"wet Paint" where should I order this stuff?

[Got the Bug]

Originally Posted by James Stern

DV, What is your opinion of the "Ice" products.

Jim

Some of the Turtlewax Ice products have silicone.

DV - I appreciate your feedback and expertise on the subject. So would you say that Wet Paint is worse or the same as any other spray detailer (Mother's, Meguiar's, etc.) that contains silicone?

[ERA Chas]

Originally Posted by raclaims

I use speed shine by Griot's garage...should I be concerned at all?

I too use this and have since the 90's. My paint is now 18 years old and would appreciate feedback on Griots. Also Zaino's products were highly regarded in the 90's but you don't see much any more. Any thoughts on them?

[FUNFER2]

This is a subject that all of us can learn from. We need to get some absolute answers from these company's !

I'm a auto body man and if I know that the person that brought in their car to be painted, wither it's a touch up to all out full body, if he's used silicone on the paint, I have a lot,..... of wiping the car down with wax remover. It's a *****, to get it all cleaned off to ready for paint. I HATE SILICONE.

Those of you that use a product that has this nasty chemical, it builds up fast. I recommend striping it off every year and put a good coat of carnauba wax. As we don't have our cobras a daily driver, only one application is necessary.

If anyone would like to ask questions about detailing, please do so vis email or phone call. I've built many show cars through the years and I think, a wise mans advise, as far as keeping your paint in tip top condition.

As an example of what silicone can do to your finish-

My brother in law tried to do his best to get my sister surprised as he cleaned their the interior with Armorall. He thought it looked great so, he decided to wipe down the paint and said it looked very nice and shinny !
The next morning, the paint was ruined !!!
It looked so bad, my sister was crying, as the car was only 6 months old. Well, I made him wipe down the car with a remover three times !
I then sanded the entire car and repainted it.

He learned a good lesson on this one !

Don't even use silicone products on you vinyl or rubber (on tires too) Have you looked at tires that has a silicone base ?. They will turn brown and you'll loose that natural black new look. Just use a good leather cream.

[efnfast]

stuff with silicone in it is "fine" to use, but all you're doing is covering up imperfections. basically you're wasting your time, becasue rather than keeping your paint in proper condition, you're just filling in damage (that will, overtime, disappear and you'll be back at square 1 - actually, less than square 1, because if you've got damage (Swirls, marring, etc...) that become hidden, you're probably inducing more in the meantime)

Originally Posted by FUNFER2

As an example of what silicone can do to your finish-

My brother in law tried to do his best to get my sister surprised as he cleaned their the interior with Armorall. He thought it looked great so, he decided to wipe down the paint and said it looked very nice and shinny !
The next morning, the paint was ruined !!!
It looked so bad, my sister was crying, as the car was only 6 months old. Well, I made him wipe down the car with a remover three times !
I then sanded the entire car and repainted it.

He learned a good lesson on this one !

That's got nothing to do with silicone - it's got to do with a moron using a product clearly not meant for clearcoat.

I might as well buy 3 cans of laquer thinner and pour it on my hood, then say anything that's liquid in nature is bad for clearcoat.

[Double Venom]

No it is not "Officially" ok to use!

Per "JIM PEFFERS" PHD Chemistry", over 35 years in the field and still going at it. i.e.; 'Chemical Abstracts' (World wide institution!), Columbus. Oh.

Per Jim and I paraphase, Silicone and its by products do NOT damage anything, "It is the results of repeatedly using it that can be harmfull!"
That is why the spray for tires to make them shiny will eventually turn the wheels a dirty brn. Silicone does EXACTLY WHAT THEY SAY IT WILL DO, SEAL the surface- (not allowing it to breath! When it comes to CAR paint it is exceptional at this. The surface needs to breath, expand, contract and let the paint chemicals to be released through the surface! This proccess can take years!

If enough of silicone product is applied over time the results are invariable! The surface (regarding paint finishes) will do/show one or all the listed; crack, dull the paint to infinity, put a 'haze' on the paint that will have to be somehow removed. (Clay, rubbing coumpound, wet sanding, etc., etc.)

Three professional 'car show' builders/painters have all agreed on the use of Silicone! That in itself is amazing, I honestly can't believe that three or four of us would agree on anything! But Silicone I can!

There is NOT a single professional rubbing coumpound used in any body shop that has silicone in it that I know of.

PER "MAGUIRES" they use it so it makes some of their products to be applied and removed easier. Sorry Maguires, it has been a good relationship, now I will have to read your labels too.

Jim.....et.al., If a product uses any silicone in their produst- I DO NOT KNOWINGLY USE IT ON MY CUSTOMERS CARS!
I went into my shop, grabbed the first box/can that I could find and this was on the back!



This product is approved for and used by custom interior people and the airlines! Even they wont use a Silicone product!

An hour at least went by before I could finallly post the picture! Soooo, there it is, use at your own discretion!

And yes, ZAINO is an awesome product! (It was developed years ago for the Viper guys.)

DV

[joe g]

I used wet paint for 6 years, saw no problem with it. Car shined as good OR better than new. Every fall i would use a warm bucket of dish soap to strip off any build up while is it was parked for most of the winter.
joeg

[Snakebit]

Zaino Brothers products contian no silicone!

