Fast xfi 2.0

[Rog246]

Has anyone tried using the relatively new FAST XFI system on a Ford modular or GM LS engine ?
Am considering buying one and running it - if its usable.
Any comments/suggestions that are physically possible (LOL) would be useful

[dave295]

Hi Rog

The FAST setup is two grand plus. I have no comment on its performance. Another system I stumbled accross the other day is the FITECH efi for about a thousand dollars. It appears to be similar to the FAST system. I'll wait for others to comment on that.

Cheers
Dave

[Rog246]

Thanks Dave

Anymore comments ?

[fordracing65]

Fitech is self learning. The xfi is stand alone. Night and day difference.

[fordracing65]

Self learning is crap read the reviews with a big cam. The xfi will run any engine you want. Just like oem.

[spdbrake]

I think I understand what your after as your are considering a transplant or crate motor. Also not trying to pitch the intake and injector system the comes on the engines.
In which case you only need the XFI interface and controller.

http://www.fuelairspark.com/fas/xfi-...yote-5-0lhtml/

http://www.fuelairspark.com/fas/xfit...6-currenthtml/

These to do come with several tables pre-installed and user selectable and just like the Holley/Atomic/FiTech and will self tune to some extent. Fine tuning on a dyno can be complied with but usually not required unless you want to eek out some extra HP.

Some folks feel EFI daunting and can spout a lot of rhetoric and "I've read this on a forum".

Personally I love Self learning EFI as I have an FiTech and won't go back to the Holley 4150HP at least on this car. I'm not qualified to judge the merits or failing of systems I don't own or have not worked on.

I'd check out the FAST forums and you will probably get the best 1st hand feedback there from real users.
CPG Nation Forum

[fordracing65]

You don't have a radical cam so self learning will work ok.

[spdbrake]

Possibly, I'm not sure as I don't have my build specs. I only know its a flat tappet. It pulls 9" of vac @ 15deg idle which seems to be its happiest setting for vac/timing -2 deg. So I'm using stage 4 for initial EFI setup which runs quite a bit better than the Stage 3 settings. Once I change the Intake manifold (Super Victor 4000-8500) to an (RPM 1500-6500) it should be mucho better for my needs.

I'm slowly debugging it here and there.

It would be great if you could link the reviews on Big cam and EFI self learning systems are mismatch. I may need to rethink my next cam profile as I'll eventually go to a Hyd roller.
I did a ton of research prior to purchasing the FiTech and read reviews on all the major systems tested by Hod Rod, Mustangs and Fast Fords, CarCraft , and others and I've never come across any warnings.
Now I have read here and there folks having issues in setup and tuning on every system out there but that is on the forums and not professionals. I typ attribute those to the same people having a hard time with their AOL email, having their Grandkids download apps for them.

Thanks in advance.

[fordracing65]

I have noticed from various forums the big cube big blocks with radical cams don't do well with self learn efi. We have a couple efi shops in az that won't even mess with the self learning stuff. And all these shops do is race cars with efi.

[Rog246]

Now I have read here and there folks having issues in setup and tuning on every system out there but that is on the forums and not professionals. I typ attribute those to the same people having a hard time with their AOL email, having their Grandkids download apps for them.


mate that's GOLD
They also have trouble doing up the buttons on their pyjamas !!

[fordracing65]

Originally Posted by spdbrake

Possibly, I'm not sure as I don't have my build specs. I only know its a flat tappet. It pulls 9" of vac @ 15deg idle which seems to be its happiest setting for vac/timing -2 deg. So I'm using stage 4 for initial EFI setup which runs quite a bit better than the Stage 3 settings. Once I change the Intake manifold (Super Victor 4000-8500) to an (RPM 1500-6500) it should be mucho better for my needs.

I'm slowly debugging it here and there.

It would be great if you could link the reviews on Big cam and EFI self learning systems are mismatch. I may need to rethink my next cam profile as I'll eventually go to a Hyd roller.
I did a ton of research prior to purchasing the FiTech and read reviews on all the major systems tested by Hod Rod, Mustangs and Fast Fords, CarCraft , and others and I've never come across any warnings.
Now I have read here and there folks having issues in setup and tuning on every system out there but that is on the forums and not professionals. I typ attribute those to the same people having a hard time with their AOL email, having their Grandkids download apps for them.

