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Kirkham Motorsports

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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 05-23-2020, 07:36 PM
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Default Who still drives their cobra in the summer heat

When I first got into my car 5 years ago I believe I drove it through the summer. In the past 4 years I think I have left it parked between late May and the end of September. I now DESPISE being in these cars in the summer. My 427w feels like it has the power of a Miata, the rpms drop a few hundred, and the throttle response sucks. It runs like it has 200hp more when it is 50 degrees out. I guess Iím a wuss but I jump in the car anytime I can when itís cold out. Iím in Memphis and once the hot humid summer sets in...its over for me. I tip my hat to you guys who drive these cars in warmer climates. I could care less about the actual heat I just do not enjoy how the cars run and function. I should put an 800hp big block in it so that it will feel like it had 600hp in the summer!
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Old 05-23-2020, 07:47 PM
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Default All the time.

I live in NJ and it gets pretty hot in the summer here. I use the car all the time. Car has a Roush 427r that has no problem with the heat or performance. Temp never gets above 190 on a 90 degree day. Having an FE might be another story though and that is one of the reasons I don't have one.

Fred

Last edited by FredG; 05-23-2020 at 07:49 PM.. Reason: text
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Old 05-23-2020, 08:09 PM
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I drive mine year round. If it's clear and above 30*'ish, I'm ready.

In the summer, it may only get to 85-90*. But the sun at this altitude is brutal! You'll sunburn in a very short period of time. Asphalt temps are often 120-130*.
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Old 05-23-2020, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FredG View Post
I live in NJ and it gets pretty hot in the summer here. I use the car all the time. Car has a Roush 427r that has no problem with the heat or performance. Temp never gets above 190 on a 90 degree day. Having an FE might be another story though and that is one of the reasons I don't have one.

Fred
My 427 is a dart block windsor around 575hp. I have zero issues with overheating or anything of that sort. Iím just complaining as I canít stand driving the car in warmer weather. Before we upgraded the car and rebuilt the engine it was the same sort, two local gentlemen with similar setups are of the same opinion in their cars.. If we get together in the summer itís an 80 degree night. I can only assume we are similar to a Texas or Florida heat...you take a ride in 90 degree heat and 90% humidity and it feels like you have pulled 4 spark plug wires off the car compared to dry cooler temps. I guess Iím just a grouch and I wished I enjoyed the car in the summer.
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Old 05-23-2020, 11:26 PM
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Depending on how and who set up your carb you may or may not get some level of the summertime blues. Carbs tend to be a black art for the average enthusiast but there are good shops that can work wonders with them - for a price.

The other alternative you might want to explore is one of the many EFI systems out on the market today. If you go that route you want to make sure it supports a Mass Air Flow (MAF) fueling model if at all possible. All the EFI providers will attempt to steer you into a speed density fueling model system. If you go that route you will still suffer from some level of the summertime blues, just not as bad but still present.

MAF based systems measure the actual mass of air entering the engine in lbs per unit time and adjust fueling correspondingly to meet the tuner's commanded AFR or lambda. The MAF based systems give the most uniform performance across all altitudes and temperatures anywhere in the world. Speed density ó not so much. It is not as bad as a carb but it can't hold a candle to the MAF based systems for fueling control.

BTW the reason the auto manufacturers use MAF based systems is that they are the only systems that will keep the EPA out of the manufacturer's pockets for emission violations. The metrics the EPA requires a manufacturer to adhere to are an order of magnitude or more stringent than our tuning demands. MAF based systems hit the bullseye the first time and every time for the manufacturers that must comply with the EPS emission standards ó and they do it anywhere in the world.

If you elect to go the EFI route there are a number of air valves than mimic popular carburetor footprints like 4150 and 4500 Holley carbs. That will allow you to keep a period correct appearance for all but the most critical eye and still benecit from the EFI system. If you elect to go the period correct look route, you will end up needing to use a speed density system because no one offers a MAF sensor that looks like an air cleaner.

If the period correct issue is not an issue the there are a number of other systems that you can go MAF based with.

