cobra ownership thoughts/questions

[joe s]

OK; now that I'm reaching the point of considering a real automotive toy, I'd like to express some of my feelings and ask for your comments. I've looked at this website for some time and you all seem to be a good honest group of car lovers, and Cobras in particular, of course.
I've been an auto enthusiast all my life and do own/have owned some nice cars. A few years back I made the 'mistake' of walking into a Superformance dealership (Ross, Ohio) and was totally smitten. Every so often I go in there, occasionally taking a test drive, and having a pining, sick feeling in my gut for a week or 2 afterwards - you know the feeling I'm sure! The Cobra has always shared a spot in my heart with the mid-year Corvette - I've owned and enjoyed a '67 Vette and have missed it - sold it 10 years ago. But, it was a old car, restored but old nevertheless, and I became somewhat paranoid driving it ie is it going to get chipped, is it going to start showing its age, etc.
The Cobra, SP in particular, is, however, NEW, and durable, and separated from the worries of classic car ownership in THAT sense. You can really drive the thing.
I think I'm over the 'real' vs replicar thing. There's no way I could afford a real Cobra, let alone be able to drive it as often or as indiscriminately as I would the SP. It IS, as you all know, a fairly good chunk of change in any case. I figure it'll run at least $50K to buy new.
I've noted someone stating in the 'for sale' forum that the market is soft; is that the general consensus? I've noticed resale is not great; you can get a nice (and I'm talking SP here, since that's the only brand I'm really considering) pre-owned Cobra for low to mid $40's, a significant hit on a typically pampered, low miles $55-$60K car. Not that I'm buying it for resale - car ownership shouldn't be like that - but it is something to consider. I don't have the time, space, know-how or equipment to do any assembly on my own. I want a finished car - just need to add the motor/tranny ala SP. Unfortunately, the Cobra I would like is the roadster style - right terminology? - ie with rear exhausts and a higher reving small block - more the 289 style. It appears that this style, at least as far as I can tell, makes up approx 5% - 10% of Cobra replicar sales, so a used one is probably out of the question unless I get awfully lucky, both with brand, equipment, color etc and timing.
I'd like to drive the thing a lot as well, and the weather in S. Ohio is marginal for this.
So, no real concrete questions; just a bunch of thoughts I hope many of you have shared. Any comments/suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
From what I gather, for the money, the Superformance product is probably the best product for an authentic Cobra - comments?
This may be new car buying jitters, but it is a lot of money. I just don't get the thrill out of $50K modern sports cars that I get every time I see one of these Cobras.
Thanks for any comments!
Joe

[rdorman]

Welcome Joe. As you will see from my profile I am also in Ohio. The Ohio Cobra Club alone has 118 members so lots of folks to hook up with there.

The market is soft right now. A number of factors such as the job and stock markets and some new folks in the business. Used is an excellent way to save a buck. Much, much better than it was a few years ago. Resale a few years back was much better. If you are looking to get in a Cobra than you have picked the right time if you go used.

From the sounds of things you are looking for either a slabside or FIA type body set up like a street car. Which is confusing since you where looking at SPF. They sell S/C stlye bodies. Now there is a Roadster body style which is the big block street car. I am not sure if SPF can accomidate that request or not. But it is hard to go wrong with SPF.

Either way, companies such as ERA and Unique can help and have made those types of cars. Sure you can buy them in kit form from them or you have them shipped virtually complete.

If you want to kick the budget up you could look at Kirkham. I think they would build pretty much what ever you want. I also saw recently where their first slabside had arrived.

Take your time. The right car will come along. If you can wait a mere 79 days for DVSFIV you can look at a couple of hundred of them in person and some will be for sale! Also there is Carlisle in May where many of the manufacturers will be represented and you can check out their products.

I understand how you fealt about the vette. Even if I could afford and Original Cobra I would still have to have a replica!

Rick

[Ron61]

Joe,

I don't own a Superformance but they are very nice cars and I have driven and ridden in a few. You are correct about the resale value as I never got my car with the idea of making money on it. You may have already looked, but you can look on the Cobra Country site as they normally have several listed for sale. And yes, it will be harder to find a used one with the 289 body style and under the car exhaust. But I have seen a few listed from time to time. As you are in Ohio, you might try contacting a few of the guy's there that are in the club and maybe they can really help you out. As for it being an authentic replica of the originals, that will depend on what gauges etc. the previous owner used if you buy used. Good luck and welcome to the nut house.

