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December 2017
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Kirkham Motorsports

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Old 06-03-2017, 03:26 PM
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Default KMP259 Coming to life

It's been a while since KMP259 has been out and about.... So we started getting it ready (as much as we could afford) to go out and strech it's legs.

Here Sean is Evacuating the oil out of the Dry Sump Tank.... This one of the best tools I ever bought.... not only can you see what is coming out of your vehicle ... but you can actually see how dirty or get a sample to send to Black Stone Labs.





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Old 06-03-2017, 03:35 PM
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Here Bill is installing our Chassis Torsional Plates..... We have to install all 70 1/4 x 28 AN bolts, then tighten them to pull up the plate flat..... then each bolt has to come out and get Lock-tite Blue then go back in and get torqued to 120"inch pounds.

We have to install both plates and they get tied together in the middle and at the front they get tied to the Splitter....

But the Torsional Rigidity of the chassis goes up a 100 times. Which means the suspension works like it's suppose to .... no twisting of the chassis...

It is a lot of work to go thru... but well worth it on a track....







If you look close you can see some of the bottom of the cage we built into KMP259
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Last edited by Morris; 06-03-2017 at 07:22 PM..
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Old 06-03-2017, 03:51 PM
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Here you can see where the plate ends at the Diff and the Fuel Cell begins..the angle of the Fuel Cell is 8*degrees in case we want to put sides on it and make a channel for the air to exit...




Now Look real close at the diff.... not only do we use a Temperature gauge with a probe in the rear end to tell the temperature.... but we verify with the Templac temperature labels..... you can see we are running around 230*degrees last time out and that was verified with our gauge reading right.... That was when we switched to Mobil 1 75w140 GL-5 Gear Oil....

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Old 06-03-2017, 04:10 PM
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Morris,

Looks great! I am sad that I will not be able to see KMP259 on the track at SAAC. But if I am to have a remote chance of making Mid Ohio on June 22 I am going to have to put every hour that I can into getting my car ready. Your car is a thing of beauty and very well engineered.

Enjoy Indy, one of these days I will be there.

Take care, and thanks for all the sage advice.

Jim
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Old 06-03-2017, 05:19 PM
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That was when we switched to Mobil 1 75w140 GL-5 Gear Oil....
Very nice Morris....what was the difference in Temp reading once switched?
Ross
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Old 06-03-2017, 05:55 PM
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Very nice. Interesting find on the diff lube vs temp. What were you using before and what temp did you see?
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Old 06-03-2017, 07:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Riverside racer View Post
That was when we switched to Mobil 1 75w140 GL-5 Gear Oil....
Very nice Morris....what was the difference in Temp reading once switched?
Ross
We tested Pennzoil 75w140......Valvoline 75w140.....Redline 75w140.......and Mobil1 75w140, Synthetic gear oil in the diff......

Mobil1 was 25*- 30*degrees cooler then any of the others.....also it was. Very hot day....about 90*degrees......

We run a Quaiffe Differential so gear contact is very important to us....and we also use a cooler and filter on both the diff and trans to control the heat.

Hope that helps.
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Old 06-04-2017, 04:59 AM
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Morris,

Those are great pictures and I hope that you do well and have a great time. It is about time that you got back on the track and had some fun. Best wishes.

Ron
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Old 06-04-2017, 05:25 AM
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Morris,

Fantastic news. It will be great to see that amazing car back on the track.
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Old 06-05-2017, 11:15 AM
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Great to hear you are taking her out and letting her stretch her legs. Good for you Morris!
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Old 12-03-2017, 07:23 AM
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Love to hear more!

What is your take on temperature in general since much less air can now escape under the car? You may need to add some NACA ducts in the plate and/or openings with "Gurney" flaps.
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Old 12-03-2017, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
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Love to hear more!

What is your take on temperature in general since much less air can now escape under the car? You may need to add some NACA ducts in the plate and/or openings with "Gurney" flaps.
Dominik

Temperature and heat are your worst enemy when operating on the race track.....I should say, control of heat and temperature Are your biggest challenges......when the air under the car is reduced via a air dam and you extend the plates under the vehicle for torsional rigidity like we did.....then the air above the car has to travel farther and faster over the car......then you get lift......

To combat that lift, you need the splitter below the air dam to give you some down force on the nose of the vehicle, and once you put down force on the nose .....you have to balance the vehicle with a wing on the rear of the vehicle.

This also creates the issue of what do you do with the air coming in thru the radiator opening.....normally that air comes in the engine compartment and exits out the wheel wells area and under the vehicle.

