SPF TKMinus vs. PMS TKMinus vs. 427 Cobra Turnkey

[ROBSSNK]

www.superformance.com

http://www.premiercobras.com/turnkey_minus_pricing.htm

http://www.427cobras.com/options.html

The Superformance are a hair under $37K and the PMS a hair over $39K. Keep in mind that this is MSRP, everything in sales is negotiable right?

The Pegasus come with an engine @ $46.9K but without independent rear.

As this would be a daily driver in summer, I think IRS would be nice but it is not a deal breaker. I've had Mustangs with no IRS and they were fine.

I have narrowed it down to these three manufacturers so please keep coments limited to these three.

Part of the reason PMS and Pegasus are in the running is because they can set up the TKM for a 4.6. I really like the 4.6 32V as it is a great looking engine, reliable, efficient, and with the SC, you can get 390hp straight from Ford catalog. Also, Ford will be offering a 5.0 (4.6) so things get even more interesting.

Please let me know your thoughts. Pro's and Con's. So you know where I am coming from, if Superformance accepted the 4.6 I would take the Superformance (as currently priced TKM and history). But since it doesn't, I have to consider those who do and it sounds like Pegasus and PMS are comparable to SPF.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts!

[Bill V]

All fine machines in my humble opinion. I think though, dollar for dollar, when you compare what you get with each, the SPF is a better value.

[BANDIT 1]

You might ask Eric at Performance Engineering if the Superformance Cobra's can use the 4.6 32V engine.

[Fake Snake]

While the Premier car I purchased is a 427 FE car, the development work they are doing with the Ford modular engines (4.6 DOHC & SOHC) is phenominal. They are not just stuffing these in. They are dedicated to maximizing this platform. Though fuel economy and emmisions are not really concerns when purchasing a vehicle of this type, this platform is likely to yield some improvements in those areas w/o sacrificing performance. A great alternative from a quality manufacturer. They are dedicated to seeing that you are happy with the end product.

Have you had "The Ride" in the supercharged 4.6 DOHC car they have?

[SN8KE]

Hey ROBSSNK: Good luck with whatever choice that you make, however I beleive that the roller price for the SPF has gone up to a hair under 40k.
Bruce

[ROBSSNK]

No ride in the PMS car yet. I sometimes drive my wife's car, does that count?

No in all seriousness. I am planning on visiting the plant this summer. Late June.

I know when buying this kind of car gas mileage is not a factor. But then when I see how much I would be communiting in it, I have to factor in reliabilty (I believe EFI cars are more reliable than Carbs) and gas mileage (as I live in the Bay area and currently premium is $2.29).

I guess I could run a low compression 351 and run regular, performance would be less, parts are there in the long run, however mileage would still be better in a 4.6 thus I have to consider it. Even a SC 4.6 gets way better mileage. Also, 4.6 is the way of the future no?
Torn torn torn. Maybe if I had 2, the 2nd would be a FSB or FBB.

I got the price from a link on the website for my dealer which happens to be the Ohio dealer. If price of SPF has gone up, that makes my decision harder.

[Bill V]

Not really. Look at each of the three and see what standard equipment each of them comes with, item by item, that's what I have done in my quest toward my own upcoming purchase. You'll soon see which one comes out ahead. What are options on two of them come standard on the other.

[bobl]

ROBSSNK... we would suggest that you look at every SPF car that you can. Once you visit Kansas City in late June, if you are like 90%+ of our visitors, it has been our experience that it will take you about an hour to come to a "slam dunk" decision about which car is the best value. We can provide you a NUMBER of references that will repeat the same thing over and over...."this is not your buddy's kit car and there is no other like it". I'm sure you will come to that conclusion once you've done your due diligence. All the best across the miles..... Bob

[BANDIT 1]

With all due respect Mr. Locket, I disagree. The Superformance Cobra and the PMS Cobra are top notch quality vehicles, however they are different. Instead of everyone saying "ours is better, come look" it would be better if each manufacturer would simply deliver the details of their product. I am sure if someone goes to your factory and see's all of the production stages of a Cobra, they will be in"awe" (I know I was impressed, I have been there atleast 3 times). Then you want someone to look at a Superformance Cobra in someone's driveway, and compare the two? I am sure if you fly to South Africa and see the Superformance Cobra being assembled you will be blown away also.