Ron

[Steve Cassani]

I noticed that you mentioned the cost of a new SP three times in your note and you take the time to consider the current market for used cars, including those that have been well cared for with low miles. Your consideration did not yield a happy result.

While it is easy to acknowledge that car ownership should not be thought of as an investment, I wonder whether you are comfortable with the idea of owning a +$50,000 new car (mine costs nearly $60,000, including delivery, license and first insurance payment). Although it takes many, many hours to earn it, you only get to spend the money once and I can't tell from your note that your enthusiasm for owning a well construted replica is enough to quiet your misgivings regarding how much you will have to spend.

One thing is for sure: If after you've owned the car for a few months, the experience is not enough to silence any lingering doubts the situation will not improve with time. Don't put yourself in a position of continually second-guessing your decison to purchase, especially if the nagging doubt takes the form of wondering over other opportunities foregone because you cannot afford both the car and ....

Everyone who participates on this forum knows the uncertainty you face. My guess is that a fair share of the cars offered for sale only a year or so after purchase come to the market because the owner failed to do a fully honest job of resolving the uncertainty. Indulging in a fanatasy is expensive, really expensive and a lot of quality literature has looked at the collision beween fantasy and reality. Good luck with your deliberations. The road ahead of you has a lot of footsteps.

[rdorman]

Interesting point Steve. I don't know if this is going through your mind or not Joe but it does happen. I know of a number of cars that have changed hands soon after the initial owner purchased the car. Not for any reason of the cars fault but the reality and the fantasy did not match.

But, if you still long for the 67 vette (especially if it was a big block), then IMO this will not be an issue for you!

But either way, more fuel for checking out the used market!

Rick

[Excaliber]

No question, the market IS soft. Making a used Cobra at this time an excellent idea. SPF is hard to fault and even in the current market their holding their price well all things considered.

How much would expect to loose on MANY other "exotic" cars? Jaguar for instance? Percentage wise on resale value SPF and other "top shelf" brands are doing remarkably well. The lower end of the market is where the cars are really taking a pounding on re-sale.

For a daily driver, which I STRONGLY recommend for your first replica, go with a small block. 351 in an SPF would be ideal, no need to got the "max" h.p. version etiher. A well built moderate 351 with a five speed is hard to beat for a daily driver! SPF typically comes with a soft top, many replicas don't. You WANT the soft top, heater/defroster and side curtain windows.

Will you like the car after all? Tough call, these are not "user friendly" cars. And "daily driver" could be mis-leading. There not that comfortable, especially compared to almost ANYTHING else.

So,,,,, why do some of us have such a passion for these cars? Many reasons but heres mine. It is the ultimate expression of classic motoring. The epitomy of "performance". The scale by which other performance cars are compared to. It is the "peoples" car. NO OTHER car I've EVER been around has such an amazing impact when parked on the street, or the grocery store or the car show. Your typical exotic car is not always "approachable". OH, expensive car I better not touch, I bet the owner is some big shot, be careful.

For some reason, still leaves me baffled, the Cobras ARE approachable. Everybody, young, old, man or woman, they love this car. People are DRAWN to this car. Park it next to the hottest Ferrari and I gaurentee the Cobra will draw more attention and comments. Go figure!!!

If your not a "people person" do not buy a Cobra! My biggest kick out of owning one (I'm on number three now) has been SHARING it with the masses. Bringing miles of smiles to all who come in contact with the car. I'm STILL amazed by it.

Ernie

[joe s]

Great, thoughtful responses, and I do appreciate them. Yes, cost is a factor, and I've deliberated long & hard about it - fantasy does cost $$. I can swing it, it won't be a piece of cake, and I will thoroughly think things through. I tend to be like this with all significant purchases so this pondering is nothing new or of surprise to me (or my wife, who incredibly likes the car!). I will go through with this when and only when I've convinced myself I will not be one of those who sell soon after purchase because the fantasy and reality don't jive - I did this with a Porsche in 1986 and haven't come close to doing it again.
I had hoped and assumed that many Cobra purchasers have had similar thoughts.
I will keep my eye open for used Cobras, though as I mentioned I prefer the rear-exhaust small block. In response to rdorman, SPF does offer the rear exhaust, though it isn't a separate body style ie FIA. Other than the exhaust it has the FIA instrument cluster and a rivet-less hood scoop. Still looks great, IMO.
Thanks again. Your input and experience is very important.

