Club Cobra Keith Craft Motorsports  

Go Back   Club Cobra > Manufacturers, Engine Builders, tools, and parts. > BackDraft Racing ---

MMG Superformance
Nevada Classics
Keith Craft Racing
Main Menu
Module Jump:
Nevada Classics
Nevada Classics
Keith Craft Racing
MMG Superformance
Advertise at CC
Banner Ad Rates
MMG Superformance
Keith Craft Racing
Keith Craft Racing
March 2024
S M T W T F S
          1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
31            

Kirkham Motorsports

Like Tree5Likes

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 09:29 AM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: ocala, fl
Cobra Make, Engine: BDR 211, 408, tko 600
Posts: 71
Not Ranked     
Default 1/4 mile times

Just wanted some input on other times you guys might have. I've been turning a steady 12.5. My car is #211 and has a 408 from custom cars. It has somewhere in the 500hp range. Tranny is a tko 600 with the 3:08 gears. I also have the nitto drag radials.
I'd like to drop into the 11's. Have any of you tried different gears? How about any nitrous applications?
My car is just over a year old with 4500 miles now and it's time to go faster.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 09:47 AM
Senior Club Cobra Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15,712
Not Ranked     
Default

There are very few Cobras (as a percentage of Cobras out there) that get into the 11's, VERY few. Most, even with BIG horse power generally run 12.1 or 12.2 at best.

Why is that? It remains somewhat of a mystery to me. Small block or big block, low 12's is reality. The major difference between a SB or BB is the trap speed, not so much the ET.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 10:49 AM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: ocala, fl
Cobra Make, Engine: BDR 211, 408, tko 600
Posts: 71
Not Ranked     
Default

Here's the rest of the times.
60' 1.9
1/8 8.0
1/4 105.7
It just seems with this motor it should do better.
How does the car feel on the road course? After a year of owning it I think I might give it a go. I race stock cars and always said I wouldn't race my BDR.
Does the front end feel very light to anyone else? There are times on the road I feel the front end slightly veer to one side or the other. Often the opposite direction of a sweeping turn. It's not a push, but almost feels like the front tires are barely making road contact. It easily corrects with little steering input. Also if you are on a road with say semi-truck grooves in the asphalt the car easily wants to track in the grooves.
Does any else have the same handling experiences?
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 11:18 AM
Senior Club Cobra Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15,712
Not Ranked     
Default

Interesting numbers, were about dead even at the 1/8th I'd say. Heres mine.
0-60ft 2.0
1/8 7.9
1/4 11.90 at 121 mph

You can see how the big block just 'keeps pulling' at the end where SB's tend to run out of breath.

Tracking the grooves in the road, or wandering, depends a lot on tires.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 11:32 AM
Jerry Clayton's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Bartlett, Ill
Cobra Make, Engine: Everett-Morrison LS1
Posts: 2,448
Not Ranked     
Default

Speaking to the percentage of cobras out there---I have been out twice with the Windy City Cobra Club to Byron Dragway--
Most of the guys aren't dragracers, some it was first trip to the track since they were in high school--

About half the cars here are either BackDraft or Superperformance, most with 392 to 532 cubic inches--
These lightweight cars with IRS will not accelerate off the starting line, there 0-60 times are best measured with a sun dial
Couple that with most are missing shifts or running hundreds of feet on the rev limiter, doesn't add to good drag times
The unfamiliar feeling they have at the starting line is completely foreign to them compared to the feeling of confidence on the street and there performance shows up in there performance numbers.

So far, the consistently fastest have been RED FF cars with large cube small blocks

Jerry
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 11:34 AM
Jerry Clayton's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Bartlett, Ill
Cobra Make, Engine: Everett-Morrison LS1
Posts: 2,448
Not Ranked     
Default

PS
The FF have a solid rear axle and leave the line pretty good

Jerry
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 12:26 PM
Senior Club Cobra Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15,712
Not Ranked     
Default

Good point Jerry, I myself an certainly no 'drag racer'. I was blown away how HARD it is to actually 'get it right'! It took several runs when I first started to figure it out. First few runs were like, "OK, that guy left, I should follow him and see if I can catch up, dam, missed third again!"

...and of course the red ones are always the fastest...


