Backdraft Handling!!??

[TheSaint71]

Ok ok, I just tonight learned of this cobra maker and hav never heard of them! Anyway Im a HUGE fan of IRS suspension and I want of ask you guys all a question.

From what I've read and understand if a cobra handles better you can actually have time of your laps etc...Do these cars really hanbdle as good as people are saying? It sounds like Bsckdraft made a real impression at run and gun.... As far as this handling goes is there anything else that gives this BMW IRS a run for its money or is close to its quality in handling? I've been reading about making a cobra with great handling abilities and saw this and well it caught my eye to say the least!

Thanks again for everyones time! Greatly appreciate it..

[tfarhood]

Wow, you have been registered about a year on this forum and you never heard of Backdraft racing???

First of all, IRS is a wonderful thing especially for track. Secondly, most kits/replicas can be completed with IRS. Factory Five can be made with IRS. Unique comes standard with a Jag IRS, and on and on...

The BMW IRS is a nice set-up. The Backdraft was my choice, but if you want to duplicate the Run-N-Gun Backdraft, you'll need about $3K more than the standard car price. That car had the BMW M suspension, which is a lot more performance minded than the E-36 standard set-up.

If you are not going to race, live axle is still perfectly fine, and many people with live axle race as well.

One thing about the Backdraft that is different than most IRS cars for handling is the 92" wheelbase instead of 90". I'm not a racer, but I've been told that the 92" wheelbase does have some advantages. Maybe some comments from someone who does race can verify that statement.

If you stack up the features of the Backdraft car, from IRS, brakes, paint, etc., etc... I don't think you can get more bang for the buck anywhere else. I was going to build the Unique, but I couldn't finish it for the price of the Backdraft.

Have fun with the decisions ahead of you.

[Nuke427]

Go to the BDR website and check my testimonial. I'm so impressed with the performance of these cars! I owned a '93 RX-7 twin turbo which handle like it was on rails, then owned an FFR Cobra and was rather disappointed in the handling of the car. It was a standard suspension build, solid 8.8 rear with drum brakes and nothing special up front. Needless to say, it was a huge difference from the RX-7. Well, the Cobra ended up wrecked and I searched for a new one and found these BDR's rather tempting. I purchased one and I was very surprised with the handling of this car. I don't even have the M3 upgrade! Unbelievable braking, handling, and high speed stability! Very, very impressive! I expected this Cobra to be like the FFR as far as handling and the way it drove, boy was I wrong. Huge difference! Great car, email me for specifics if you like.

[TheSaint71]

lol Nuke427, you actually wrecked a Cobra!? OMG thats like total heresy! lol How did this happen!? Wow Mazda RX-7 twin turbo nicee! Im actually thinking on doing a twin turbo Cobra.. but anyway yeah I like this great handling idea...I will definately email you.... thanks

tfarhood lol yeahh I always thought this Backdraft part was some talk only meant for people that were like super knowledgable and all and thought I'd be nice and stay away so I wouldnt be banned from noob questions! lol Besides.... I usually see all the posts about most cobra makers and never saw anything about Backdraft! lol wierd huh!!? haha


Hmm BMW M suspenions? How much better could that be!?
Interesting so are all IRS cars 92'' wheel base? Yeahh hehe the decions have been thus far thanks alot for your time guys!

[bobl]

Come to KC once the pavement warms up and have a PREMIER experience. Chances are you'll leave a far wiser and discerning individual when it comes to performance handling and/or acceleration from a Cobra.

At least you'll be full of Kansas City BBQ and have a grin on your face that will take an IRS agent ( and now we're no longer speaking of suspensions ) to remove.

[tfarhood]

The IRS has nothing to do with wheelbase, But the Backdraft is a 92"wheelbase. The ERA, Unique, FFR, and most others that have/offer IRS are 90" wheelbase, just as the original Cobras were.

There are no stupid questions if you don't know the answer. It is stupid if you don't ask. If stupid questions were against the rules here, they would have already removed my registration after the first day

[Jackal]

Better to ask a stupid question, than to make a stupid mistake

[Excaliber]

Is IRS really THAT superior? I think it depends on the track and the way the car is setup. I DON'T think you can make a blanket statement and assume that IRS is "always" better than a live axle.

