Cobras wanted for V8 Supercars Drivers Parade at Homebush.

[Merv and Sharon]

I don't know Ash. I did go to the Bathurst, Lakeside, Sandown, etc., races back then and well before. It was great with all the various classes of car. Car racing history, is largely based on the class divisions and the chance to perform within groups, such as the Cobra/ Ferrari battle in the then GT class. Like many of my friends I now find the "Commodore"/"Falcon" Supercar thing really standardised and boring and the ones raced have only badge relationships with the cars one could buy. I am not suggesting Camry hybrids (surely the worst car I have ever driven!) but why not encourage, or at least allow, some Nissan, Audi or Mercedes involvement? Even Golf GTI's could be great to watch in class battles with similar capacity vehicles.

[Towmaster]

That same racing still happens now in the GT racing and the improved production racing class. That is basically what the cars were back in the day, improved production cars. Chances are you can go and watch them race for about $20 at Queensland raceway or Morgan park. The thing is not many people do... V8 supercars is basically a one make series with 2 different engines & body shapes only. Why is no one calling for other cars to race in the Porsche challenge? It's the same old story, someone sticks their neck out with a concept then someone else wants in with a slice of the pie when it succeeds. I agree we need all different types of racing, But why should they change it at the risk of losing our identity ie the holden / ford traditional rivalry. Toyota have been trying to buy into it for years, with great, but boring cars.

[Gav]

I really enjoy the V8 supercars. They are evenly matched, producing close racing.
At the same time the muscle car racing is awesome, with different cars having advantages at different tracks.

But at the end of the day, if you don't like em', don't watch em'.

[Towmaster]

Originally Posted by Gav

I really enjoy the V8 supercars. They are evenly matched, producing close racing.
At the same time the muscle car racing is awesome, with different cars having advantages at different tracks.

But at the end of the day, if you don't like em', don't watch em'.

Yep! Correct! I was at Bathurst this year on the top of the mountain and there was no shortage of Holden and Ford supporters..

As I have said there are plenty of types of racing where Toyotas race against Nissan's and Audi's and BMW's and REx's and Evo's. There is only one series where V8's of the GM and Ford variety battle it out and that is the Cobra Nationals and Shelbyfest.......

[Dimis]

I find V8 supercar mostly redundant... Other than the badge there is little to nothing that keeps them relevant to today's production cars.

One of two things would need to happen before it attracts my attention.

1) Use the category to develop (young) local talent in automotive development. ie engineering, fabrication, drivers etc & then race cars that are more like what is produced & sold to consumers, rather than some highly modify vehicle with a badge on it.

&/or

2) Widen the race tracks...
With most tracks built many many years ago, today's cars have just out grown them, the cars are too big, too fast & too wide, producing boring racing.
It appears that most the corners on most the tracks have only 1 to 1.5 racing lines through them. With the cars so wide it makes passing impossible. I'm not interested in watching that. Widen the tracks so there are 2 and 3 racing line options, which should encourage some criss-cross overtaking, and some counter overtaking.

[Wazza]

I like the V8 Supercars because it is more about the driver.

i.e. The cars are almost the same and the Ford / Holden thing is a bit of fun....but the skills and heart of the better drivers show through.

My 2c worth.

Probably my favourite racing to watch on T.V. is the British Touring Car Champs....Geez they get stuck in.

Cheers,
Warren.

[Baz]

My point here is reinforced in Aussie Mikes Thread (See Super Car Question on this Forum - Episode 12 on You Tube) where Mark Dutton, Race Engineer for Holden talks on the engines used in the Holden V8 Supercars. The block used is from GM Motorsport and is not offered for sale to the general public. It can therefore be assumed that the engines used by Ford are also not available for sale to the general public. More than likely they are a product that are designed by the Ford Performance Racing Engineering Department.

How can they then say that a Cobra with a compliant LS GM 6 litre motor can't particpate in the Driver's Parade because it's not running a Ford engine?

I'm still scratching my head on this decision.

After watching Aussie Mikes 'You Tube' Thread on 'Super Car Question' I am now firmly convinced that the only thing Ford Falcons and Holden Commodores V8 Supercars possess in similarity with the original production vehicles are the body shapes and that's all.

[Tenrocca]

Baz, they dont give a F**k that you have a compliant engine. They wanted fords for the ford drivers parade. Yes, most people wouldnt know what was under the hood.

Scenario: Ford driver asks cobra driver what is under the hood, "overly boastful full of his own self importance and wants to crap on about stuff like what breed of cow was used to make his seats" cobra driver skites about having a holden. Ford driver feels a bit pissed off his parade car isnt even a Ford makes a bit of a fuss.