Last edited by Excaliber; 09-17-2006 at 12:29 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 12:36 PM
CHRIS DAMSCH's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: WEST SUBURBS OF CHICAGO, IL
Cobra Make, Engine: SPF 1454
Posts: 1,137
Not Ranked     
Default

Jerry,

What about the little blue small spf with independent rear. 396CI small block
Drag radials

1.5 60'
11.7 @ 114

Many 11.8 and 11.9 runs also.

Sorry, Had to represent the blue cars...........
__________________
CHRIS
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 12:43 PM
Jerry Clayton's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Bartlett, Ill
Cobra Make, Engine: Everett-Morrison LS1
Posts: 2,448
Not Ranked     
Default

Chris
Didn't I say consistantly?
of course having 8 good holes helps!

And Chris--your little blue car has a line lock? Your experience at the line shows up from the time you sit down, buckle up and----

Did you guys look any further into Wolfies problem?

Jerry
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 12:45 PM
Jerry Clayton's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Bartlett, Ill
Cobra Make, Engine: Everett-Morrison LS1
Posts: 2,448
Not Ranked     
Default

Chris--all my Race cars have been blue--of course I raced all my cars, black, red, green, pink&white,silver

Jerry
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 12:48 PM
CHRIS DAMSCH's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: WEST SUBURBS OF CHICAGO, IL
Cobra Make, Engine: SPF 1454
Posts: 1,137
Not Ranked     
Default

I'm just messing with ya Jerry,

No, we haven't looked into Wolfie's car issues yet. Probably some time this week.

Shoulda tried with 7 good holes...............
__________________
CHRIS
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 02:44 PM
Senior Club Cobra Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Cobra Make, Engine:
Posts: 15,712
Not Ranked     
Default

What? 11.8 and still in the teens on trap speed? I would have expected 120+ Must be a blue car...

Looking at some of the original 289 vs 427 cars shows ET's (around 12, 12.2, 12.3) close to each other, but a significantly higher trap speed for the big blocks.

Which raises an interesting question:
The original Ford Thunderbolts were running 10's, with POINT type ignition and over the counter parts! Thats a heavier car with a 427 and a top loader, a setup much like you could have seen in a Cobra back then. But it's pretty rare to see 10's for a Cobra, any Cobra, vintage or modern, no matter WHAT engine\horse power there running. Gotta be a traction thing, or, "we" are unwilling to rev them to 7500 or 8000 rpm (which the Thunderbolts did)! So which is it, traction or rpm limited? I know I won't run MINE that high, even though the high riser heads WOULD support that kind of rpm. Scary stuff...

1.5 hole shot is VERY good, WOW! That will rattle the competition enough to cause them to miss a shift (and I know that from experience).

Last edited by Excaliber; 09-17-2006 at 03:00 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2006, 04:58 PM
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Cobra Make, Engine: Backdraft #90, 351w,Tremec 3550, SB100 SOLD
Posts: 577
Not Ranked     
Default

MDP727,

I've never really figured out what the real rear axle ratio on Backdrafts is for the stock rear end. I've been told 3:10, 3:15 and now you say 3:08. Whatever it is comes from a BMW E36 3 series from the mid 1990s. You might see if you can find a limited slip version that I think runs about a 3:45 - 3:50. There is also a limited slip you can add from Quaife to your existing rear end. I think you may be able to change ratios as well. This may speed things up a bit depending on what gear you are in and where your rpms are at the 1/4 mark. Just to confuse the issue, I have also heard you don't need a limited slip unit for the BMW rear end and that it may be faster without! In any case I would look for a numerically higher rear end ratio.

You guys that have tested various combinations (on the Backdraft only) can weigh in here and help MDP727.

Skip B
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2006, 07:18 PM
jeffko's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Chicago, Ill
Cobra Make, Engine: BDR #177 Carbed Ford Small Block
Posts: 735
Not Ranked     
Default

I ran a 12.1 at 116 with an open 3.46. I have since switched to a 3.64 ls diff and have yet to best 12.7 at 109. The open diff was much more forgiving at the launch on radial t/a and the ls is much harder to keep a grip with.

Traction is most definitely the problem. I don't care who you are, putting 460 ft lbs of torque at the wheels with barely 1000 lbs (if that) sitting on it is next to impossible without drag radials or better yet slicks. With a set of street ets and a few practice runs I believe I could sink into the mid 11s relatively easily. Look at Chris's 60' of 1.5. That’s a mid 10 second run with a motor that has more poop. Does he have drag radials? Bet your arse he does.