Couple of examples: Ed "DV" with his Classic Roadster and live axle could pull OVER 1 G force in cornering. That was with STREET TIRES no less!

NASCAR runs a live axle and weighs 3500 pounds. You THINK they handle pretty good? Stick like glue!

The FFR mentioned above was clearly NOT setup correctly. EVEN with a live axle, "drum brakes" and simple "basic" coil over front suspension the FFR's can be QUITE REMARKABLE in the handling department. Why? There one of the lightest replicas out there, and weight is a HUGE factor when it comes to handling!

Road race against equally prepared FFR vs RX-7? I wouldn't be so quick to bet on the RX-7.

How many of todays "stock" cars can corner over 1 G from the factory? You will only need ONE hand to count them!

Rough surface track? IRS will have an advantage. Smooth track? Maybe not! Which car cost more? IRS hands down.

Having said all that, sure I want IRS too. Willing to pay the "extra" for it? Maybe not. BDR is a impressive car for the money though!

Ernie

[Tom T.]

Ernie, further to your comments, the live axle set-up engineered for Highland's Coupe looks impressive, at least to me. One thing I personally like about irs in a small wheelbase, stiffly sprung car is that it seems to deal with ordinary bumps, etc. in the road a bit better than a live axle does, but that's just my experience.

TT

[Nuke427]

Originally posted by Excaliber


Road race against equally prepared FFR vs RX-7? I wouldn't be so quick to bet on the RX-7.

How many of todays "stock" cars can corner over 1 G from the factory? You will only need ONE hand to count them!

In my first hand experience, the '93 RX-7 was totally superior in handling compared to my FFR. It handled better than my BDR does, but the BDR is much closer in comparison. And the TT '93 RX-7 did have a 1g skid pad rating. Then, I had Eibach springs installed and wider wheels/tires. I have yet to drive a car that was as tossible as it was, and I probably didn't take it to it's limits. I know you can setup a Cobra of any make and make it handle and I agree the FFR at a mere 2100-2200 lbs would be an obvious choice. But my BDR with another 300 lbs over the FFR handles much better than the FFR without any modifications. No one mentioned equally prepped. That's a no brainer.

[Nuke427]

Another thing that virtually no Cobra has that this car does is downforce, much downforce!

[TheSaint71]

Holy cow thats a Mazda RX-7!? Atleast here in Oregon I NEVER see RX-7s is that a 1992 or 1993? Hott car, I really like that! (Reason I ask is my friend swears thats a 92 lol)

Thanks for the info guys, your replies have been absolutely fantastic!! Yeahh those FFR have sweet frams and no weight pretty Impressive! Those of you who have Backdrafts.. tell me what do they weigh with a small block, like a 302 or so..? Also can you visible tell the difference between a 92'' wheel base and a 90'' wheel base? Will the lousy 2" do anything!? Some people told me yes, but I dunno... I just have a hard time believe this lol

BTW SWEET PLATES! LOL 007, now we talking just my style! I really like that car! You info helps alot thanks again.


tFARhood lol yeahh I would probably been removed from the forum too haha!

[Nuke427]

That car was a 1993, that was the first year of the new body style. They looked just like that from '93 to '95.

The BDR weighs approx. 2400 lbs with a small block Ford. Give or take 50 to 100. The 2" additional wheelbase is not that noticeable especially if there is not a 90" wheelbase car parked next to it. Much more cockpit room! No extended door or anything, hard to tell really. All I can say is I've owned/driven many sports cars and this BDR is the most fun ever. I would like to have my RX back, but the kids, something about college funds? Oh well. I loved those plates too! I think that's the only thing my wife misses about that car though.

[SkipB]

TheSaint71 and others,

I rode in 4 different Cobra replicas before buying a Backdraft. All of the other replicas were not IRS, so I can't make that comparison. The Backdraft simply was more comfortable, especially on roads that are not perfectly smooth. It may also help that I am a BMW fan.

