How do we get a company to make good tires for a Cobra?

[eschaider]

The biggest 15 inch tire their search engine brought up was a 205 x 70 x 15 which would be inadequate even on the fronts.

I don't understand the problem we are wringing our hands over here. There are perfectly good Avons immediately available and they are a high quality solution to the tire problem.

If you don't like the Avon pricing then go upscale in the rims and tires department until you find an approximation of the look price and performance you are looking for. Chances are you will spend the same amount of money ...

If the complaint is price and that's what it sounds like, then you have picked a hobby and a hobby car that you are progressively unable to financially support. If that is the case, then it's time to look for a more affordable toy.


Ed

[767Jockey]

Originally Posted by eschaider

The biggest 15 inch tire their search engine brought up was a 205 x 70 x 15 which would be inadequate even on the fronts.

I don't understand the problem we are wringing our hands over here. There are perfectly good Avons immediately available and they are a high quality solution to the tire problem.

If you don't like the Avon pricing then go upscale in the rims and tires department until you find an approximation of the look price and performance you are looking for. Chances are you will spend the same amount of money ...

If the complaint is price and that's what it sounds like, then you have picked a hobby and a hobby car that you are progressively unable to financially support. If that is the case, then it's time to look for a more affordable toy.


Ed

It has NOTHING to do with what I or anyone else on this site can afford. Your statement on that drips with ignorant arrogance. The fact is that this Cobra community is the only car owners group that buys the Avon because in reality it's a marginal tire that just happens to be the best of a very bad group and for what it is it's insanely overpriced. It has nothing to do with whatever anyone on here can afford. It's about not overpaying for marginal performance and trying to get better performance at a price commensurate with that improved performance level. Nothing more and nothing less.

[NROTOXIN]

Originally Posted by 767Jockey

It has NOTHING to do with what I or anyone else on this site can afford. Your statement on that drips with ignorant arrogance. The fact is that this Cobra community is the only car owners group that buys the Avon because in reality it's a marginal tire that just happens to be the best of a very bad group and for what it is it's insanely overpriced. It has nothing to do with whatever anyone on here can afford. It's about not overpaying for marginal performance and trying to get better performance at a price commensurate with that improved performance level. Nothing more and nothing less.

"Insanely Overpriced", "Over Paying", "Performance at a Price"......but it's not about the price.

767, "marginal Performance"....what are you comparing the Avon against, PERFORMANCE WISE? Do you have any data that suggests this is a subpar performance tire or is it "I think, I believe, "in my own opinion"

[eschaider]

Originally Posted by 767Jockey

It has NOTHING to do with what I or anyone else on this site can afford. Your statement on that drips with ignorant arrogance. The fact is that this Cobra community is the only car owners group that buys the Avon because in reality it's a marginal tire that just happens to be the best of a very bad group and for what it is it's insanely overpriced. It has nothing to do with whatever anyone on here can afford. It's about not overpaying for marginal performance and trying to get better performance at a price commensurate with that improved performance level. Nothing more and nothing less.

A little sensitivity here 767Jockey? A casual reading of the posts in this thread have pricing as a recurring complaint, in particular for Avons.

Your personal attacks in response to someone else touching on what is apparently a sensitive issue for you adds no value to the discussion. If you have factual commentary it is certainly welcome. Personal attacks are the refuge of those who have no credible logical argument to table supporting their position.

If for argument's sake we accept your representation that AVONs in fact are marginal tires, that doesn't alter the fact that they are the best of the marginal or even sub marginal tires offered for our cars. It's sort or like saying the air is only marginally more than 20% oxygen. So what, that is adequate for us to breathe and not suffocate — same story for the tires.

With respect to overpriced, well that is relative isn't it now. If you are looking for any alternatives for the performance (which you evaluate as substandard) surprise, surprise they do not exist. Sooo, how much is that performance worth to the owner of the car?

For some people the price is simply not worth the performance and they don't buy them. For others it is and they do buy them. The casual bystander might read your commentary as the tires are not worth it to you. Your call, and you are entitled to it.

Disparaging commentary about the products pricing because you think it is overpriced is certainly your prerogative but again, to a casual observer it probably looks like sour grapes or yet another cheap shot.

Avon did not need to nor have to make tires for these cars. They chose to. I think it is an easy reach to say they are not a significant contributor to the firm's bottom line. In fact they are probably a push at best.

If that is true, and that certainly remains to be proven, that means they produced the tires for another reason and I suspect priced them to break even for the firm because profit was not the motivation.

We are back to a very small market, looking for a high performance component, with fairly high sunk costs to put into production. Some of the members of this group eschews a decent and at the current time best offering for their use while complaining about what is very likely a break even pricing model.

Now does something seem a little arrogant about your attitude and that type of behavior ... ?

I know you can do better because I have observed you doing better. If you have a good rational agument against what AVON is doing for us, table it and lets take a look.

Cheap shots, I have believed, were beneath you. I still think I am right and this was probably just a bad day. Am I right?