I would also agree with Jerry on sitting on the rev limiter. I have intentionally done it at the last trap and I am peeking out on rpms somewhere around 100 feet before the 1/4 trap in 3rd gear meaning about 6400. You will have better times if you go ahead and shift. It takes a few tenths to do it, but running flat for 100' does not pay. The other time I do it is most assuredly unintentionally at the line. ~@~^&@!#&*$#^

Yes of course it is experience, but more than that is tires, tires, tires.

Just my two cents....


Hey Jerry, I wished I had thought to have you run my car down the track to see what it would really do.
__________________
Tis better to burn out than to fade away. So "Lite 'Em Up!"
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2006, 08:28 PM
CHRIS DAMSCH's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: WEST SUBURBS OF CHICAGO, IL
Cobra Make, Engine: SPF 1454
Posts: 1,137
Not Ranked     
Default

Jeff, Jeff, Jeff........

You know it's not just the tires.......

Look at Wolfies times this weekend.

Oh wait... He didn't make it down the track

Ha
__________________
CHRIS
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2006, 08:36 PM
Jerry Clayton's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Bartlett, Ill
Cobra Make, Engine: Everett-Morrison LS1
Posts: 2,448
Not Ranked     
Default

Jeff makes a good point--the 364 gear on the rev limiter vs the 346 topping out in third gear--quite possibly where the difference was

The car did launch good very good on the 12.1 pass in the spring tho----only launched so so this weekend.

Jeff--when you get it in the 8's I'll show you how to do 7's

Jerry
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2006, 08:43 PM
CHRIS DAMSCH's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: WEST SUBURBS OF CHICAGO, IL
Cobra Make, Engine: SPF 1454
Posts: 1,137
Not Ranked     
Default

Jerry, Jerry, Jerry,

Let's not get Jeff so excited about the 8's. He needs to launch that beast into the 11's first.

Probably alot faster than my car is currently.

But just wait until next year......................

10's or bust. Wait... I probably shouldn't use that expression, should I?

By the way Jeff.... There is a fourth gear. You should try it some time.
__________________
CHRIS
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2006, 08:54 PM
Jerry Clayton's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Bartlett, Ill
Cobra Make, Engine: Everett-Morrison LS1
Posts: 2,448
Not Ranked     
Default

Jeff
I think you could do 10s with what you have--

Jerry
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 09-19-2006, 02:51 AM
Dwight's Avatar
Senior Club Cobra Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Florence, AL
Cobra Make, Engine: RCR GT 40 & 1966 Fairlane 390 5 speed
Posts: 4,511
Not Ranked     
Default Radial T/A's

Buy a pair of good tires, BFG G-Force or anything but the T/A's. They are to hard for a drag tire.
Dwight
__________________
''Life's tough.....it's even tougher if you're stupid.'' ~ John Wayne
"Happiness Is A Belt-Fed Weapon"
life's goal should be; "to be smarter than inanimate objects"
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 09-19-2006, 03:45 AM
jeffko's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Chicago, Ill
Cobra Make, Engine: BDR #177 Carbed Ford Small Block
Posts: 735
Not Ranked     
Default

We should have a special trophy for Wolfie breaking the club record with his 12 minute 1/4 mile.

Hey Wolfie, what was that you kept telling me in London when Laura made me break my rearend.

Sucks to be you Wolfie!
__________________
Tis better to burn out than to fade away. So "Lite 'Em Up!"
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:43 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
The representations expressed are the representations and opinions of the clubcobra.com forum members and do not necessarily reflect the opinions and viewpoints of the site owners, moderators, Shelby American, any other replica manufacturer, Ford Motor Company. This website has been planned and developed by clubcobra.com and its forum members and should not be construed as being endorsed by Ford Motor Company, or Shelby American or any other manufacturer unless expressly noted by that entity. "Cobra" and the Cobra logo are registered trademarks for Ford Motor Co., Inc. clubcobra.com forum members agree not to post any copyrighted material unless the copyrighted material is owned by you. Although we do not and cannot review the messages posted and are not responsible for the content of any of these messages, we reserve the right to delete any message for any reason whatsoever. You remain solely responsible for the content of your messages, and you agree to indemnify and hold us harmless with respect to any claim based upon transmission of your message(s). Thank you for visiting clubcobra.com. For full policy documentation refer to the following link: CC Policy
Links monetized by VigLink