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-   ALL COBRA TALK (http://www.clubcobra.com/forums/all-cobra-talk/)
-   -   Why does every thread here devolve into a "Real" vs. "Replica" argument? (http://www.clubcobra.com/forums/all-cobra-talk/134697-why-does-every-thread-here-devolve-into-real-vs-replica-argument.html)

mullen2 10-26-2015 05:27 PM
Jaguar Brings the 1964 E-Type Racer Back to Life - WSJ

Love the E-Type! Follow the above link and watch it being built. I would bet the 6 New cars are better built than the originals. Man would I like to get my hands on one of them.

twobjshelbys 10-26-2015 05:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mullen2 (Post 1368954)
Jaguar Brings the 1964 E-Type Racer Back to Life - WSJ

Love the E-Type! Follow the above link and watch it being built. I would bet the 6 New cars are better built than the originals. Man would I like to get my hands on one of them.
I love them. I love the looks - lines, shape everything.

But if I were to drop $1M on a car (and that is what Jaguar says, and I'm sure they've all been sold, but I doubt they are only $1M) it would be for a untouched 300SL Gullwing. Another "coulda-woulda-shoulda" event.

P.S. The first comment on the article is from an original E-type (but not LWE, I think) owner in Colorado that DRIVES HIS!!!

JBCOBRA 10-26-2015 05:40 PM
Yes! I want one too. The craftsmanship is truly Amazing!!
Niche market compared to Cobras, but maybe Kirkham would consider it? Please

mullen2 10-26-2015 05:43 PM
I would guess Jaguar would not allow any one to copy their cars.

JBCOBRA 10-26-2015 05:52 PM
I could swing a check for 225k I realize it is Way more complicated than a Cobra.
Maybe 260
Also thinking about a Singer 911 but would rather have the Jag......

Joe's Garage 10-26-2015 05:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ERANJ (Post 1368933)
I guess one of the "dumb jurors" that was referred to in earlier threads :).

Which ones, most all of them. Take a subjective look at all the oppossing threads. He is not stating anything false nor overstating his position based on the content of the Registry. He is simply stating the Continuation Series are not part of the original 3000 Series but the original manufacturer continuing production of a Shelby Cobra.
The primary manufacturer was AC Cars Ltd which provided 70% of a completed car to Shelby. All Shelby did was put in a motor and transmission, already designed by AC for a quick drop-in installation. If you want to pin the tail on the donkey then AC Cars is the "original manufacturer", not Shelby.

NewYorkGuy 10-26-2015 05:54 PM
delete

NewYorkGuy 10-26-2015 05:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mullen2 (Post 1368954)
Jaguar Brings the 1964 E-Type Racer Back to Life - WSJ

Love the E-Type! Follow the above link and watch it being built. I would bet the 6 New cars are better built than the originals. Man would I like to get my hands on one of them.
there was a CC member (now banned from site) who put a down payment on one of these jags..

jhv48 10-26-2015 06:08 PM
I was visiting the sacc forum a while ago and none of those guys seem to have any problem referring to their cars as replicas nor do they consider their cars to be originals.

Guess it's just Evan.

ERANJ 10-26-2015 06:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe's Garage (Post 1368961)
The primary manufacturer was AC Cars Ltd which provided 70% of a completed car to Shelby. All Shelby did was put in a motor and transmission, already designed by AC for a quick drop-in installation. If you want to pin the tail on the donkey then AC Cars is the "original manufacturer", not Shelby.
Significant supplier but not the manufacturer. Shelby completed the car and issued the MSO so not the original manufacturer. Doesn't matter if they only put one screw on the car.

Great example of putting a slant on the reality of the topic, however no basis to the point at hand.

ERANJ 10-26-2015 06:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jhv48 (Post 1368964)
I was visiting the sacc forum a while ago and none of those guys seem to have any problem referring to their cars as replicas not do they consider their cars to be originals.

Guess it's just Evan.
So the point being what..... that Evan is incorrect because what???????

LMH 10-26-2015 06:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RodKnock (Post 1368930)
I tried looking for a recent sale, but couldn't find one easily. Hagerty's webiste has the value range from Condition #4 at $410,000 to Condition #1 at $740,000, as of August 2015.

