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February 2020
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2020, 07:10 AM
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Default What's it worth

Looks like an Arntz car. Build 10-79.
I'll do a few posts in order to get a few pictures.
Arntz/Butler Frame - #154
VIN# - 2209759
Date of Manufacture - 10/1979

Engine:
1978 W-351 (40 over and balanced)
GT40 Heads (ported)
Stainless Steel Valves
Double Springs
Quick Fuel Carburetor
Offenhauser 360 Intake
Flame Thrower Electronic Distributor

Cooling:
Griffin Race Radiator

Drivetrain:
Luk Clutch 07-913
Tilton Hydraulic Release Bearing
WC T5 Transmission
Custom Drive Shaft

Rear Suspension:
Jaguar Series 1
3.54 Gears
Inboard Brakes
QA1 Coil Over Shocks

Front Suspension:
MGB
Disc Brakes (cross-drilled, with Ceramic Pads)
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Last edited by scregan; 01-28-2020 at 07:57 AM..
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Old 01-28-2020, 07:36 AM
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Try this link for more pictures
https://drive.google.com/drive/u/0/f...vbc7lFQVEtF1cm
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Old 01-29-2020, 07:24 AM
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$26000-$31000
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Old 01-29-2020, 08:43 AM
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This looks like a nice build, are Arntz Cobras just not worth much?
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Old 01-29-2020, 09:34 AM
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I wouldn't put a $ price on it, but it is not a Superformance or ERA worthy price. Ultimately when a seller and a buyer arrives at a number that they are both willing to make a deal on, then that is what it will sell for. In reality one or the other likely didn't get a good deal.

Things to consider:
The Jag rear end is a big plus for originality.
I think they have a round tube frame. That is a plus for originality.
The body and paint looks good.
1979 was a long time ago. 41 years are not kind to cars.
351W is pretty vanilla today. Today it could be stroked to over 400 cid for the same money.
The heads on the engine were likely good head in 1979, but bottom shelf today.
T-5 Transmissions are ok for mild engines like it has, but much better can be had today.
I would expect the engine is around 350 Hp.
The MG front end was used a lot back in 79. Not so much today. I cannot say how good or bad they were.
Today most use coil over shocks. I believe it to be superior. Certainly easily adjusted.
Today most put disk brakes on all 4 wheels.
I think you will find the Gas cap in the center of the car sucks.

Finding parts for a no longer manufactured car and little documentation on what parts were used will be no fun, and with the age of the car your likely do this a lot. So on the one hand it may be built better than the average FFR (that may be a stretch), but a FFR has a ton of support around it. You will be on your own. You should factor all this in and ask yourself how well are you equipped to handle this.

PS
The engine is already punched out 0.040". That is typically the maximum. Next rebuild the block is likely a boat anchor.

I guess it does have disks so you can strike that off the list.

Last edited by olddog; 01-29-2020 at 09:50 AM.. Reason: PS
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Old 01-29-2020, 09:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by olddog View Post
1979 was a long time ago. 41 years are not kind to cars.
On the other hand this is a good candidate for some of those looking for cars to import to Europe.
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Old 01-30-2020, 04:46 AM
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Olddog has a pretty good synopsis of the car. A few added things:

The frame is square, although it is probably one of the heaviest frames around.
The MG front end can easily be replaced with one from FAST. Not exactly cheap, but it will do wonders for the car in both handling and weight reduction.
Most Arntz Cobras had Chevy engines. That is probably one of the reasons for the value reduction.
Parts are pretty generic like all Cobras. I bought a hood from Mr. Bruce and it fit with a small amount of modifying. The car was splashed off an original Cobra, so it isn't massively different than most other Cobras.
The hoop is a bit of a value reducer and where the gas inlet is located.
The Type III cars probably bring the most. You can tell them by the drip rail on the fenders where the hood closes. The Type II and Type I do not have a drip rail.
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Old 01-30-2020, 08:40 AM
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If the gas cap is any indication that the tank is vertically mounted directly below, filling is SO much easier and faster than the elongated "S" inlet on most 427SC body styles. You can see right down into the tank while you are filling it, get it 99%+ full with no slosh back and spillage. I've seen lots of guys with the other style have to "milk" theirs to get it full.
my 2¢ worth.
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Old 01-30-2020, 10:16 PM
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Karl,

Your point on function may be true. I never questioned that in my mind. I was thinking three things.

One, more risk of dripping gasoline on the paint.

Two, if you ever have to put gasoline in from a can it is going to be a back breaker, and reaching over it at a gas station might be a bit much for many older backs.

Three, if a defective nozzle fails to turn off, fuel may go into the passenger compartment.
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Old 02-04-2020, 02:50 AM
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Scregan, did you buy it? Looks like a lovely old car, and a solid base to update/refresh as you wish and as time and budget allows.

The market seems hotter for more recent ERA, Superformance, BDR etc, with a lot of people thinking that old equals less desirable. I’m sure there are many Arntz and other “built in the 70s and 80s Cobra replica owners who appreciate the true style of patina that can only be generated by seat time over many years. I had an Arntz, Dad still has an Arntz, and now I have an early Contemporary. All have their own charm specifically because they have decades of history behind them.

The one you’ve posted is a cool car and has some great character, but like olddog mentioned, the value of the car will be influenced by the relatively low spec of this particular build.
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Old 02-04-2020, 05:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 750hp View Post
Scregan, did you buy it? Looks like a lovely old car, and a solid base to update/refresh as you wish and as time and budget allows.

The market seems hotter for more recent ERA, Superformance, BDR etc, with a lot of people thinking that old equals less desirable. I’m sure there are many Arntz and other “built in the 70s and 80s Cobra replica owners who appreciate the true style of patina that can only be generated by seat time over many years. I had an Arntz, Dad still has an Arntz, and now I have an early Contemporary. All have their own charm specifically because they have decades of history behind them.

The one you’ve posted is a cool car and has some great character, but like olddog mentioned, the value of the car will be influenced by the relatively low spec of this particular build.
Love the looks of the car. Paint & upholstry were done by the best in the area. Build was recently completed and only has ~300 miles on it.
Owner is pretty firm at $47,500 for the car & that's too much, so I passed on the car.
I'll sell my Nomad in the spring & start looking again.
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Old 02-04-2020, 05:57 AM
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Good choice. A new build of an old kit puts the car into a weird little niche. No doubt the owner will have spent some money on it recently, so I hope they eventually find a seller who is happy to pay somewhere near the asking price.
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