B2 Motorsports - Cliff Rosson All-Aluminum 331 SBF Build

[ERA2076]

The stang bell housing had most of that solved.

The car has the possibility to kill in several different ways - the wheel being the least of my worries.

If it's gonna get you, you want to be pulled dead from a Cobra with a set of Webers or a bling 4 barrel :

A romanticist at heart

[blykins]

If it's gonna get me, I want to be pulled from a winning car......not one with Webers.

Don't overlook the safety of your legs and feet. I've seen plenty of pictures of clutch and flywheel explosions. It happens, even with lightweight parts. No way I'd use an aluminum bellhousing in anything that got raced.

[ERA2076]

There is a lot involved in building something that will run and then you have to have someone willing to run it and that is the hurdle which is most difficult to overcome. I don't have any illusions about that.

There can only ever be one winner, so a car with Webers will always be the darling compared to colored foo foo.

If a Webered winner were built - well then -

[blykins]

I have the utmost confidence in your driving ability Cliff.

The issue I have is with parts that just look good and don't perform as they ought. As an example, I feel the same about Aviaid oil pans as I do about Webers...they cost twice as much as a Moroso or Canton, but take twice as long to install. I've used 3 Aviaid pans in the past 6-8 months and yours was the only one that didn't leak...

You will never convince me that a well-tuned Weber setup will outperform a well-tuned single carb setup. It's not happening.

[ERA Chas]

I know it's not a possibility in this particular build, but just daydreaming here...
In a qualified way, I agree with Brent. Meaning, I think Webers may show the ability to match or slightly out-perform a Holley in the mid range. But nowhere else. So a same-day, back to back dyno test would be most informative to prove Brent's point. But that is fraught with difficulties.
I know Brent rents dyno time so the cost beyond the parts and set-up time escalates. It would require that the Webers be optimized on the test engine (friendly cam for one) and correctly tuned. Plenty of time / $$.
The Holley would also require that (but much easier to optimize) and a fuel pressure change, but then, unfairly operate with a tame cam-and not show its full potential. It can however, be tuned for the subject engine and get a max report for that engine's spec.
Dynos aside, lap times would be the ultimate test bed for Cliff's usage. Also difficult to arrange and can't be a same day deal for the parts swapping.
I know, Cliff wants them for what they are; Cobra icons and it's his dime in play here. But like Brent, I think the ultimate test numbers and lap times go to the stone-age Holley.

[Dimis]

Originally Posted by blykins

You will never convince me that a well-tuned Weber setup will outperform a well-tuned single carb setup. It's not happening.

I've no real experience to counter this... but I can't help the feeling that (and its just an unsubstantiated feeling), this may be true for moon-shining, oval racing and possibly even drag racing where the engine lives at the upper limit of its rev range.

That said, I can't help shake the thoughts that in a Road Racing situation, where an engine is driven through a wider range of its RPM band, I suspect the ability of the webers to "react" and physically suck in more air/fuel at instantaneous moment at a transient accelerator shifts may help justify its "racing reputation".

Like I said - I've no evidence or experience... and to be fair, if I drove a car with one over the other, I'd probably lay down the same lap times, and wouldn't be able to tell the difference without opening the hood.
But that's just me.

[ERA2076]

I hope to get some data for the 2 setups. My plan is to get the car settled enough on the track using the 4bl then switch to Webs. The shop that is setting up the Webs tunes with a chassis dyno. I plan to chassis dyno the 4 bl then swap and dyno the Webs.

Brent will have his day (or) and I will have my darling, what is not to like?

Here is a babe -



Come on - you'd have her

[ERA Chas]

Originally Posted by ERA2076

I hope to get some data for the 2 setups. My plan is to get the car settled enough on the track using the 4bl then switch to Webs. The shop that is setting up the Webs tunes with a chassis dyno. I plan to chassis dyno the 4 bl then swap and dyno the Webs.

Brent will have his day (or) and I will have my darling, what is not to like?

Damn close to my daydream-you da man...
Only asterisk is that Brenty can make more overall power with the motor cammed for Holley, thus higher performance than the Webs could ever muster. The Webs in effect limit the motor.
But I'll take the test as you present it.