I don't know if Hagerty represents current value or not, but if it does, the CSX4000 has a LOOOOOOOOOOG way to go before it hits that kind of money.
COX6010 sold for north of $800,000 last year. And it has quite a sorted history!
Yep... Looong way to go!
Larry

Joe's Garage 10-26-2015 06:21 PM
No AC Cars Ltd, no AC Cobra.
Note that they WERE referred to as AC Cobras.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_Cobra

Note the sidebar info -
Manufacturer: AC Cars

REAL 1 10-26-2015 06:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LMH (Post 1368925)
If anyone finds an original COB for $150,000, please let me know!! COX too!

As I've said before, the whole argument about what is or isn't a replica is silly. There are only originals and replicas.

So where did the modern CSX cars come from? The bodies/chassis came from Kirkham for the aluminum cars. Kirkham used CSX3104 as the original to copy. So Kirkhams are replicas of CSX3104, as are the aluminum CSX cars. Where did the fiberglass cars come from? Well, I'm told Shelby used CSX3057 to copy for the fiberglass cars. So they are replicas of CSX3057. Interesting story about 3057 too. Might want to check into that!
Larry
Please. If anyone has info on COB or COX sales post them please. I'm willing to bet those numbers are waaaay below Shelbys of the same vintage.

And where did the Cobra body come from?.... the AC Ace. Your point is what??? So the original Cobras are replicas of the Ace? Where did the Ace shape come from? The Barchetta? So I guess the Ace is a replica of that?

You obviously can't grasp basic concepts. The two originals were used to produce the correct shape. They could have created bucks. They could have produced the shape in a number of other ways.

You can't grasp the fact the issue is the end product and where it comes from and what it legally is. Your analysis is on the initial process of getting the shape?? Uh, Ooookay.

If you don't have a Registry buy one. If you have one read it.

ERANJ 10-26-2015 06:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe's Garage (Post 1368970)
No AC Cars Ltd, no AC Cobra.
Note that they WERE referred to as AC Cobras.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_Cobra

Note the sidebar info -
Manufacturer: AC Cars
Please page 40 of the 1965 CAR and Driver stating Shelby as the Manufacturer.

1965 Shelby Cobra 427 – Road Test – Car and Driver
Downlaod PDF to view technical info where it is listed.

REAL 1 10-26-2015 06:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe's Garage (Post 1368970)
No AC Cars Ltd, no AC Cobra.
Note that they WERE referred to as AC Cobras.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_Cobra

Note the sidebar info -
Manufacturer: AC Cars
No question without AC there would be no Cobra as we now know it. But for anyone who thinks AC is primarily responsible for the developments that changed the Ace Chassis into the Cobra chassis they are smoking crack. It was CS and SAI that directed and requested the vast majority of changes to the chassis to get to the "Cobra" chassis.

The "AC Cobra" existed under license from SAI. No license no AC Cobra.

Read up and come back and play.

Joe's Garage 10-26-2015 06:57 PM
Sometimes, it just comes down to what somebody else has posted.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmustang (Post 1363912)
Let's face facts, unless your car has a providence such as the following, it's a replica :D


http://nebula.wsimg.com/5b627e83a324...&alloworigin=1

Might I add, that you'll notice how it is invoiced as an "AC ACE" chassis with the CSX2032 chassis ID.

ERANJ 10-26-2015 07:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe's Garage (Post 1368977)
Sometimes, it just comes down to what somebody else has posted.
Yes let the facts speak for themselves an original ID tag for CSX3279 not an invoice to the manfacturer.

Not sure how to post a photo however the attached link to Canepa has an original VIN tag stating SAI as the manufacturer.

1967 Shelby Cobra 427_5075

REAL 1 10-26-2015 07:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RodKnock (Post 1368930)
I tried looking for a recent sale, but couldn't find one easily. Hagerty's webiste has the value range from Condition #4 at $410,000 to Condition #1 at $740,000, as of August 2015.

I don't know if Hagerty represents current value or not, but if it does, the CSX4000 has a LOOOOOOOOOOG way to go before it hits that kind of money.
I can't explain a fire sale price for an aluminum bodied Shelby at $150K but that car sold for the same price as a glass Shelby 427 which sold for approximately the same number at $148K on the same cite.

So what are the current sales of COB or COX cars? Way off the price of Shelbys of the same vintage for sure.

REAL 1 10-26-2015 07:09 PM
Oh, so it comes down to an invoice for provenance. I'll most my MSO from Shelby American. Provenance. Besides Mr. Mustang doesn't dictate or decide whats a replica or not. At least not for me. Maybe for you though.

I'll stick to the Registry.


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