[trularin]

In this case, you get what you pay for.

[joe s]

Both the looks of the car and the driving experience have been equally positive. I love the 'heft' of the car, the mechanical feel of the clutch and the shifter, the bark and instant throttle response, the sounds of the car. I have driven 3 different ones and each time came back realizing you don't really have to beat the car or go super fast to get a kick out of it.

[Ron61]

Joe,

Rick Parker on the club here might be a good person to talk to. His isn't a Superformance but he built it to the exact detail including the 289 and under car exhaust and he could tell you a lot about what to look for. As for DIRTY ERNIE and his pushing the small block, he just wants his 690 horsepower BB to be bigger than yours.

Ron

[rdorman]

Good to know Joe about the SPF "roadster" version. I was unaware. Of course, I have never looked either! Some day, I will probably return mine to full street version. I love the look!

20 of the OCC members list Superformance as the type of car they own. Drop me an email and I will send you the list with the contact information if you like.

Rick

[dcetina]

Joe,

I live in the Seattle area and have been researching Cobras for about a year plus now. I finally pulled the trigger about a month ago on a beautiful Portifino blue SPF with 3200 mi. on it. Got it from this web site from a gentleman in San Diego, only after much correspondence, questions, pictures, more questions. I was originally going to buy a car from Don Borders, of Contemporary fame, in Palm Desert Ca. Beautiful car, great guy. After figuring the building cost in upwards of $72,000 after I painted it. I just couldn't justify it, when I could buy a completed SPF for $45,000. I wanted to build my own but as with most people I just don't have the luxury of time. I know the gentleman I bought my car from lost upward of $20,000. My car has around 530 hp and is a beast, as one person said in this thread, they are not comfortable compared to anything, but damn are they fun.
If you are considering an everyday driver I would keep the HP down,even the gentleman I bought my car from said he would keep the HP around 400 + or - if he had to do it over again, and I have to agree, these cars don't like to go slow.
I chose the SPF because some day I will sell, and it is a known commodity, the car is well made.
So good luck with your choices, sounds like your on the right track. This is a great site for information, some very knowledgable people and a couple of dorks.

[RedBarchetta]

'67 Stingray. For $45K you will find a really nice example that has probably been "gone through" and cosmetically restored at least twice, maybe three times. For that kind of money you will find it very hard to locate a numbers-matching example, especially for the more desirable big block versions. It will be predictable, somewhat easy to take care of and can be driven at all hours of the day in pretty much any weather you are willing to throw at it. Your neighbors will be jealous and the car will attract its fair share of admirers wherever you go.

Cobra Replica (SPF, for example): For $45K, you will find a really nice example that has low miles. The spectacular factory finish will still have the same quality luster you would expect. Most likely the frame will also be clean, if not spotless. Whether BB or SB powered, it will always drive like a scalded cat and leave a permanent grin on your face. Maintenance will probably cost a little more, as it truly is a race car with license plates. It's much more a fair weather car versus the Corvette....you'll want to take it out on only the good days and might think twice on the marginal days. Your neighbors will be jaw-drop jealous of your every move and will accidentally mow over their flower bed everytime you open the garage door. You will attract crowds if you stop near a crowded place...people will want to ask you a ton of questions and you will oblige with a thousand answers.

They are truly two different cars with two distinct personalities. The question you have to answer is "Which car best extends my own personality?" I believe that the answer will be the best fit for you.

-Deano

[Excaliber]

Ha ha,,, every family has a couple of "dorks" in it somewhere.

[Edley Rondinone]

Joe S: I live in sunny, year-round-Cobra-driving-weather Southern California, and I LOVE to just drive! I always loved the Cobra design, for at least thirty years now. (I'm 45.) I have had my Cobra just over two years now, and absolutely LOVE it!!! The sounds of the car, the acceleration, the attention it gets, I LOVE IT ALL!! It sounds like you would be a good candidate for Cobra ownership; Heck, even your wife likes it!