As a parting thought don't forget, I believe it is Borla that makes a Weber look a like system. The system is actually not Webers but EFI which gives you the look of Webers with the predictable starting, performance and operation of a Detroit assembly line vehicle with EFI.



Ed
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Old 05-23-2020, 11:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eschaider View Post
Depending on how and who set up your carb you may or may not get some level of the summertime blues. Carbs tend to be a black art for the average enthusiast but there are good shops that can work wonders with them - for a price.

The other alternative you might want to explore is one of the many EFI systems out on the market today. If you go that route you want to make sure it supports a Mass Air Flow (MAF) fueling model if at all possible. All the EFI providers will attempt to steer you into a speed density fueling model system. If you go that route you will still suffer from some level of the summertime blues, just not as bad but still present.

MAF based systems measure the actual mass of air entering the engine in lbs per unit time and adjust fueling correspondingly to meet the tuner's commanded AFR or lambda. The MAF based systems give the most uniform performance across all altitudes and temperatures anywhere in the world. Speed density ó not so much. It is not as bad as a carb but it can't hold a candle to the MAF based systems for fueling control.

BTW the reason the auto manufacturers use MAF based systems is that they are the only systems that will keep the EPA out of the manufacturer's pockets for emission violations. The metrics the EPA requires a manufacturer to adhere to are an order of magnitude or more stringent than our tuning demands. MAF based systems hit the bullseye the first time and every time for the manufacturers that must comply with the EPS emission standards ó and they do it anywhere in the world.

If you elect to go the EFI route there are a number of air valves than mimic popular carburetor footprints like 4150 and 4500 Holley carbs. That will allow you to keep a period correct appearance for all but the most critical eye and still benecit from the EFI system. If you elect to go the period correct look route, you will end up needing to use a speed density system because no one offers a MAF sensor that looks like an air cleaner.

If the period correct issue is not an issue the there are a number of other systems that you can go MAF based with.

As a parting thought don't forget, I believe it is Borla that makes a Weber look a like system. The system is actually not Webers but EFI which gives you the look of Webers with the predictable starting, performance and operation of a Detroit assembly line vehicle with EFI.



Ed
Thanks Ed. The QF750 with mechanical secondaries was setup on the dyno by Wayne Presley of very cool parts down in Alabama. I have no cranking issues or fuel boiling in the bowls...no sputtering or anything of the matter in the heat.

If I was going to go EFI it would be multi-port injection. FAST is local here due to comp cams. I would probably try to hook up with a local engineer for install and tuning. I would also go with an in tank fuel pump. I have no idea what fuel injection would do for me...I would just want it done right. The carb runs smooth idle through WOT but Iím sure EFI still wins. As I previously mentioned I just donít like the down on power feel in the summer.
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Old 05-24-2020, 02:14 AM
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My FE runs about 180 in the summer heat here in PA. If I get stuck in traffic, it rarely goes over 190. Driving it in the summer sunshine is hot. Stops at the red-lights are even hotter with the exhaust heat and fumes rolling into the cockpit.
There is a noticeable difference between driving it in 50 degree and 90 degree temps (not to mention the difference in traction), but it's all good no matter the temp. I didn't buy this car to let it sit because it's too hot outside, I bought it to drive it. And if I sweat a little, it's no big deal, I could sweat a few pounds off anyway!
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Old 05-24-2020, 04:29 AM
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I also live in PA and, yes, it gets hot in the summer. The answer for us is early morning drives, sometimes with a coffee stop, and get home before the heat of the day sets in. Also go for the occasional night drive.
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Old 05-24-2020, 04:54 AM
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I bought a cool shirt system, works great best money I have spent in a very long time, my 2 cents
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Old 05-24-2020, 05:52 AM
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I bought a cool shirt system, works great best money I have spent in a very long time, my 2 cents
What is a cool shirt system? I have never heard of that.
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Old 05-24-2020, 05:58 AM
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I live in Ohio and I drive it all the time. We have driven on 95 degree days, but it is a bit uncomfortable.
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Old 05-24-2020, 06:47 AM
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What is a cool shirt system? I have never heard of that.
A cool shirt system is typical used by the smarter race car driver, so obviously not me, to keep their body temp down while racing in the heat. You think that it gets hot riding in your cobra with a teeshirt and shorts on, try it having to wear a full race suit, helmet and gloves. The cool shirt system godson underneath the race suit, or your shirt if not racing, and its plastic tube system, kind of like a radiator, that is hooked to a tank of cold water and a circulating pump that runs water through the system. One of these days I may get one. The guys that I know who use one really like them.