In our case we closed off the bottom of the car with our Torsional Plates.....and knowing that the air vents on the side of the front fenders donít evacuate any air out of the engine compartment .......

We had to put vents on the hood in the right location so they would evacuate the hot air in the engine compartment.....in addition, we turned the scoop around and by not extending it to the windshield we created a low pressure area at the end of the scoop so the air could come out at that location as well....

That is why at 185mph on the track....we donít get any lift on our front end.....

Also if you look close at our Torsional plates on the bottom of the car we have screen areas to evacuate any air that is coming down the tunnel.....and with a low pressure area under the chassis the air flows Thur a transmission cooler mounted horizontally on the plates so we use that air to cool our transmission fluid as well.....

Sorry for the long post.....but itís a long explanation......
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Old 12-03-2017, 09:41 PM
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Thanks for the long explanation!

My experience is reduced to having worked on a friend's Group-C and his M8F in Germany. But those cars were purpose-built for racing and you get a much better starting point for aerodynamics and temperature management.

Occasionally I have a closer look at the racing BDR Cobra, because I am at the factory from time to time.

Where do I find more pics of your car? In the endless built-up thread from a while back?
I need to look it up.
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Old 12-04-2017, 11:18 AM
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Dominik

I went thru many changes after we built the car.....

Talk@CobraRegistry.com

As you may or may not know, when you get on the track and go up to speed......you realize changes that need to be made by monitoring the heat ranges and reactions the vehicle makes. Then you go back to the car and start changing the many items in order to return to the track.

Above is where I started a thread on talk@cobra registry where did start making changes....for example we put 3 different oil coolers on the front before we found the one the kept our oil temp under control.......we changed 3 different filter systems until we found one we liked.....and 2 different power steering systems before we liked the way KMP259 reaction time was right.

These are the things people should be doing to their cars before they really start driving them on the street......but most are just happy to have them done in their mind.....not so....because they then find out later what works and what doesn’t work....

You may have to join the site to see all of the photo’s.....but it is well worth joining.....

Thanks for your inquiry and ask all the questions as it’s time for me to pass on info to the younger folks to help them perform safely.
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Old 12-04-2017, 12:09 PM
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You won't find a better build thread and description than what Morris has posted. I have tried to get him to write a book about it as it is excellent. And I learned a lot from him and that thread. So if you are really into making a car better for racing it is a great one to read.

Ron
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Old 12-04-2017, 08:41 PM
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Hello Ron, hello Morris!

I just signed up. The built-up thread back then was awesome. My problem then was when you didn't read up about it daily you lost track. And finding something from a while back became very tedious. Especially with a slow connection which I suffered from many years here in SA.

Build thread like that, as well as "The butcher's" 10 years ago and Kirkham's $1mio build (lately CSX3170) make me come back to the site.

I know from watching an old race car builder a lot (and helping him a bit) that you must constantly change things to make them work on the track.

He has '72 McLaren since 1975, which, looking back, shows what genius Bruce was. The Can-Am cars are so simple but efficient. The other genius, of course, is Jim Hall. He was just a bit too experimental to win often enough.

I don't want to mention Porsche... They saw, came and conquered...

A book would be great! I would add it to my C. Smith range.

Wasn't there a printer on this site? ;-)
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Old 12-05-2017, 04:16 AM
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I thought that there used to be one but I am not sure. With all of the pictures and really great explanations that Morris gives I think a book would be great and I would certainly get one.

Ron
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Old 12-05-2017, 09:07 AM
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Your car looks great Morris I am glad you are bringing it out again a beautifully engineered Cobra for sure!
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Old 12-05-2017, 01:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobra #3170 View Post
Your car looks great Morris I am glad you are bringing it out again a beautifully engineered Cobra for sure!
Thanks Bruce .... Coming from you means a lot....I remember talking to the guy's at Kinetics (Chris and Dennis) about you and your car..... and the Blue Prints of the Cobra in that side room, that was a real kick...

I don't have the latest in Technology in KMP259 anymore.... and we ran out of money .... but we still have many idea's to try..... and I like helping others now since I had a lot of help when I was coming up thru the Ranks of SCCA and then IMSA.... and yes I'm very lucky to be the Stewart of KMP259 for now and someone .....one day will appreciate all of the idea's we've put into that Vehicle, much like you have done with #3170.....They are just special vehicles and we both have advanced them beyond what Carroll ever thought of.... and I love just hanging out with KMP259.... we do enjoy time spent together ..... although we beat on her sometimes and so far she has responded in a great way.
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