Jack Roush Crashes Plane in WI

[Tommy]

Originally Posted by snakebittexan

If we limited the post on this thread to those "that do" we would far fewer responses wouldn't we?

I will admit that I was curt with a non-pilot earlier in this thread, but it's not that I think this discussion should be limited to experienced pilots. I enjoy answering questions about flying for inexperienced people who are curious about it. I don't mind non-pilots offering opinions when those opinions regard general topics not directly based on the experience one gets only by being a pilot. For example, anyone should be free to speculate on why Roush used the words he did to describe the incident after the fact. But I do get a little testy when a non-pilot expresses a strong but incorrect opinion about how a pilot is supposed to behave in a particular flying situation. ... Analogies are useful tools when a more knowledgable person needs to explain a complex concept to a less knowledgable person. (E.g., flying in the titanium protected cockpit of an A-10 in combat is a little like sitting in a trash can while someone throws rocks at it.) But analogies aren't as useful when less knowledgable people use them to infer that their knowledge of a simple concept makes their opinions on more complex topics valid. (E.g., I have sat in a trash can while someone threw rocks at it, so my opinion about how to fly the A-10 is as valid as anyone else's.)

[Excaliber]

The Beechcraft Roush was flying is rated for a single pilot. There was a passenger, apparently unhurt, I don't know about her flying skills, if any.

[coosawjack]

Just got an update from a friend in NASCAR and Jack is back at it with only one working eye!! He's a tough guy!!

FROM THE MEDIA:

BROOKLYN, Mich. -- Roush Fenway Racing co-owner Jack Roush returned to the track on Friday for the first time since a July 27 plane crash that robbed him of vision in his left eye.

Roush arrived at Michigan International Speedway around 3:30 p.m. wearing his traditional fedora and dark sunglasses covering his left eye that was stitched closed.

Roush said the eye likely was damaged when his head hit the side of the airplane on impact with the ground. He said it likely would not keep him from flying again, although he will have to re-evaluate certain things such as whether he will carry a co-pilot moving forward.

"I've got to get recovered," Roush said as he stood on pit road with a stopwatch in hand. "I have to go through my recovery. Wiley Post was a one-eyed pilot and there's no restriction. Maybe if you're an airline pilot you can't have one eye, but there's not a reason why I can't fly with one eye."

Otherwise, the man known as "Cat in the Hat" was feeling pretty good for somebody who had survived his second plane crash.

"It is great medicine, for sure," Roush said of rejoining his organization.

Roush received a round of applause from fans as he entered the garage and later as he walked down pit road for qualifying. Being able to make his comeback at what he considers his home track, not far from the home of his automotive business on the outskirts of nearby Detroit, made it especially gratifying.

"I fly over it a couple of times a month just to check and make sure everything is still in place," Roush said of MIS.

Roush's appearance surprised many of his employees who said earlier in the week it was extremely doubtful he'd be at the track this weekend. Several didn't find out until moments before he walked through the door.

"The heat is a little overbearing, but I'm without pain," Roush said.

Roush underwent surgery at the Mayo Clinic to treat facial injuries, most to his left eye and broken left jaw, suffered during the crash at Oshkosh, Wis. He must wear a back brace for three to six months while recovering from a compression fracture. He still has packing in his nose from extensive facial surgery.

"I'm still uncomfortable with the fact that I can't breathe clearly through my nose," Roush said. "Everything will come back and I was blessed to have great vision in two eyes, and now I've got great vision in one."

It was the second close call in an airplane for Roush, who crashed into a lake near Talladega Speedway in Alabama eight years ago and nearly drowned before being rescued by an former Marine who lived nearby.

Roush said he filed his accident report for the latest incident on Friday, saying he was put in conflict with the flight plan of another airplane close to the ground "and I was unable to address the conflict and keep the airplane flying."

"I ground-looped the airplane," Roush said. "It wasn't something silly I was doing erratically or something else that you would say was risky or foolish. It just happened." A few days after the crash Roush Fenway driver Greg Biffle gave the organization its first win of the season. Roush watched most of the race but not all of it from the Mayo Clinic.

"I was still pretty doped up," Roush said.

Roush admitted he is lucky to be alive.

"I feel very lucky," he said. "I've had several bites at the apple here. I'm really proud at the way the organization has rallied. We were gaining in our performance moving from not where I wanted to be in an area of the top-10 into the top-5.

"Roush Fenway Racing will outlive me, and it will out-live anybody else that is with the company today. We've got the plans in place for that. This was a little test case. How can you do without Jack? Well it's bigger than me. It's bigger than anybody."

[Excaliber]

Considering the speed and the "bounce" potential 500 ft is way close.

As I understand it, a private jet, when landing, comes in relatively slow, making it a difficult plane to land just from that perspective.

Some numbers I came across for this Beechcraft. Typical landing speed looks like a 100 knots. Stall speed, lowest, is 93 knots. Man, sounds like your right on the edge.