Thanks in advance.

Of course those magazines will give good reviews. They are paid to play. You really think hot rod mag is going to bash a product. I have never seen a product revieved by these publications that does that. Only praise. Do a search here. There are many threads on self learning efi. Not saying they can't work but nothing compared to a multi port system.

[fordracing65]

Most in the end will ditch the self learning and go back to a well tuned carb. The Kirkhams have tried the self learning systems. Give them a call they will tell you their opinion on them. Every one on here who says the self learning efi works have small blocks. I have yet to read about an FE engine who has it work. Barry at survival Motorsports tried it on Anthony's fe. They took it out and went to a multiport system. It would never run correct. Avmaviator is Anthony's handle here. Look it up.

[fordracing65]

Km647 is here. This is the thread you want to search. Barry goes into detail how the self learning would not work. Gave Anthony credit for the self learning system and upgraded to fast xfi system. 13 page I believe. I don't know how to link it to this thread. Barry builds some of the best FE on earth.

[750hp]

Originally Posted by fordracing65

Km647 is here. This is the thread you want to search. Barry goes into detail how the self learning would not work. Gave Anthony credit for the self learning system and upgraded to fast xfi system. 13 page I believe. I don't know how to link it to this thread. Barry builds some of the best FE on earth.

Here's the summary from that thread;

Originally Posted by Avmaviator

Hey everybody!

After a year... here's a major update to this build. I do apologize to everybody who was following this thread, about the lack of updates. Like I mentioned to Ralph in the above post, things have been a little crazy in the last year, but it is a good crazy

KMS647 is...... finished! Well beside the ever ending tinkering and modifications that we car owners subject ourselves to, haha. It has been an absolute joy to drive, especially this spring/summer season. I "finished" it in April of this year. It has a couple thousand miles on it right now (the mileage on the gauge shows 19,000 but I'll get to that later). The only issues right now, knock on wood, are the cold starts, which I'll explain.

So, let's go back to a year ago. I had the car aligned, it responded well to the alignment and was driving great, except for the engine issues... A quick recap on the engine issues. We were using the FAST EZ-EFI system, with a set of TWM stacks. That system works great when using their carb style throttle bodies, with a typical intake. In that set up, there is enough length in the intake and runners that the air/fuel charge is uniform, and the sensors see a nice uniform charge (I put together an LS1 with that EZ set up, with 2 throttle bodies, for a buddy in France, and that thing runs very, very well). The issues we had were at low rpms. Off throttle, to about 1700-1800 rpms, the car surges a lot, missed, and ran very rough, to the point of being very hard (and annoying) to drive. That was very discouraging, and puzzling to us. The mixture would go rich then lean then rich, and keep going like that, producing that roughness. After playing with it for a couple of months, and talking to FAST (unfortunately who were not helpful), Barry, the engine builder who owns Survival Motorsports, suggested we bring the car to his shop in Detroit to trouble shoot it. He believed it was an issue with the engine needing a more steady load on a dyno, so it can learn and adjust it self....
So in Oct of last year we put the car in a trailer (Thanks Hal!) and put it on the dyno.



From 1900 rpm to redline it ran really well, and we could see the system "learn" and adjust itself, pretty neat. The lower end rpms were still causing issues. In these last few months of troubleshooting, I started to hypothesize (with the input of my "porsche engine genius" friend at Perfect Power) that the stacks were causing the issues, along with that system. Off throttle, when the butterflies open, it produces a lot of turbulent air into the cylinders. The EZ system reacted too quickly and not well to that massive amount of turbulent air that it could not keep up with the O2 readings. That brought on the rapid correction of lean to rich to lean and so on. These stacks are like 8 huge throttle bodies, so the amount of air coming in is massive. That is why the EZ system works well with a typical intake, but not well with stacks. After we confirmed that with Barry on the dyno, we decided to go to the FAST XFI system, so we could manually fix the low rpm issues.
Btw, the low rpm issues were not detected on the engine dyno because most dyno don't operate in that low range, so Barry could have not predicted that issue. I was there at the dyno and also thought it was very well tuned. Lesson learned.
It took a bit of time to get the XFI system. After that I proceeded to lighten up the complicated harness. There were a lot of features we weren't going to use so I too, them out to make the harness cleaner. I took my time with that because I really didn't want to screw something up on the harness!