It boils down to what you want in a Cobra. A Superformance Cobra is completely different (square tube chassis, steering, sidepipes, engine/transmission, brakes, seats, rear-end, front fans, etc...) underneath than a "original" Cobra. The PMS is built to "replicate" the original chassis and look of the car (they do have "upgrades" to several items) even down to alot of them having "original" looking 427 and 428 engines. PMS also has a "radical" blown 4.6 engine in one.

I suggest you decide what you want in a Cobra and then do some research on whatever brand Cobra fit's those needs. Test drive several cars and make sure you know when the car was built. A 2003 Superformance Cobra has many improvements over a 1999 Superformance Cobra (alot of Superformance Cobra owners keep up with the improvements and "upgrade" their cars to the new specifications).

[RedBarchetta]

Originally posted by ROBSSNK



Keep in mind that this is MSRP, everything in sales is negotiable right?

If you can negotiate the price of a new SPF to below MSRP, then we'll start calling you P.T. Barnum. Expect to pay full price....demand is still pretty good for these.

Just remember that 99.5% of the people out there won't know a real one from a replica. So long as the body is correct in every dimension, the chassis is a matter of personal preference and usage. The underpinnings on an SPF are top notch (Ford IRS, 4 wheel Wilwood power-assisted discs, adjustable coil-overs, etc.).

-Deano

[G.R.]

For what you get "standard" with an SPF roller, compared to other makes "standard" w/ options added in IMO the SPF is the way to go. Not knocking the other builds but the SPF and it's dealer support network is awesome--

Former SPF owner

[Fake Snake]

Another item that was a nice perk in dealing with the Premier folks was their "open door" policy so I could drive the 100 miles once a week to take pictures of the build and have a scrap book to go along with the finished car. (Although they offered to take pictures for me, truth be known, I was also looking for an excuse to do a bit of Cobra bonding.) But the pictures were kind of important to me and certainly does not reflect everyone elses needs. In the end, you've got to please yourself! Whatever direction you go, I hope that is the end result!
bh

[MidOHasp]

ROBSSNK,

It's very easy to get caught up in this forum, and I hesitate to say "caught up" because of the negative connotation. I mean it exactly as I say it, no implied meaning, no connotation.

There are so many smart people here and their opinions are infinitely valuable. But picking a Cobra replica can and should be a very subjective process, entirely up to you, based on your emotions.

Engine building, while your preferences for what you want out of it are subjective, is pretty objective. Stuff works, other stuff don't. Yet, if you talk to 100 engine builders you'll probably get at least 50 different opinions on the "right way" to do something.

Given that the car itself (minus motor, tranny) is more subjective than the motor, you gotta just feel it. Everyone's got an opinion, and more than 50% of the time (but not always) those opinions are going to be swayed by what someone has in their own garage. That's not an accusation, it's natural and realistic. If half or more SPF owners said "hands down I'd do it different next time," then that's a bad thing. Same for any manufacturer.

So, I think the best advice, and some of it has already surfaced in this thread, and much more will likely come in the next few days, is to look at a lot of them, let yourself fall in love, and make your move.

The odds of you looking back and saying, "darn it, my car is a real piece of crap. I should've gotten a _________!" are real slim, man.

These cars are all about falling in love and having abusive amounts of power under your foot to supplement a timeless shape that will never die. Not who's got what or who thinks what about whose whatever.

Someone said it well once - "Cobra people pick their teeth with a rusty nail. They don't care what anyone thinks, whether it's 'real' or 'original' or anything else."

Best of luck to you whatever you decide and have fun w/ it.

JP

[CSX 4027]

Is there really a Cobra called PMS???

What will they think of next?

How about a "Chapter 11" Cobra for those that put too much $$ in their car?