Here's one plan of attack: But a used Superformance Cobra for, say $45,000*. Drive it a while. IF, (and that's a BIG "IF"), you DONT like the car after that while, you could sell that same car for close to $40,000*, (maybe more, maybe less), and only lose $5,000*. (*amounts approximate.)

I think you will love having and driving this Cobra. You only live once. Go for it!!

[REDSC400]

Hi Joe:
From my perspective, buying a Cobra is a wonderful entre' into the sports-car and hot-rod worlds, both at the same time. Our Cobra reproductions offer us the true escape vehicle both, when we can and cannot drive them. We can dote on them, change things, debug and refine items in the car which collectivly makes the Cobra more of a reflection of ourselves.

I was in your shoes not that long ago... likewise, like you, I once had a Corvette split window coupe, all original too. I was looking for a real nice Cobra and looked at quite a few of the makes. Kirkham, Shelby, ERA, Superformance and TeamC.

Luckily, I ran across a 12 year old ERA 427 S/C that was for sale by the original owner. The car was meticulously maintained and perfect in nearly every way. In fact, if I was going to order an ERA it would have ended up just about like #375 xcept I would have (like you) opted for a roadster vs the S/C with rollbar and side exhaust. The 289 roadster is a nice looking car as is the 427 roadster.

There were some minor things that I have been working on with the car, but that, to me, is half the fun of ownership, especially in the winter months when we pretty much cannot drive these beasts regularly. Southern Ohio, as you know is not Southern by any stretch of the imagination. I went to Miami of Ohio and Oxford was one of the coldest places in winter I have ever been. So, that said, consider the Cobra akin to a motorcycle with two seats, side by side. I think you will get the picture.

From what I can see, there are alot of owners of Cobras who are as fanatical as the previous owner of my car. So, take it from me, there are some really nice Cobras out there to pick from both new and previously owned.

I would caution you on one aspect of the replica. The modern replica is not an investment vehicle in the true sense of the word investment. Some of the parts/pieces in some Cobras are somewhat escalating in value (original 427 Side Oilers, 428 CJs) but frankly, the modern replica Cobra is meant to be driven and enjoyed. That said, some day down the road, should you ever tire of it, or whatever, you will probably be able to get most of you money out of it, assuming you maintain the car well.

So... should you buy one? Forget for a moment which one... that answer can only come from you. Yes there will be nagging doubts. Do I need this thing... God NO. None of us NEED the Cobra... but frankly, we all WANTED the Cobra...now that I have my ERA, I can say it was a great move....

Buying one is just a part of the ride... enjoy the process.

[Spyderman]

I know somebody on this list (not me) that needs to sell a small block ERA 289 style car...It is blue with black leather. He mentioned it to me today, so I thought I would pass it on.
On Cobras
The difference in what you pay, and what you could sell it for, might amount to $5000 either way(up/down). That is less than most medical treatments, many vacations, or the instant devaluation your boring company car took as you drove it out of the dealer's lot. This car may be a medical necessity, everybody deserves a vacation, and use that damn company car as a gas mule and spare parts !
The bottom line is: Continue to try to talk yourself out of it, and if unsuccessful, welcome to our little group.

[Excaliber]

http://www.clubcobra.com/forums/show...239#post462239

This 289 FIA car may or may not still be for sale. Really NICE 289 car, exceptional.

Ernie

[daltondavid]

Sweet low miles just built ERA FIA 289 body style with 351 W in the $40's over on cobracountry.com Car is in Rhode Island. Just what I am looking for when I figure out if The GT500 has to stay or go to aquire a COBRA.

[NeedAntiVenom]

Joe,

The FIAs are great cars, and Ernie had some great advice - do not start with a fire-breather. 300-350 HP is a lot for a 2200 pound car, and small blocks are very drivable. Handling is spectacular on my ERA.

These are not daily drivers, although you want to every day. When you're not behind the wheel you'll wish you were.

If you're buying a used one make sure you look at it carefully - especially who and how it was built. You can save 10-20K over the cost of a new one - but it may not be exactly what you want.

The undercar exhausts are NICE - great sound but no earplugs needed.

It is a great journey, enjoy every step.