Stephen Becker Automobile group Inc files suit against Shelby American Inc

[NewYorkGuy]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

Where do your profits go? charity?

Aside from the alleged breach of contract issue if there was an arms length deal for a sale at $500k what's shady? What are the details of that transaction? Has the buyer now cried foul or is he still apparently happy with his purchase. No doubt if he filed we likely would have heard about that one.

Please enlighten us.

you're the lawyer. read mr. becker's new lawsuit. at Barrett Jackson auction in Jan 2015 (3 months ago), Shelby sales guys (whoever they are) sold directly to the public all or most of the 50th anniversary cars.

l dont think Shelby bosses want to open up their company book keeping in court. did all profits from the sold 50th annv cars go to company or did shelby sales people pocket money on the side? We will find out in court... or never. previous lawsuit by mr becker was settled out of court . shelby paid undisclosed amount.

only thing Shelby manufactures is a VIN number. thats what the dealers and public are paying for. the VIN number.

[REAL 1]

Originally Posted by NewYorkGuy

you're the lawyer. read mr. becker's new lawsuit. at Barrett Jackson auction in Jan 2015 (3 months ago), Shelby sales guys (whoever they are) sold directly to the public all or most of the 50th anniversary cars.

l dont think Shelby bosses want to open up their company book keeping in court. did all profits from the sold 50th annv cars go to company or did shelby sales people pocket money on the side? We will find out in court... or never. previous lawsuit by mr becker was settled out of court . shelby paid undisclosed amount.

only thing Shelby manufactures is a VIN number. thats what the dealers and public are paying for. the VIN number.

Just perhaps you are reading the allegation literally. If SAI salesmen were selling Cobras in the back alley for themselves then I would think SAI would have it's own claim against its sales people or former sales people.

Why would SAI be afraid to show it's books in court? It should be pretty easy to establish who made the sales...i.e. SAI or its dealers.

[NewYorkGuy]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

Just perhaps you are reading the allegation literally. If SAI salesmen were selling Cobras in the back alley for themselves then I would think SAI would have it's own claim against its sales people or former sales people.

Why would SAI be afraid to show it's books in court? It should be pretty easy to establish who made the sales...i.e. SAI or its dealers.

yes the general public would like to know how much shelby pays for a kirkham roller and resells with a VIN.


i'd doubt this suit will see trial. better to settle and sell the shelby myth to the next generation

[cycleguy55]

Originally Posted by NewYorkGuy

yes the general public would like to know how much shelby pays for a kirkham roller and resells with a VIN.

For purposes of correction / clarification, it is my understanding Kirkham supplies aluminum bodies to to SAI, not 'rollers'. By extension, that would also mean Kirkham has NO involvement whatsoever in SAI cars with fiberglass bodies.

[NewYorkGuy]

Originally Posted by cycleguy55

For purposes of correction / clarification, it is my understanding Kirkham supplies aluminum bodies to to SAI, not 'rollers'. By extension, that would also mean Kirkham has NO involvement whatsoever in SAI cars with fiberglass bodies.

David Kirkham wrote in a thread that his company makes the alum body and chassis for the 50th anniver cobras editions. (i think it's only 50 cars?)

[REAL 1]

Originally Posted by NewYorkGuy

David Kirkham wrote in a thread that his company makes the alum body and chassis for the 50th anniver cobras editions. (i think it's only 50 cars?)

And why would the public care? If you want an Shelby Anniversary 427 you pay the requested price or you don't get it regardless of whether SAI got the bodies or rollers for free.

You obviously never took any economics classes. Buy a book online.

Sheesh.

[Mark IV]

Originally Posted by cycleguy55

For purposes of correction / clarification, it is my understanding Kirkham supplies aluminum bodies to to SAI, not 'rollers'. By extension, that would also mean Kirkham has NO involvement whatsoever in SAI cars with fiberglass bodies.

Correct. The composite cars are built by Hi Tech Automotive and supplied as rollers.

[jhv48]

While I do side with the dealers on this one if, in fact, SAI is selling completed cars against their dealer contract, I could give a rats ass how much anyone charges or makes from the sale of one of these cars.

Who cares how much they are marked up or how much profit the seller makes?
If you don't like the price, don't buy the product. If everyone feels that way, the price will come down.

This is a niche market. Very small volume. The buyers of these and any other Shelby CSX's will either be heralded as geniuses twenty years from now or will be the butt of jokes on how they overspent for these cars. Only time will tell.

My feeling is that as long as these cars are still in production, their value will be stunted. If they ever cease production, as they did in the 60's, then we will truly see if their prices hold, decrease or go through the roof. Only when they are discontinued will the answer be revealed. And I don't see that happening in the near future. SAI is striking while their iron is hot.

I think these cars are being snapped up by speculators and SAI is capitalizing on the death of C.S. and his legend status. Whether that status will continue with the next generation remains to be seen.

I, personally, think his celebrity will decrease with time and the current crop of Shelby cobras will be worth about the same as the rest of the kit cars over time.

The originals will retain their revered status as they defined an era in automotive history. Those produced today are merely copies and will be valued as any other copy of an original.

[REAL 1]

Jhv48: Some of what you say I agree with.

However, while you can say that the continuation series Shelby's are "copies" of the original series, which they are as they must be in order to recreate the car again there is no escaping the fact they are Carroll Shelbys copies of his original series and are genuine Cobras and genuine Shelby Cobras. They are factually and legally the only car that are Cobras other than the original series and those other few noted in the Registry as quailfying. As such they will always command a premium over copies that are "copies of Cobras". This is regardless of whether the market for Cobras withers and shrinks.

Today, BDR can command upwards of $75,000.00. SPF rollers are $70K. A well turned out ERA will set you back $80K. You can pick up a nice glass Continuation Shelby for what?...$120K? If you have the money many will prefer the Shelby because in large part just because it is a Shelby aside from other factors.

In years to come when the wealthy collectors are a new generation looking for the fast cars of their youth and if Carroll Shelby's legendary status or notoriety dies off or is diminished the real losers will likely be the millionaires that paid millions for the original cars. That may be the biggest yuck yuck of all. After all if the enthusiast base for and interest in Cobras diminishes the originals are at the epicenter of that problem.

[Al G]

Originally Posted by NewYorkGuy

yes the general public would like to know how much shelby pays for a kirkham roller and resells with a VIN.


i'd doubt this suit will see trial. better to settle and sell the shelby myth to the next generation

Do you ask the manufacturer's cost for every product you buy? Why is this any different?

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by Al G

Do you ask the manufacturer's cost for every product you buy? Why is this any different?

Here's what I want to know.

Why is the cost of a toothbrush $3-$5 at CVS or Walgreens? The manufacturing cost of a toothbrush must be $0.50, if that. Do you know how many toothbrushes are sold each year. They even offer special editions like Mickey Mouse or Donald Duck.

Proctor & Gamble must be making a mint on toothbrushes. I guess that's why I own it instead of CSBI (Carroll Shelby International), CVS, etc.

I wish I knew the manufacturing cost of a toothbrush. That would be important to know.

[fordracing65]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Here's what I want to know.

Why is the cost of a toothbrush $3-$5 at CVS or Walgreens? The manufacturing cost of a toothbrush must be $0.50, if that. Do you know how many toothbrushes are sold each year. They even offer special editions like Mickey Mouse or Donald Duck.

Proctor & Gamble must be making a mint on toothbrushes. I guess that's why I own it instead of CSBI (Carroll Shelby International), CVS, etc.

I wish I knew the manufacturing cost of a toothbrush. That would be important to know.

lol, love it...