I was told my car with a 351 should weigh about 2400lbs.

As for the 2 extra inches. What guy wouldn't want that! Actually, I wasn't able to see the difference when my car was sitting next to an FFR. Some of the other cars with a 94" wheelbase definitely look different. I am not sure how to do a real comparison on handling unless everything else would be equal except the wheelbase.

[TheSaint71]

Nice looking design on that Mazda! Yeahh I bet the wife liked the plates, they are really good! 2400 lbs not bad

So the doors are the same size as the rest of them eh? Good I never liked those extended doors anyway! I heard someone say something bout since the wheel wells are larger the mirror on side of the BDR car is kinda fruitless being all u see is the wheel well, any truth to this? So your telling me you saw a FFR right next to the BDR and could not tell the difference visually?

wow, 4 rides in all different cobra makes eh? I bet that was good... 351c are really nice sized cobra engines I think... not too big... not too large...

Thanks guys

[Boudy]

Jamin: Yes the cars do handle very well. The Run & Gun car you read about was upgraded slightly from a stock car. It received our M3 upgrade package which is HD swing arms, HD axles, bigger brakes, and posi-track diff. That's a $3,000 upgrade and also requires 16" or 17" wheels to house the brakes. Most of the upgrade is to handle HP and the only thing that really improves track times is the brakes. The car was also equiped with a very strong power plant and slicks.

The car was taken to the Round-Up in Fla where the great lap times were followed up by 3 different drivers. The 2 owners of Backdraft and I think the other guy might have been the Deep South Cobra Club Pres or something. The motor was removed and the car has been since sold. Some guys claim it was some special, tricked out race car, but it wasn't.

Bobl: Clever plug. You have what looks like a nice product, however, the Backdraft Forum is not the appropriate place to promote it. I pay for this area so that Backdraft customers and potential Backdraft customers may ask questions, share experiences, and discuss Backdrafts in general. Brent will gladly set you up with your own Forum to discuss PREMIER experiences. Brent-Mills@clubcobra.com

Boudy

[aumoore]

Boudy
I got to run against that car at the Reptile Roundup and it was pretty awsome. At the same event it was slightly quicker than Dennis Olthoff's Superformance but you have to admit it had some huge race tires that went way past the fender edges. Dennis's car was very streetable with a hardtop, heater, street seats etc.

The third driver was Ed Kamptner(aka Engineer Ed at FFcobra.com)

Compared to the other Cobras at the Roundup this was a race car.

[Boudy]

Compared to the other Cobras at the Roundup this was a race car

Aumoore: You're telling me that an M3 BDR with big slicks and a big motor constitutes a race car. That's a testimate in itself. Point made.

The car handles very well. It does what it does. However, this means no disrespect to Dennis or anyone else. The car is what it is. I didn't say it was better than another or the best on the market.

After Run & Gun, the buzz was that Tony brought the results and not the car.

After Round Up and 3 drivers, the buzz was that the car was not what we sell.

Well, the car was an M3 BDR with tires and a motor. If tires and motor put the car in another catagory, POINT MADE.

Boudy

[DC COBRA]

Not to rain in on this handling thread, but being the owner of BDR with plans in putting a 600 plus motor in, I too was concerned about the rear IRS. With the mentioned $3000 upgrade of the M type suspension, then you have to upgrade to 17 inch wheels, just to handle the horsepower feasible. There is another option that can be takened. The differential is the same for the base and the upgraded M suspension. I have located a company that will build custom 'BOLT IN AXLES' and gaurantee them to 750 rear wheel horsepower for one year. This way you get to keep the base suspension and the 15 inch wheels and knowing that your IRS will handle extreme horsepower without adding the full $3000 upgrades. Though they are not cheap, it will cost you roughly half of the $3000 plus upgrade. Easy bolt on that will add some peace of mind.

DON

[Boudy]

Cool! Thanks for the heads up Don. Let Reg know about the company that will make the HD axles. I'll bet more guys would be interested.

Boudy