[Tony Radford]

I've been a big believer in Zaino since I purchased my car 7 years ago. It may be a bit more tedious to apply than some of the the others, but the results are magnificant. You can talk to Sal on the phone and he'll tell you what ever you want to know. He's very passionate about his products. My car looks like it did when I bought it. Check out some of the pics in my gallery.

[JB in Alabama]

it made the cobra so shiny that i did a door on my brides black mercedes ml300.

WOW! the difference in the finish is simply amazing.
I cant beleive i didnt know about this already (thanks Joe G)

Since joe used it on this cobra for several years, I cant see it being a problem as some have mentioned.

[Double Venom]

Sorry to repeat myslef, BUT...it does exactly as it says it does! No body said it didn't create a shine.
OK, I'm off, time to turn the 'Soap Box' over!
DV

[DocDirk]

Here's an interesting link to an article by one of Meguiar's tech specialists regarding silicone in today's car car products:

http://www.meguiarsonline.com/forums...?t=7368&page=2

They allege it was a problem with the older paint technologies but not in the modern world of paint and paint surface care.

Dirk

[CobraDan]

The Role Silicone Plays in Car Care Products

http://www.autopia.org/forum/detaili...-products.html

Mike Phillips
Technical Training Specialist
Meguiar's Inc.

[RodgerH]

Originally Posted by FUNFER2

Don't even use silicone products on you vinyl or rubber (on tires too) Have you looked at tires that has a silicone base ?. They will turn brown and you'll loose that natural black new look. Just use a good leather cream.

Kevin,
I'm not getting into the "is silicon good or bad for modern paint finishes" debate, but I will add some facts to your statement about the reason tires turn brown.

The brown surface color is actually the result of antiozonants that are added to rubber when tires are manufactured. (It is also often re-applied to commercial truck tires when they are retreaded.) The purpose is to create a chemical barrier on the surface of the rubber to protect the rubber from deterioration caused by some components of our atmosphere, primarily oxygen and ozone.

Here's an article that explains it in detail; it's a patent for a process utilizing polymers to minimize this brown coloring.
http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/65...scription.html

Pretty heavy reading, but skip to the 4th paragraph for an explanation of the brown coloring.

To say it short, this brown coloring will happen even if you put nothing on the tires. It's caused by the antiozonants coating the surface to protect the rubber. Actually a good thing.

Rodger

[efnfast]

Originally Posted by CobraDan

The Role Silicone Plays in Car Care Products

http://www.autopia.org/forum/detaili...-products.html

Mike Phillips
Technical Training Specialist
Meguiar's Inc.

^^^ That's a good, simple explanation for msot to read.

There seems to be a pattern on CC about detailing though - people don't know sh@t about proper detailing.............might be because a lot of people on here are old farts who're stuck in the 50/60s way of painting with lead and whatnot

[TButtrick]

Silicone is harmful to paint when applied with 100 grit sand paper.

[lovehamr]

Originally Posted by TButtrick

Silicone is harmful to paint when applied with 100 grit sand paper.

BaaHaaaaaaaaaaaaa

[JB in Alabama]

Doggoneit.....I wish someone would have told me that before I tried it

[Slick61]

Mike Phillips is an excellent detailer... and a heckuva nice guy. Have attended several of his detailing clinics down at the Meguiars Headquarters in Irvine. The Mikes (Phillips & Pennington) have a passion for detailing, which really comes through in their Saturday Detailing Classes. If you haven't attended one, I highly recommend them (good pizza too!) Their advanced detailing class is offerred less often & therefore harder to get into, but carries things a step farther (wet-sanding, rotary work, etc.), and is also very worthwhile.

[CBattaglia]

I called the wet paint guys. They said that it does contain silicone but promised that it is not harmful even over time. (as i expected) He also said that they buffed in a substantial amount of the product then painted right over it to disprove the fish eye problem would occur. They have never had a claim filed against them for damaging or discoloring a finish.

After reading all of the posts in this thread, I am still a bit skeptical. The McGuires article made me feel confident that I didnt do a bad thing to my car after only one application.

It seems like the jury is still out on this product. I will use it on my older daily drivers and maybe on the cobra right before a big show....Maybe.

[efnfast]

Originally Posted by CBattaglia

I called the wet paint guys. They said that it does contain silicone but promised that it is not harmful even over time. (as i expected) He also said that they buffed in a substantial amount of the product then painted right over it to disprove the fish eye problem would occur. They have never had a claim filed against them for damaging or discoloring a finish.

After reading all of the posts in this thread, I am still a bit skeptical. The McGuires article made me feel confident that I didnt do a bad thing to my car after only one application.

It seems like the jury is still out on this product. I will use it on my older daily drivers and maybe on the cobra right before a big show....Maybe.

You didn't do any harm to your paint. Half the LSPs I know contain silicone....don't listen to most people on here about detailing

I havn't tried it, but just from glancing at the site it looks like it's just going to (temporarily) fill in swirls and scratches and whatnot. A better treatment would be proper cleaning, polishing as needed, and a nice application of wax every few months.