Help. The taps broken!!!!!!!!!

Baz · #1 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 08:07 PM

Was fitting the door locks. Had drilled the holes and was tapping the thread when the tap broke off, deep in the hole. I've tried everything to get that little bugger out from trying to drill it out (the taps far harder than the drill), trying to ram it out with a centre punch and BIG hammer to trying to cut a slit in the top of the broken tap so I could screw it out. (the tap is so hard that I can't even scratch its head). Unfortunately, she aint budging.

My final idea is to get a new door.

Can any one come up with a better solution than my last option PLEASE?

Baz

GlynMeek · #2 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 08:17 PM

Baz...my first reaction to this was "oh f**k".

I KNOW you want some wonderful engineering suggestion as to how to do this, but taps are made of HARDENED steel and I think you may be screwed here my friend. I don't think you can do this yourself at all as the type of tools typically available to us "enthusiastic amatuer" car builders will not make a dent in that tap! My recommendation is to take the whole thing to a professional machine shop and see if they can do it for you!!!

Glyn

hey,littlecobra · #3 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 08:19 PM

would you like for me to come take a look at it???

Baz · #4 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hey,littlecobra

would you like for me to come take a look at it???

Hey, Little Cobra,

Please send photo first. Bernie's told me about you.

Baz:

Leeroy · #5 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 08:40 PM

You could take it to a Tool & Cutter grinder and they will be able to spark erode it out. Not sure what they charge but no damage to the surrounding metal thats got your tap stuck in it.

Leeroy

stephen low · #6 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 08:46 PM

Baz

If you can access up the tap grooves, perhaps a set of high quality thin long nose pliers to get into these grooves to allow a twisting unscrewing action. Plenty of lubricant and if you can afford to apply heat all the better.

A long shot I guess but better than buying a new door!! lol

Cheers

Rick Parker · #7 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 09:08 PM

The above idea regarding long needle nose pliers is spot on. Heat the surrounding area carefully and use a tapping fluid in lieu of oil.

GlynMeek · #8 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 09:16 PM

Guys, if you read Baz's post it would seem that the tap is DEEP inside the hole with NO threads sticking out that could be grabbed by needle nosed. THAT won't work, true Baz????

Glyn

PS, I am WELL into a bottle of McCallan's tonight, so though verbose, I may be just a little less than lucid...forgive me...LOL

Baz · #9 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stephen low

Baz

If you can access up the tap grooves, perhaps a set of high quality thin long nose pliers to get into these grooves to allow a twisting unscrewing action. Plenty of lubricant and if you can afford to apply heat all the better.

A long shot I guess but better than buying a new door!! lol

Cheers

Steve,

Mate. Tried that. No luck either.

Baz

Baz · #10 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GlynMeek

Guys, if you read Baz's post it would seem that the tap is DEEP inside the hole with NO threads sticking out that could be grabbed by needle nosed. THAT won't work, true Baz????

Glyn

PS, I am WELL into a bottle of McCallan's tonight, so though verbose, I may be just a little less than lucid...forgive me...LOL

Glyn,

You've hit on the solution and probably didn't realize. I'll pour some McCallans down the hole which in turn will dissolve the broken tap. Thanks mate. Your a genius.

Baz

GlynMeek · #11 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 09:33 PM

in vino veritas...LOL

stephen low · #12 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 09:41 PM

Laborum, laboras, laborat.......

About the sum total of my memories of Latin lessons.............

But for you Baz it means labour on, there must be away out.

Happy swearing!

vettestr · #13 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 09:41 PM

I have had some luck TIG welding a smaller long bolt to the broken tap. If that is not a possible I have used an arc welder set at high current setting to burn out the flute to then pull remainder out. Best of luck .

Rick Parker · #14 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 09:45 PM

stepen low's recommendation is very sound. Use a specific oil made for tapping, and apply heat carefully around the outside of the hole to make the hole expand and release the grip on the tap while sliding the tongs of the needle nose into the flutes of the tap. EDM (Electical Discharge Machining) Leeroys suggestion will work too, but is a little more involved; or (?) could the immediate surrounding area the hole is in be cut out and a "Patch" carefully welded in???

GlynMeek · #15 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 09:45 PM

Like I said Baz, barring your ownership of a TIG welder !!!! take it to a professional machine shop

per ardua ad astra!!!!

amor omnia vincit

Philm · #16 (**permalink**) 06-30-2008, 10:48 PM

HI Baz,
I did something similar with an NPT tap into a brand new dart block.

I recon I lost 10ltrs of sweat when I realised what I had just done.

I grabed an old spanner and cut one end of and cut the center out, if you like made a 2 tine fork, the tines fit into the groves of the tap.

Then with plenty of tapping fluid and a gentle hand backed the tap out.

Phil

BMK · #17 (**permalink**) 07-01-2008, 12:17 AM

Baz

Mmm pouring McCallans down the hole may release the broken tap -

but watch that it does not start dripping on your shoes..

Seriously good luck with getting it out.

Now hey'littlecobra may be able to talk it out - persuasive..

RICK LAKE · #18 (**permalink**) 07-01-2008, 02:55 AM

Baz Snap-on or a real good tool maker should have a set of extractors for broken taps. It's a tool with 4 thin tool steel pins that go down between each flute on the tap. With a lite hand they will get out about 90% of the taps. Once you start the hammer and chisle deal, this will not work. Did you bottom out the tap? It takes alot to break one, even cheap ones. Heating them is another no-no. Take it to a machine shop and let them repair the hole Rick.

LT65 · #19 (**permalink**) 07-01-2008, 02:58 AM

Baz,
There are tap extractors you can buy for extracting broken taps, I have not been all that successful with them but may be worth a try. They are a pronged tool that goes down the flutes of the tap then you use a tap wrench to turn them and the tap hopefully. Failing this method spark erosion is then the best option.
Good luck I can feel your pain.

OZVENOM · #20 (**permalink**) 07-01-2008, 05:07 AM

There is a couple of ways to get it out being a tool maker does not stop me from breaking a tap now and then . you can drill a tap by using a carbide tip drill samer as you use on concrete you can sharpen it so it cuts the tap use rocol or trefolex to lube it. you have to get running true or it will just slide side ways.
The other way is normally used on bigger taps but it works on small taps as well it depends on the location of the tap and weather you can put heat on it. what you do is get oxy cutting torch with the smallest cutting tip you have and the pricipal of this is that an oxy torch will not cut the metal until its hot enough so you heat the tap quickly and hit the cutting button which will blow out the tap but leave the rest pretty well intact its all about how much heat the steel can take before it starts to cut . you could also use a plazma cutter which works well also but most people dont have one.
Some time you just have to give it a go drill a bigger hole knock the tap out and braze it up and re drill and tap it.

I hope this helps i have used both techniques with success.
Regards oz.