "owe me" for all the time , inconvience, expense and frustration - absolutley, but I am really trying to just get my stuff fixed so that I can enjoy it and not fixate on things that may not be attainable. Maybe they can throw a teralinua or a kr or a supersnake or an fia car or maybe I can get them to buy me a Kirkham

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by shelby racer

...when I talked to SAI they said that they currently did NOT have a fix or different parts to replace what I had that would solve the issue in the future.

PowerSurge, wouldn't you agree that the statement quoted above, if true, is totally unacceptable behavior by SAI?

[Power Surge]

Originally Posted by patrickt

PowerSurge, wouldn't you agree that the statement quoted above, if true, is totally unacceptable behavior by SAI?

What's unacceptable about it? If that's the most recent design, then that's the answer I'd expect.

You think the OEMs jump at the first sign of design flaw? HELL NO. They deny the problem for a while, and then after enough public badgering and possible government involvement, they redesign the part and issue a TSB to the dealers about it.

[shelby racer]

Originally Posted by Power Surge

What's unacceptable about it? If that's the most recent design, then that's the answer I'd expect.

You think the OEMs jump at the first sign of design flaw? HELL NO. They deny the problem for a while, and then after enough public badgering and possible government involvement, they redesign the part and issue a TSB to the dealers about it.

I have heard from others that there is a fix....... I didn't even get a "we can sell you the new parts...." which would still have been screwed up.