Ed

[767Jockey]

Originally Posted by eschaider

If the complaint is price and that's what it sounds like, then you have picked a hobby and a hobby car that you are progressively unable to financially support. If that is the case, then it's time to look for a more affordable toy.
Ed

Not at all, Ed. It's statements like this that are arrogant and ignorant. Likewise, I have seen you do much better than stooping to this. The fact that one rejects the notion pf paying twice the price for half the product doesn't necessarily mean that they are over their heads financially, whether it's me or anyone else. Sometimes it's just common sense. If you'd like to pay $400 for a tire that is not nearly as good as most $225 tires in more readily available sizes, have at it.

As for Avon's I'm certainly not on a one man crusade to banish them. I couldn't care less who buys them. The fact is the only group that I have ever seen buy them as a preference to other brands is our Cobra group. If they were any good, than better handling cars such as Porsches, Vettes, BMW's, Lambos, Ferrari's and so on would use them. I have yet to see a single one of these cars use Avon's. Why? Because there are much better tires available in their size. We use them because, again, they're the best of a bad lot in our size, yet that doesn't make them good. If they were in fact good everyone would use them. Few do when they have another choice. I would simply like to see us have a better choice. I thought that perhaps others would see the benefit in trying to rectify the situation rather than succumbing to it. I see little support for that here, and that's fine. That's it.

[NROTOXIN]

AVON CR6ZZ:
DOT Marked
Tread Wear 80
Traction A
Temperature A
Speed Rating V

Post your tire specs to compare

$10 at McDonald's will fill me up just as much as a $50 cowboy ribeye dinner.....But, I'll spend the extra $$ for the QUALITY.

[patrickt]

From the stickers off my new Mickey Thompson S/T

235-60/15
Treadwear 440
Traction A
Temperature B

295-50/15
Treadwear 440
Traction A
Temperature C

[767Jockey]

I doubt that the Avon ranks at the top compared to many, if any at all, of these.

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/TireS...earDiameter=17

EDIT - Look, if anyone wants to buy the $400 each Avon's, by all means have a party, go for it. It's a $400 tire that is simply matched or exceeded in performance by a raft of others for far less money spent. The only reason anyone here buys it is because there is nothing presently to match it for our cars. Find me one modern sports car that has them mounted. I have never seen one. It's not a terrible tire. However it's not state of the art, and it is not priced accordingly with it's so-so performance. It's priced exhorbitantly high. I am not saying at all that it is not the best tire available to us. It clearly is. However, the price is crazy for what you get. If a Michelin PS2, a Nitto, a Pirelli, a Conti, etc were available at $225 - $300 each, would anyone buy the Avon at $400 each? Hell no, and it has absolutely nothing at all to do with not being able to afford the tires or being able to afford a Cobra. It's just about not wanting to pay super premium prices for a less than super premium product. My original idea was to see if there was a way to perhaps convince another manufacturer to correct this situation. Clearly there isn't much appetite amongst the group to attempt that. That's fine, carry on. No harm no foul. It was just an idea. Disregard.

[NROTOXIN]

Ah, we're talking about 15" here.....unless you think the tires on your link will shrink to fit.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by NROTOXIN

Ah, we're talking about 15" here.....unless you think the tires on your link will shrink to fit.

Why do my MTs have the same traction rating as the Avons? That doesn't sound right.

[767Jockey]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Why do my MTs have the same traction rating as the Avons? That doesn't sound right.

Patrick, I think perhaps the numbers don't reliably convey performance and feel?

[767Jockey]

Originally Posted by NROTOXIN

Ah, we're talking about 15" here.....unless you think the tires on your link will shrink to fit.

That's exactly the point. In larger diameters there's lots of choices. In 15" there isn't. I posted that to show all the superior tires to the Avon at significantly lower prices. The fact that there are really few choices in 15" is the only reason people pay the high price for Avons. They're way overpriced for what you get. The link is designed to show what's available for far less for more commonly used tire sizes. The Avon's sell only because there's few other alternatives in our 15" size. If any of those linked tires were available in 15" at similar prices, it's likely Avon wouldn't sell another tire. Certainly not at $400 per. My original post was in seeking a way to perhaps try to correct the availability situation in modern, fairly priced tires for our cars. Obviously not many are interested in pursuing that. Fair enough.

[NROTOXIN]

Originally Posted by 767Jockey

That's exactly the point. In larger diameters there's lots of choices. In 15" there isn't. I posted that to show all the superior tires to the Avon at significantly lower prices. The fact that there are really few choices in 15" is the only reason people pay the high price for Avons. They're way overpriced for what you get. The link is designed to show what's available for far less for more commonly used tire sizes. The Avon's sell only because there's few other alternatives in our 15" size. If any of those linked tires were available in 15" at similar prices, it's likely Avon wouldn't sell another tire. Certainly not at $400 per. My original post was in seeking a way to perhaps try to correct the availability situation in modern, fairly priced tires for our cars. Obviously not many are interested in pursuing that. Fair enough.

McDonald's is significantly lower than a cowboy ribeye dinner....your once again utilizing price in your equation. You go ahead and buy 8 tires to the AVON 4 if that makes you feel any better.