Yes it sucks if you are the driver described above, but it does make a bit of sense.

[Baz]

Originally Posted by Wazza

I like the V8 Supercars because it is more about the driver.

i.e. The cars are almost the same and the Ford / Holden thing is a bit of fun....but the skills and heart of the better drivers show through.

My 2c worth.

Probably my favourite racing to watch on T.V. is the British Touring Car Champs....Geez they get stuck in.

Cheers,
Warren.

Warren,

I first started going to Bathurst back in the 60's when the Geoghegans, Muirs, Weldon's etc., were racing their early model Holdens around the Mountain. Watching Pete Geoghegan in the 'Black Knight' The Leaton Motors Team of Matich in the Lotus 15 and Chivas in the D Type Jag were untouchable. Then we had the Jags. Mini's, Galaxies, Monaros and Mustangs. Far more exciting to watch than present day saloon racing.

[BJ's Snake]

Originally Posted by Tenrocca

Baz, they dont give a F**k that you have a compliant engine. They wanted fords for the ford drivers parade. Yes, most people wouldnt know what was under the hood.

Scenario: Ford driver asks cobra driver what is under the hood, "overly boastful full of his own self importance and wants to crap on about stuff like what breed of cow was used to make his seats" cobra driver skites about having a holden. Ford driver feels a bit pissed off his parade car isnt even a Ford makes a bit of a fuss.

Yes it sucks if you are the driver described above, but it does make a bit of sense.

Love your work Andrew
Cheers

[Merv and Sharon]

Originally Posted by Baz

Warren,

I first started going to Bathurst back in the 60's when the Geoghegans, Muirs, Weldon's etc., were racing their early model Holdens around the Mountain. Watching Pete Geoghegan in the 'Black Knight' The Leaton Motors Team of Matich in the Lotus 15 and Chivas in the D Type Jag were untouchable.

I am beginning to suspect that it is a generational thing Baz. We may have to do with Goodwood and Classic Le Mans for variety ... Most these days have not really seen anything different from the self anointed 'Super cars' and the old Ford/Holden thing in Australia.

[Baz]

Originally Posted by Merv and Sharon

I am beginning to suspect that it is a generational thing Baz. We may have to do with Goodwood and Classic Le Mans for variety ... Most these days have not really seen anything different from the self anointed 'Super cars' and the old Ford/Holden thing in Australia.

I feel sorry for those who haven't expeienced it Merv. They don't know what they missed.


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[Philm]

Baz,
Is the photo with the light green humpy at Catallina?

Phil

[Baz]

Originally Posted by Philm

Baz,
Is the photo with the light green humpy at Catallina?

Phil

Spot on Phil. That was the old Pit area adjacent to the 'Start / Finish line. It's a shame Catalina closed down. Excitement plus to watch the races as a spectator from most vantage spots, you could virtually see all the track action. It was also a most challenging track for the drivers.



Max Stahl's early model Holden at Catalina Park, Katoomba.


It's hard to believe that Leo Geoghegan held the lap record for years from 1966 in a Lotus 39 at 55.7 seconds. Wow.

From memory, I think it was Lex Davidson who had been driving Sir Gawain Bailee's 2 door 7 litre Galaxy when he put it through the fence at Sandown.


Baz

[Mrs flatchat]

.... and the black humpy with the "special" heads - very rare Repco cross flow

[Baz]

Originally Posted by Mrs flatchat

.... and the black humpy with the "special" heads - very rare Repco cross flow

Spot on too Yve. Those heads were specially built for the 'Black Knight' grey motor. Waggot's later produced a twin overhead cam cross flow head for the grey block also.


Baz

[Philm]

Baz,
Did you ever attend the Silverdale Hill climb?

If you did would love to see some photos.

I have heard they are to re open the track as an alternative exit in an emergency.

Phil

[Baz]

Originally Posted by Philm

Baz,
Did you ever attend the Silverdale Hill climb?

If you did would love to see some photos.

I have heard they are to re open the track as an alternative exit in an emergency.

Phil

I spent quite a few hours going through old records for you Phil and have come up with these few gems of Silverdale. Most of these are from the the mid 60's.











url=http://www.clubcobra.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/77961][/url]







Also check out the photo I found of Max Stahl in his early model Holden up on two weels at Catalina Park on page 5 of this thread.


Baz

[Philm]

Fantastic Baz,
I apprecate you taking the time.

Great shots, just think I am about 500mtrs from the end of that hill climb track as I type this response.

Phil

[Merv and Sharon]

Great photos Baz and such a variety of cars. Is that a Milano? The one that looks like a Daytona?