SUPPORT OUR SPONSOR

Go Back   Club Cobra > Club Cobra Tech Areas > Shop Talk

Welcome to Club Cobra!  The World's largest non biased Shelby Cobra related site!

  •  » Representation from nearly all Cobra/Daytona/GT40 manufacturers
  •  » Help from all over the world for your questions
  •  » Build logs for you and all members
  •  » Blogs
  •  » Image Gallery
  •  » Many thousands of members and nearly 1 million posts! 

YES! I want to register an account for free right now!  p.s.: For registered members this ad will NOT show

Nevada Classics
Keith Craft Racing
Main Menu
Nevada Classics
Nevada Classics
Keith Craft Racing
Advertise at CC
Banner Ad Rates
Keith Craft Racing
MMG Superformance
March 2024
S M T W T F S
          1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
31            

Kirkham Motorsports

Like Tree1Likes
  • 1 Post By Jack21

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2002, 01:39 PM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Lakeland, FL
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA 427SC FMS 351W
Posts: 199
Not Ranked     
Default Use of Nut Inserts

I want to secure a bracket with a bolt to my frame. I understand that installing nut inserts could be a solution. I have seen the different types and sizes from McMaster-Carr. Can anyone tell me the steps to install and whether the nut insert tool is needed. I found most of my info on the McMaster-Carr site page 3025. Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2002, 02:11 PM
Roscoe's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Fairfield, NJ, USA, NJ
Cobra Make, Engine: A & C, 351W, Tremec 3550. Exiled Member: Club Cranky
Posts: 5,897
Send a message via ICQ to Roscoe
Not Ranked     
Default

Nutserts are ok but why don't you just drill and tap the frame?

Roscoe
__________________
Roscoe
"Crisis occurs when women and cattle get excited!"....James Thurber

Last edited by Roscoe; 08-31-2002 at 02:41 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2002, 02:32 PM
Senior Club Cobra Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: New Britain, CT,
Posts: 1,416
Not Ranked     
Default

Tapping a rail that's less than 1/8" thick ain't very strong...

You can install a nutsert without fancy tools.

Drill the hole very accurately.
Insert the rivnut.
Assemble the bolt, nut and washer as shown.
While holding the head of the bolt, tighten the nut to set the insert. A little lube on the bolt threads help.
__________________
Bob Putnam
-E.R.A.-

Please address parts inquiries to eraparts@sbcglobal.net
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2002, 03:08 PM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Pinellas Park, FL
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 297
Not Ranked     
Default

I suggest you give Aircraft Spruce a call Tuesday at 800-831-2949.
They will send you a catalog free and they have nut insert tools for $15-20 and all sizes of inserts. I my self like rivnuts which are aluminum and have a larger shoulder on the outside of the frame. I use the 10-32 for holding clips for fuel lines, and brake lines etc. with stainless steel screws.

Bill Kozlow
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 08-31-2002, 06:31 PM
Andy Dunn's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: upland, ca,
Posts: 355
Send a message via ICQ to Andy Dunn
Not Ranked     
Default

Cool tip Bob I had never seen it done that way. Simple and makes great sense.

Cobra29, a bunch of people sell a nice starter kits (jc whitney, nutt.com). You might give it a try. It comes with the tool and assorted sizes. Check out special #6, ThreadSert Kit
http://www.nutty.com/specials.html

If you are looking at the mcmaster catalog, I find that the nut-inserts are easier to use and more consistant than rivenuts (the later might be stronger though).

Item number 95585A100 is the tool hat comes in the variety packs and works fairly well.


Andy
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 09-01-2002, 03:13 AM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Lakeland, FL
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA 427SC FMS 351W
Posts: 199
Not Ranked     
Default Difference?

I read names such as rivenuts, nut inserts and others. What are the differences and which should I use to attach a 1/4 20 thread to my frame? I like the idea of using a rivit type tool to install due to the lack of space around the attachment point.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 09-01-2002, 06:23 AM
Senior Club Cobra Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: New Britain, CT,
Posts: 1,416
Not Ranked     
Default

Rivnut is just a brand name (what's the code for trademark anyway ) for the generic threaded insert.

There's a fair amount of strength difference between designs, especially resistance to turning and pullout. If you are going to use a 1/4" thread, the cheapo installation kits are marginal and the bolt/nut method above may be your best bet - especially if you're going to use a steel insert. Steel would be my preference for anything beyond 10 lbs per insert, or something that will removed and replaced more than once.

You can get a good idea of the selection from the McMaster Carr catalog (search on "nut insert").
__________________
Bob Putnam
-E.R.A.-

Please address parts inquiries to eraparts@sbcglobal.net
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 09-01-2002, 08:17 AM
Andy Dunn's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: upland, ca,
Posts: 355
Send a message via ICQ to Andy Dunn
Not Ranked     
Default

one other thing to note is that a 1/4 threaded insert, requires a 3/8" hole. The holes are big compared to the end bolt size. One of the coolest uses for thread serts that I have seen, is the Crane Roller Lifter Retro Kit. They use two inserts in the block drain holes to mount the roller guide.

http://www.trickflow.com/articles/st...ss2_image1.htm

http://www.trickflow.com/articles/st...ss2_image2.htm

http://www.trickflow.com/articles/st...ss2_image4.htm

http://www.trickflow.com/articles/st...ss2_image5.htm

Last edited by Andy Dunn; 09-01-2002 at 08:43 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 09-01-2002, 09:00 AM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Oak Forest, IL, IL
Cobra Make, Engine: B&B w/FRPP 347ci 450HP Crate
Posts: 896
Send a message via AIM to OhBuoy
Not Ranked     
Default

I like that diagram. I was meaning to put something up for people who have not used these before, because I got hit up for $10 for a zip lock bag with an Allen Wrench, A threaded rod connector and a long allen head screw. Works similar to what you showed except you turn the screw head and hold the threaded rod steady.

