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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 05-10-2009, 02:26 PM
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Default Help identifying 427 Side oiler block

I have acquired an original Holman and Moody 427 side oiler block with these markings: C5AE-G date code 5A8 HM number: H47M.

The block has 4 sleeves, and is standard bore. There are repairs to the block on both sides of one compartment down low near the oil pan, no involvement of the water jacket. Externally, the repairs are not visible at all.

Would these repairs make the block at any risk for failure going forward?

Anyone have an idea what its worth in the stated condition?
This is the earliest 427 side oiler block I know of. Anyone have one with an earlier date?
Anyone know the significance of the "47" in the HM number?

Jim
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Old 05-10-2009, 03:51 PM
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Jim;

Don't know a whole lot about the old 427 blocks, but a buddy drag races a 1000 hp big block Ford stroker motor based on the 460 block.... 4 or 5 years ago a rod broke in half (alum. rods) at 7,500 rpms,took out a piece of the block on both sides just above the oil pan about the size of a silver dollar or larger.They picked up all the pieces off the track and gave them to him in a box, he fit the broken pieces back in the block and welded it up and had to sleeve 2 cylinders, still running the same block today!!!!!!!!!!!

If the repairs were done properly, the block should be fine.... Worth???? have no idea..............

David
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Old 05-10-2009, 04:18 PM
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Jim,
Closest to that in my book in side oiler is C5AE-H from 1965-66
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Old 05-10-2009, 04:36 PM
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The production date is Jan. 5, 1968. Don't know the HM code.
INSIST ON A PRESSURE TEST AND TRY TO BE THERE TO WITNESS IT.
Regardless of the skill of the repair I would not use this at more than 400HP. Hits down near the pan rail mean the big chunks broke. Coupled with the possibility of porosity, that's a vulnerable area. Breaks to the water jackets or oil galleys are difficult to find. It may be fine for a 'correctness' motor but that's it.
It is surely not a good value or raw material to do a performance build. A better value and 'near correct' is a new Genesis iron block.
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Old 05-10-2009, 04:45 PM
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Thanks for the information. Anyone else have any thoughts/

Jim
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Old 05-10-2009, 04:54 PM
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Jim,

I emailed you, nice to talk tonight.

I also Pm'd you.

Jeff
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Old 05-10-2009, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toby View Post
Jim,
Closest to that in my book in side oiler is C5AE-H from 1965-66
I'm with Toby. None of my books have a "G", unless it's a '61-'62 390, otherwise I show nothing with a "G" in a BBF. Might want to verify that number, or maybe a special block not in the books???

Either way, I agree with all the other guys so far on this post.

Best of luck with it.
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Old 05-10-2009, 08:28 PM
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Hi Jim, interesting score. I think you'll find the pan rail repair is common on these motors. The one in the car here now has had that repair. It won't be a problem if it's been done properly. It was more a leaking problem than integrity anyway.
The later bores were squared off for strength on the water jacket or outside, the earlier ones like you have were round or concentric on ID to OD. With the improvements in metallurgy and machining tolerances if the sleeves have also been done correctly that will be no worries.
Cheers mate.
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Old 05-10-2009, 08:40 PM
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As to the HM number, Holman Moody put their serial number on all of their blocks. Jim
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Old 05-10-2009, 09:27 PM
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Check it out. Here are some pics from a shortblock I looked at buying here in Houston last fall. Showed to be a C5AE-G, casting date January 8, 1965, same date as yours. It was stamped HM138 in two places, which I would suspect meant Holman-Moody.

Very cool that they'd have the same date and no surprise that HM would have gotten the very first of the new castings. This particular engine had 4 sleeves and had then been bored to .030 over. It had definitely seen better days. Sorry for the poor focus, these were taken with my Blackberry because I didn't have my good camera with me.








Last edited by elmariachi; 05-10-2009 at 09:31 PM..
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Old 05-11-2009, 04:10 AM
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That reminds me, it is a lot more useful and valuable if it has the matching main bearing caps and spacers. Replacements can be sourced/made it will need line boring after assembly and spacers surface ground to fit.
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Old 05-11-2009, 07:16 AM
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I have a C5 AE-H block. I believe my block is on its last rebuild unless I sleeve it.

Just out of curiousity.... is this expensive/worth doing if needed?
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Old 05-11-2009, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by priobe View Post
I have a C5 AE-H block. I believe my block is on its last rebuild unless I sleeve it.

Just out of curiousity.... is this expensive/worth doing if needed?
Sleeving is not that expensive and IMHO, if done correctly, solidifies your block in terms of stability and longevity.
I had one of my SO blocks sleeved, reason being it had been bored out to the max, and I was concerned about the walls getting too skinny.
Ended up selling it to a guy that spruced it up to just under 600hp. Zero issues.
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Old 05-11-2009, 12:57 PM
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Jim, I note that someone stole the anchor for my Chris Craft over the winter. If you can deliver your chunk of iron to the boathouse, I think it might get used appropriately. Always happy to help...
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Old 05-11-2009, 04:19 PM
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Cool Holman-Moody article here.
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