[bobl]

PMS? Maybe that stands for "Positive Male Stimulation".... what will they think of next???

Maybe its GOOD to have stupid horsepower at your command.

Maybe its GOOD to have the ability to "light em up" and have an exhaust note that drowns out the boom box in the banger's car next to you at a light.

Maybe its GOOD to return to a time when PC wasnt the rule of the land, the bureaucrats werent strangling the last ounce of fun from our lives, and being your own person was a reality.

Maybe its GOOD to be a MALE in this sea of estorgen we're living in.

Maybe PMS is a GOOD thing..... and yes, there is a PREMIER Motorsports Cobra. Its real loud, its real fast, and its real fun. No apologies made from here nor are any necessary.....

Wanna put some real fun in your life? Have a Positive Male Stimulation experience!

[CSX 4027]

I always thought it stood for

PUNISH MY SPOUSE

[bobl]

PUNISH YOUR SPOUSE????

Only if you make her drive the Ferrari.......

[Chuck Nickloy]

p ursuing
m axiumum
s peed


Chuck

[Bill Wells]

robbssnk...

ya gotta go with what your heart and wallet tell ya...re SPF, unless you find one in stock somewhere at the old price, their new price is prox $40 k now. also a 4.6L will not fit into a spf, engine is too wide and would encounter steering interference without engine bay mods. the new ford 5.0 (4.6L ) cammer is impressive and very pricey compared to other engine offerings, either built or crate. the 4.6L's have alot of aftermarket power add ons available like other engine choices with more potentially avail yet to come from the aftermarket engine hop up builders.

dont forget to weigh in your decision process : tech, parts, dealer support of one brand vs another if that is anything you care about. talk to owners of all brands and you will get decidedly different answers to what is avail from whom.

i am not familiar with, nor have i seen a pms, so i am not intending to slam their product offerings...but rather confirming the new spf base price msrp and 4.6 engine fitment issue as raised in your original post and in a few responses from others..

now, go check em all out and whatever ya get, enjoy it and drive it...there are many fine choices,,,ya takes your pick and pay your price and hopefully enjoy many smiles to the miles...and dont forget, there are many fine used low mileage cars available too.

bill, motown, old spf #156 built in 1996 holding up like it was a new car !

[Flyin_Freddie]

As an SPF owner and pretty much an SPF bigot....I'm not so sure I get the same value for my money with your PMS offering.

If I read your website correctly, your price is $39,215, if I recall correctly.

But...at that price...with the options quoted on PMS's website, you have to add these items to make it similar to an SPF...

$ 195.00 Body snaps and ferrules
$ 350.00 Tonneau cover
$1,895.00 Convertible Top and side windows
$ 895.00 Heater/defroster with controls
$ 395.00 Remote Oil Filter Assembly
$ 895.00 Oil Cooler Assembly (complete)
$ 395.00 Dual Fans w/ Manual Override
$ 650.00 HP HD Racing Aluminum
$ 595.00 Standard 18 gallon aluminum Gas Tank
$2,695.00 TRIGO pin drive wheels
$ 795.00 Leather Interior
$ 460.00 Smith gauge upgrade
$1,200.00 Dual racing stripes

For a total of $11,415.00 additonal added to the quoted $39,215 price, for a revised total of $50,630....and THEN you get to put an engine and drive train in your PMS....

I guess my calculator works differently than yours, but mine says $39,900 for an SPF roller which INCLUDES all the above mentioned options is a helluva lot LESS than a 'comparable' PMS, which is $50,630 for a roller with the same equipment that comes standard on an SPF....is that right....?

But...indeed, if one throws out all the features that PMS makes you pay EXTRA for....(don't forget those are the same options that are STANDARD on an SPF)....then I guess you're right: the PMS is cheaper.

Now...if I'm mis-reading PMS's website...then someone needs to tell me. Also, I'd sure like to see some of the names who make up some of that 90% you're talking about....'cause I ain't believing it.....plain and simple.

But....I don't know....I could be wrong....