After ripping out all of the EZ harness, I installed the XFI harness. It wasn't too hard but just took time, and by then it was winter, and cold. I made a special mounting plate for the larger ecu box, so I wouldn't have to drill another set of holes in the firewall! (pics will be posted later, there are on my camera)
While talking to some XFI owners, we decided to get a dual sync distributor from Fast, so we can get sequential firing from the more powerful XFI system. The EZ uses a bank to bank firing (all injectors on one bank fire at once). That makes for a more efficient engine. Here is the distributor. Very cool unit.



Installed. You can see some white moisture spots on the aluminum pieces. We had a freak warm day in Chicago this winter where the temp shot up to 60 degrees. My garage which was at 30 degrees, didn't like the warm humid air coming in and everything, I mean everything, was covered in condensation. I had never seen that before. I couldn't dry the Kirkham's engine in time to prevent these little corrosion spots. Took me a while to get rid of these later!


After installing everything, and waiting for the weather to warm up enough to drive, we tuned the car. I did a lot of it myself but it was pretty time consuming and a steep learning curve. I was making progress but still couldn't get everything right. I probably could have done the whole thing but it would have taking me a long time. I gave the car to my friend a Perfect Power, who, with the help of a very knowledgeable EFI guy, tuned the car very well. It runs great. We still need to put the car on a chassis dyno for the WOT tuning. It was mostly tuned for drivability. The only issue we have, and that we can't figure out, is cold starting. During a cold start, you have to crank the car over 6-8 revolutions before it coughs to life... Very annoying. I have cranked the fuel enrichment for cold starting but nothing.... Hot starting only needs one revolution. I wish that XFI system had a pre-squirt option when you turn the keep on, like the EZ system did. That is one thing I really want to fix.

It has been great to drive! The stiff steering issues are mostly due to the teflon bushings used in the Kirkham steering assembly, and are said to get better with a couple thousand miles. It has gotten better I'm happy to report. *There is an issue with the speedometer as it shows 180 mph (pegged) when you drive, and now shows 19,000 miles, haha. I'm going to send the gauge back this winter. Other winter projects are to move the pedals right a bit. I don't like the pedal position, and it is unsafe in my opinion. A tonneau cover will be installed hopefully too.

That's all I can remember for now... Now for the glamour shots below.....

Arnaud -

[spdbrake]

Thanks for the response. I am relieved.

[lovehamr]

On my last Cobra (462ci FE) I used the professional products "self learning" system that I picked up from a member here. Initially I was running a Demon carb, stout hyd roller and a PI intake.
#1 The self learning aspect never worked as advertised.

#2 Changed to an edlbrock streetmaster intake and the world became a better place. Apparently many TBIs don't like duel planes.

#3 That particular system was also tunable by laptop and some of their forum members were greatly helpful in getting my setup sorted.

#4 Once sorted it was great. Cold starts from standing outside the car, killer throttle response, mileage jumped by more than 25%, and I no longer smelled like gas after a drive.

#5 In the end I wound up with a system that still had the vintage look of a carb with the operability of a nicely setup FI.

Win, win!

[fordracing65]

Summit sells the professional products efi and the reviews of it are horrible. Glad it worked for you.

[spdbrake]

Originally Posted by fordracing65

Summit sells the professional products efi and the reviews of it are horrible. Glad it worked for you.

Pay no mind to the Summit reviews, Only 2 given on three systems all from the same person. Having fuel pressure sensor issues. Evidently had been trying to get this newly released system working for over 4 years. Maybe he forgot he already reviewed it and what PN he bought and what year it was and what his name was.....

[fordracing65]

What about the fast reviews. On jegs and summit. Most awful.

[fordracing65]

Anyone on here with an FE that uses a self leaning system can chime in. Not small blocks but stroker fe's with radical cams. Where are you???