Jim
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Old 05-24-2020, 07:28 AM
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Driving in summer heat is tolerable for me as long as I avoid stop and go traffic. As long as I keep moving I'm fine. Best to go out early or late in the day, and pick rural tree-lined routes, preferably near water.
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Old 05-24-2020, 08:05 AM
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When I first got into my car 5 years ago I believe I drove it through the summer. In the past 4 years I think I have left it parked between late May and the end of September. I now DESPISE being in these cars in the summer. My 427w feels like it has the power of a Miata, the rpms drop a few hundred, and the throttle response sucks. It runs like it has 200hp more when it is 50 degrees out. I guess Iím a wuss but I jump in the car anytime I can when itís cold out. Iím in Memphis and once the hot humid summer sets in...its over for me. I tip my hat to you guys who drive these cars in warmer climates. I could care less about the actual heat I just do not enjoy how the cars run and function. I should put an 800hp big block in it so that it will feel like it had 600hp in the summer!
I can understand your pain. Among the things I have done ( I live upstate NY and we get nasty humid summers too) I had to ceramic coat the headers and side pipes to reduce the heat in the cockpit, I mixed in waterwetter in the radiator and ensure that the fans will kick on at 200 degrees. My optimum temp is 180. If we cruise at slow speed like in town it is miserable since I do not have a top, the navigator aka wifey cannot tolerate the heat either. I try to stay for the most part in open roads and a void traffic jams. I have been trying to get like a bikini top but none fit my car since it is 4" wider than regular cobras.
Since I have done those changes the engine runs much efficient.
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Old 05-24-2020, 08:32 AM
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And that is why I sold my Cobra Roadster and got a Daytona Coupe. Driving in the 115/120 degree heat we have in the Summers was just to much for me as I have gotten much older. Even the Coupe gets to hot on the worst days.

Ron
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Old 05-24-2020, 09:14 AM
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I thought about a Daytona coupe many years ago .... but canít get this 6í5í body in to one and close the door.

I do fit in a GT 40 with a gurney bubble, but still donít have the room to let the clutch out! So stayed with the Cobra and the heat.
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Old 05-24-2020, 09:17 AM
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These responses seem in line with what I was expecting. I’m still fairly young (35) so the heat doesn’t bother me it is the performance of the car. Simply amazing what 30-40 degrees of ambient air temperature affects. I can recall the same issues with sport bikes when I was younger. In the summers you could almost feel like you could watch the rpms climb on the tach...if you tried that in the late fall or winter you would run through the back of a car. What I find more amazing is that if you compare dyno numbers it is not that great of a difference but it surely feels that way.
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Old 05-24-2020, 09:20 AM
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I thought about a Daytona coupe many years ago .... but canít get this 6í5í body in to one and close the door.

I do fit in a GT 40 with a gurney bubble, but still donít have the room to let the clutch out! So stayed with the Cobra and the heat.
Being 6í5Ē saved you a ton of money! I was out at Hillbank and took the GT40 tour back in September. I was out for a business meeting so I did not have time for a test drive but what a car! Long term I believe I really want a GT40 but I still think I would drive the Cobra more often.
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Old 05-24-2020, 01:08 PM
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The cool shirt system godson underneath the race suit, or your shirt if not racing, and its plastic tube system, kind of like a radiator, that is hooked to a tank of cold water and a circulating pump that runs water through the system.
Unfortunately, anything that even comes within ten feet of an FE will start to leak.
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Old 05-24-2020, 01:53 PM
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We have to in NH or we will never drive......
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