-Tom
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 09-01-2002, 09:18 AM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Washington DC Metro (Virginia), VA
Cobra Make, Engine: Classic Roadsters, Tweaked 351W, T-5Z, CRII Tech Support Team.
Posts: 1,895
Not Ranked     
Default

For attaching stuff to the frame up to about a size 10 or 12, I use self tapping screws, a nutdriver tool, and a drill. They don't come loose. A little wheelbearing grease helps lube the tapping, and protects the hole in the frame from rusting.

1/4" or larger, I use the drill & tap method. But the drilled piece is usually thick enough to hold the threads.

I'm happy to see that there are lots of folks out there that know their way around a McMaster-Carr catalog. Next to Summit, that's my most frequently used catalog/website.
MFE III likes this.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 09-01-2002, 09:29 AM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Patchogue. NY, NY
Cobra Make, Engine: Midstates 351W tremec
Posts: 60
Not Ranked     
Lightbulb

Could I use one of these inserts in the fiberglass
ribbed portion of the trunk liner to hold a bracket for gas lift. Would it be strong enough ?
Or do I have to cut through the glass and glass in a piece of steel and then tap?
Thanks,
Steve
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2013, 10:08 PM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Bay Area (Peninsula), CA
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA 427, 427/487 side-oiler
Posts: 1,248
Not Ranked     
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Putnam View Post
Tapping a rail that's less than 1/8" thick ain't very strong...

You can install a nutsert without fancy tools.

Drill the hole very accurately.
Insert the rivnut.
Assemble the bolt, nut and washer as shown.
While holding the head of the bolt, tighten the nut to set the insert. A little lube on the bolt threads help.
I received my order of Pemnuts and Rivnuts earlier today and was fooling around with them on a piece of scrap metal. Pemnuts worked well, but I had easy access to both sides of the workpiece. But when I tried the Rivnuts using this method, the head of the bolt would just break off. I drilled the hole using the correct bit and a press, so it's clean and accurate. I used 10-32 stainless nuts and bolts, lube, and a plain steel Rivnut. Anyone tried this method successfully and have any idea what I did wrong?
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 04-16-2013, 03:35 AM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: New Britain, CT
Cobra Make, Engine: Size 10 Feet
Posts: 2,993
Not Ranked     
Default

Stainless steel screws are generally not as strong as other grades. In your case, I would use a standard black-oxide Allen screw for the installation. Guaranteed Grade 8.
McMaster-Carr
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 04-16-2013, 09:35 AM
Rick Parker's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: California, Ca
Cobra Make, Engine: NAF 289 Slabside Early Comp Car with 289 Webers and all the goodies. Cancelling the efforts of several Priuses
Posts: 6,592
Not Ranked     
Default

This is an old thread, however it brought to mind that some of the "Bubble packs" that are prepackaged in hardware stores have the small installation tools included. A grade 8 socket head cap screw, a hex shaped coller with a serated tip to prevent the insert from spinning while installing. This saves the need for purchasing expensive toools and still gives a good result. Most frame rails are a minimum of .120 wall and will accept a tapped 10-32 screw for securing fuel lines etc without the need for Rivnuts.
__________________
Rick

As you slide down the Banister of Life, may the splinters never be pointing the wrong way
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 04-19-2013, 09:41 AM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Bay Area (Peninsula), CA
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA 427, 427/487 side-oiler
Posts: 1,248
Not Ranked     
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Putnam View Post
Tapping a rail that's less than 1/8" thick ain't very strong...

You can install a nutsert without fancy tools.

Drill the hole very accurately.
Insert the rivnut.
Assemble the bolt, nut and washer as shown.
While holding the head of the bolt, tighten the nut to set the insert. A little lube on the bolt threads help.
Here is an update. First, I was able to get the Rivnuts to work with the cap screws Bob recommended. At first, the Rivnut would sometimes turn in its hole. So I took a recommendation I found elsewhere on the web and took a short, stiff section of angle iron about 6" long and drilled a hole near the end just large enough for the screw to fit through. I then inserted the angle iron in between the Rivnut and washer in the diagram above, and held the angle iron from rotating, which prevented the Rivnut from turning. It's important to use the smallest hole possible in the angle iron so the Rivnut does not become distorted by pulling up against a larger hole.

As mentioned in a prior thread, the Pemnuts are sort of slick because they look clean and don't have a shoulder that sits above the sheet metal in which they are installed. The problem is that they are easy to install using a hammer in an unattached piece of sheet metal, but they are difficult to install in tight places. For that reason, I tried to install a Pemnut the same way as the Rivnut, using the tool above (with the angle iron) to squeeze it into the piece of sheet metal. It seems like it worked fine. This may be the ticket.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:46 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
The representations expressed are the representations and opinions of the clubcobra.com forum members and do not necessarily reflect the opinions and viewpoints of the site owners, moderators, Shelby American, any other replica manufacturer, Ford Motor Company. This website has been planned and developed by clubcobra.com and its forum members and should not be construed as being endorsed by Ford Motor Company, or Shelby American or any other manufacturer unless expressly noted by that entity. "Cobra" and the Cobra logo are registered trademarks for Ford Motor Co., Inc. clubcobra.com forum members agree not to post any copyrighted material unless the copyrighted material is owned by you. Although we do not and cannot review the messages posted and are not responsible for the content of any of these messages, we reserve the right to delete any message for any reason whatsoever. You remain solely responsible for the content of your messages, and you agree to indemnify and hold us harmless with respect to any claim based upon transmission of your message(s). Thank you for visiting clubcobra.com. For full policy documentation refer to the following link: CC Policy