What happens if you put a Z06 and the best handling big block Cobra in a track?

[rsimoes]

Who would really win?

Let's say a 514 powered Cobra with IRS and 5 speed, big brakes vs a stock Z06 at Pocono raceway?

All out.

Who really wins, considering that the Z06 has 405 HP (net) and pulls over 1g on the corners and stops from 60 within 108 feet. . . .

Considering also that you can only go as fast as you can stop and turn,. . ..


thoughts? (honestly)

(We're not talking drag racing, but circle type track)

[rdorman]

So when is the race? I think it would be largely dependant on the skill of the driver. As long as they where skilled and equal, I would be willing to put some money on a well sorted out Cobra. 1g is no problem. Braking would go to the Z06. Acceleration, COBRA. Difference is, one is easy to drive and one is not.
Rick

[Randy Rosenberg]

Where's Tom T? He should be able to voice an opinion from first hand experience...

YMMV,
Randy R...

[HIQ]

With 95% of us driving I think the Z06 would be faster. With the right driver in the Cobra, it may have a good chance.

Here is my question.
What is more enjoyable to drive: A modern sports car or a "classic" sports car?

[coyled]

90% of the zo6s would beat 90% of the cobra's. Why? GM spent millions of dollars over many many years to get the zo6 to do what it does. It takes more than a big motor, big tires and big brakes in a cobra to overcome a factory backed race car. The zo6 is a lot easier to drive also. If you spend a few years on the race track with a cobra, continue to make handleing adjustments, it can be made to beat the zo6, mostly because it is lighter. But, it would not win much. I have been in a zo6 on the track and on the track in the cobra with some zo6's. They are all fast. Scott

[CowtownCobra]

Plus with the corvette you'll get those nice cupholders...

[MAXVELO]

Youll also get floor mats that say "Z06" and a keyless entry! Wait, my cobra has "Keyless" entry! Guess I could steal some floor mats from a (mustang) Cobra? My car would kick his a55 just in looks alone, just parked next to it!

[snakeeyes]

Take a look at the September 2002 Car and Driver, where the lead article was the Tuner Car Shootout. They had a pretty hot SPF driven, IIRC, by Bob Olthoff amongst the tuner cars. At the end of the article, for comparison's sake, I'm pretty sure they included data for a Z06, a Viper, and a Mustang. I don't recall how the stock late models compared to the SPF but it should provide a good starting point to answer your question.


I do recall a quote, from the Car and Driver article ten years or so back on Cobra replicas, to the effect of, "Just don't kid yourself that you can outrun a ZR-1 on the Angeles Crest Highway in one." I recall reading that as the first time I had to start considering the thought that some of the "hot" late model cars might have some performance parameters which would exceed a Cobra's--

Bob

[avanti-176]

Yep, they are called aerodynamics.

have a good one,
Dan

[Tom T.]

At best I'm an intermediate driver, and, echoing many of the comments above, the Z06 is easier to drive quickly than the Contemporary was--so, for a guy like me, I'm faster in the Z06 than I was in the Contemporary. But a guy with real talent and experience, someone like Bondo or Dick Smith, would beat me driving my Contemporary while I was in the Z06, of that I am certain. Cowtown, they only give you one cupholder with the Z06--I found in the Contemporary that the space between the passenger seat and the transmission hump/rear bulkhead worked just fine for sodas and stuff. As you say, already had the keyless entry thing pretty well down! HIQ, to me the Contemporary was like a Harley and the Z06 is more similar to a modern sport bike--the Ford FE motor and the immediacy of all the mechanical bits in the Cobra produced a visceral glow that no modern car I've ever driven (including the Z06) could duplicate, at least for me. Hope to have something similar to it again someday.

TT

[valpodoc]

Hey anyone who's been to Bondurant will tell you the pros in a taurus kick ass on the students in race prepared mustang cobras. A great driver in an average car beats an average driver in a great car. Cobra wins....we're all great drivers. Q.E.D.

Roland

[Doug Axelrod]

Hell, at Bondurant the pros in the MINIVAN beat the students in the mustang cobras. Quite the education, that.