[ZOERA-SC7XX]

I wonder how much better of a pilot he will be with only one good eye. Unfortunately, he has the money and arrogance to circumvent most any rulebook, including the FAA's. He won't be happy until he kills himself and someone else.

[Ibr8k4vetts]

Originally Posted by ZOERA-SC7XX

I wonder how much better of a pilot he will be with only one good eye. Unfortunately, he has the money and arrogance to circumvent most any rulebook, including the FAA's. He won't be happy until he kills himself and someone else.

I would rather be in the air with Jack than on the road with you!

[cobrajeff]

The remains of the first plane Jack crashed are on display in the "museum" part of his retail store in Livonia, MI. I would expect parts of this one will end up there eventually.

[tcrist]

I will say one thing though. Jack's response/explanation to the media sounded like scripted lawyers words, not Jack's.

[Paul F]

Once the NTSB is done with the aircraft, what can be done with it? Scrap for parts or can something else be done with it?

[Excaliber]

I was reading an article about scraping air planes a couple of months ago. It seems to be a brisk buisness. Some parts sell for surprisingly BIG money, the engines are, of course, quite valuable themselves. But plenty of other useable parts abound on an aircraft (landing gear goes for big bucks). In some cases, like cars, the value of the parts can exceed the value of the complete aircraft.

Once the plane is stripped typically the body is sold for scrap, recycled. That won't be much with Roush's Beechcraft though, I think that body is mostly carbon fiber and such.

Never the less, there are used parts dealers who will step up and make an offer. Parts will be stripped, cataloged, shrink wrapped and put in a wharehouse awaiting a buyer. I'm pretty sure the plane itself is "toast".

[Jerry Clayton]

After seeing all of the photos, and reading/listening to sound tapes, Jack may have been trying initially to go around---reasons for me thinking that----

It is what most pilots would do.
However---the photos definately show that he only had partial flaps and the aircraft entered the stall
With a T tail aircraft and rear fuselage mounted engines---the airflow over the wings in a stall situation can block the engine intakes and rear elevators.
Being that he was flying in a vfr approach to close in turn to final he was only using partial flaps for manuevering so the stall came on quickly with the tight turn----and since he had the power back, he probably got compressor stalls in both engines at throttle up

The airlines fly approaches in a high drag confiq so that the engines are maintained at high power levels to eliminate possibility of compressor stalls and slow spool up--

One Jacks plane entered the stall in the turn in it was pretty much over and I think that from what I have read and heard I believe that he did an admirable job of puttin her down as well as he did.

[tcrist]

Jerry,

Do you work for the FAA or something to be able to have access to that info?

If not, is there somewhere that the public can access that information or do you just happen to have some access that the public can't get to.

Just wondering,

[Jerry Clayton]

Terry

I have 5826 hours flying B727s

T tail, rear fuselage engine mounting

Overal I have 18,700 hours in transport jets

Jerry

[Tom Niebrand]

I have to say I'm sorry Jack. I just came from Beechcraft Premier web page. This plane is sold as a single pilot. It's hard to believe but it's true. This plane with 4pass. can do 1,000 nautica miles at 500 mph. Another way to say this is 1,000 miles at Mach 0.80 this is 457 knots true airspeed. That's faster then those Ford. Get well Jack

[vector1]

Originally Posted by Jerry Clayton

Terry

I have 5826 hours flying B727s

T tail, rear fuselage engine mounting

Overal I have 18,700 hours in transport jets

Jerry

who you fly for now?

[tcrist]

Originally Posted by Jerry Clayton

Terry

I have 5826 hours flying B727s

T tail, rear fuselage engine mounting

Overal I have 18,700 hours in transport jets

Jerry

Ok, so then is it safe to say that you have information that the FAA is not ready to release and you know someone that gave you that information, as you did not answer my question.

That is one of many things that pi$$e$ me off. You or someone else does not have the authority to release that information but you talk about it anyway. Just like the news when they have "breaking news" but will not tell anyone where they got it because the person that they got it from was not authorized to give out that information.

Ok, off of my rant. You can go back to regular scheduled programming now.

[Tommy]

What we have here is a failure to communicate.

I believe what Terry asked Jerry was, where did you see/hear the sound tapes of the Roush accident? In other words Jerry, do you have access to factual information about the accident that we have not seen?

[Jerry Clayton]

retired from the airlines

[BT SNAKE]

Hey Jerry,
I only have 20 hrs in the 27 but it was one of the sweetest flying jets there ever was. I would take it
any day over the fly by wire generation. It's cause I'm old I guess.

Hersh

[Don]

Not a pilot, if there had been a certified co-pilot and with Jack at the controls for the landing etc, would it have made any difference ? A co-pilot just doesn't take over the controls if it is deemed the pilot is does not have full control of the aircraft ?

For the Hudson River landing, believe Sully, as the Captain, used the words " my aircraft " as he took control.