[HIQ]

Tom,
"the Ford FE motor and the immediacy of all the mechanical bits in the Cobra produced a visceral glow that no modern car I've ever driven (including the Z06) could duplicate, at least for me"

Very well said. My Dad has a Millenium Yellow Z06 that I have driven many times. It is so easy to drive it and drive it fast you almost wonder how far you have to push it before something happens. I have never driven a Cobra, but to me it is the ultimate comboniation of art, mechanics, and sensory overload. It man not be as fast as a Z06, but a Cobra has more spirit.

[HIQ]

I am sure some of you open track guys have come across a Z06 a time or two. What do you find?

[snakeeyes]

It is about the sensations involved. My AWD Audi will take corners faster, and with much less fuss, than either of the Cobras I've owned would, but the experience is like listening to Muzak in a doctor's office versus going to an outdoor concert...

[casaleenie]

I've read this thread from beginning to end and I gotta tell you that it borders on BLASPHEMY.. dare I say.... heresy!
It's not too late to hit the edit button and save yourselves...


Hey, does a Z06 come in a convertible...

[rms427]

I don't know about the comparison of a Z06 and a Cobra but I do know that my Cobra is quicker than my ZR-1. A number of years ago the Corvette Club I was in rented the Houston Police Academy Track. We ran it like a slalom with one car on the track at a time. We didn't have that many folks there so we were able to make as many runs as we wanted. I ran both cars until I felt quilty about abusing them. The Cobra was definitely quicker.

[a427sc]

There are three major factors that will determine a Cobra winner here.
Obviously, driver experience will play the major roll as noted before. The Cobra is a real workout to get anywhere near the last 15% from, the ZO6 can get 95% with minimal effort. And they can drive home at the end of the day.
A properly (read major race setup ) Cobra vs a pretty much stock ZO6 is a must.
And the nature of the course being run. A twisty short course like NHIS or LRP up here in the No. East favor the ZO6 with its superior handling. Brakes can be a toss up if the Cobra owner has spent enough to get it right. But a strong Cobra will blow the ZO6 away on the straights. I know of a few turbo Eclipse's and RX7's as well as a very well set up 260Z that will smoke a Cobra on a tight course.

I run my FE car hard on the track, and have reasonable experience (nothing like a real pro, but better than most open track guys) and I can beat most ZO6's I have come across. There are a couple of guys in the DC area with well developed C4's that can run me over sometimes, and vice versa. I'm sure there are plenty of others, just haven't run into them.

Don't bet the farm on the Cobra, mostly it's a bunch of wishfull thinking.

Don

[Don]

Adding the 2004 Z06 Sachs shocks could also make a difference. Comments below are from an article in the Sept edition of Sports Car International that was posted on the CorvetteForum. Demand for the shocks has created an 8 to 10 week waiting period:

* In fact the only really significant change is the new shocks, but oh what a difference they make

* While the result ( Sachs shocks ) is dramatic, improving was not a simple task

* Previous Z06 shocks suffered from one particularly problematic area of the curve, the real world manifestation of which was abrupt body motion during rapid directional changes

* The Corvette team knew they were on the correct path when they were able to lap the circuit ( Nuburgring Nordschleife in Germany ) in less than 8 minutes ( 14 mile circuit ) a time precious few road cars in the world can equal, while actually improving ride quality.

* Gives more control without making the car abrupt

* In comparison testing at Gingerman Raceway a 1.88 mile , 11 turn circuit in South Haven Michigan, the difference between last years' Z06 and the 2004 model was somewhat startling

* Compared with the 2003, the 2004 Z06 allowed me ( Ricard Prince ) to attack each corner more aggressively because the car was more stable going going in, exhibiting decisively less body movement

*The dimished impact of yaw and roll was particuraliy noticeable in quick transient maneuvers and in those areas where the road surface was bumpy or less consistent. And all this from innovative shock valving

* ...........the difference really is incredible

[valpodoc]

Forget the 514...say a nice 289 or 302 juiced up to 450 bph large brakes and a five speed. Let's not forget its the 289 that won the big stuff. A purpose built 289 FIA at 2000 lbs beats a 3000+ Z06 cup holders and all....drivers being equal.

Roland