New coil overs causing problems...

[MaSnaka]

Last spring I installed an upgrade of the Pro Shock coil overs front and rear with new upper and lower A-arms. Purchased through CRII. My car is a 1997CR purchased from a private party. I am not here to b**** or complain and am certainly not pointing fingers at CRII. The problems I encountered which I am sharing to help others in the same boat. To start, the bolts supplied with the kits dont all fit (too short) and I had to purchase new ones to fit. Not that big a deal but still beware. Today I noticed the bracket attached to the differential where the lower rear shock/spring is attached has started to bend. Too much stress so I need to have it reinforced. I now wish I had left the old spring in place to give more support. A much stronger design, I'm not sure why the coil over is thought to be an improvement in the rear. Both are height adjustable. Another issue is I couldn't get the front end aligned all the way to spec. The camber is maxed out and can't quite get to neg. The tech said it should be ok but I am the sort of person who thinks right is right and not almost right. The car definetly rides better, cornering and especially over bumps. No more bottoming out the tires into the fenders (old springs were weak). If anybody has had experience with similar problems I am open to some ideas for corrections. Thanks. This forum has been very quiet, are there not many CR's out there?

John

[tcrist]

MaSnaka,

I'll be interested in this myself. I bought the same stuff from CRII and am about to put mine on the road. I asked the same questions but I was more concerned about the upper bracket. Looks like I might need to beef up both. For the upper I was thinking about making a stiffiner bracket that bolts to the shock bolt and then to the frame. When I figure it out I will make some spares for other CR owners. I work in the metal trade so if you can think up something, sketch it up and I can get it made for you. Sheetmetal or machined, either one.

Terry

[capteddie]

I bought my phase 1 and phase 2 from CRII about 4 months ago. I also upgraded to the coil-overs. Unfortunately I haven't got around to mounting them yet (dam winter weather). If the temps get back around normal and I can work in the garage, I should have the front and rear installed in the next couple of weeks. I'll post some pics and comments on how they look.

MaSnaka... You said your CRII is from 97, so I'm thinking my frame is different than yours. I have the newer frame with the lowered seat pans. Not sure what might be different (if anything) with the suspension mounting points.

Ed

*** On a side note ***
I am growing concerned about the lack of response from CRII. I know Don has had some "people issues" recently, but has not responded to phone calls and posts on this board and CRIIs own board. I'm still owed quite a few items that where paid for with my phase 1/2 purchase, that was not available at the time.

[tcrist]

I know what you mean. I have been trying to get ahold of CRII for a windshield. I ended up having to get it from Finishline. I hope it fits.

Terry

[capteddie]

Originally Posted by tcrist

I know what you mean. I have been trying to get ahold of CRII for a windshield. I ended up having to get it from Finishline. I hope it fits.

Terry

WOW!!! Not good! Just tried calling CRII again and I got a memory full error on their voicemail. At least all the parts I still need, should be able to be sourced from a 3rd party. Stuff like lights, carpet and other trim pieces. The big problem is I need the race style gas cap with the fiberglass spill well. Also Don was making me a custom roll-bar out of polished stainless that went from drives side to the passenger side. (guess I shouldn't have paid for that in advance $1000.00 )

[tcrist]

Originally Posted by capteddie

WOW!!! Not good! Just tried calling CRII again and I got a memory full error on their voicemail. At least all the parts I still need, should be able to be sourced from a 3rd party. Stuff like lights, carpet and other trim pieces. The big problem is I need the race style gas cap with the fiberglass spill well. Also Don was making me a custom roll-bar out of polished stainless that went from drives side to the passenger side. (guess I shouldn't have paid for that in advance $1000.00 )

"Don" has been good to work with. I am sure that he will take care of you. If I remember correctly from another post the headlights (or maybe just the chrome surrounds) is a CRII item only. I do not know if you order a complete light assembly from someone else if it will fit. Hope so.

Terry

[MaSnaka]

Ed and Terry,

On my car the lower rear shock mount is like a three sided box open on the top and bottom with the back side of the diff being the 4th side. Dimensions approx. 3.5"x3.5"x3.5". 2 sides and a back, the back being the piece the shock bolts to. It's 3/16" - 1/8" metal plate and it's the back side that is bending and allowing the rear shock bolt to sag. This supports the whole weight of the rear of the car since I removed the original spring which sat on a perch on top of the swing arm. I think this area could be reinforced easily enough by just increasing the gauge of steel plate used to attach the shock. I'm thinking 1/4" thick. I'm not a welder so I will have to take it the fabricator and see what he thinks. I'll let you know how it goes.

My car was titled in '97 before Don took over CRII. It was just Classic Roadsters back then. I don't know of any design changes so yours may be the same or different. I am the 3rd owner of my car and was not involved in the original build. I wasn't aware that the diff would be included with the kit.

If you purchased your parts in advance using a credit card the company will handle any dispute in case they are not delivered. I would always make these purchases using a credit card for this reason. I believe it protects you if they go bankrupt too.

John

[capteddie]

John,

I'll take some good current pics of my frame by the weekend (its colder than crap here right now) and post them. I'll also take shots of the rear end, its a 9" supplied by CRII.

As for the issues with CRII. I did pay with a credit card, but the roll bar was bundled into the phase 2 total. I might be able to get the money back from my CC company, I'll have to check. The bigger issue is getting the remaining finish/trim pieces I need to finish the build.

I've left 3 messages in 3 days with nothing coming back from Don.

Thanks,
Ed

[Ant]

Originally Posted by MaSnaka

Last spring I installed an upgrade of the Pro Shock coil overs front and rear with new upper and lower A-arms. Purchased through CRII. My car is a 1997CR purchased from a private party. I am not here to b**** or complain and am certainly not pointing fingers at CRII. The problems I encountered which I am sharing to help others in the same boat. To start, the bolts supplied with the kits dont all fit (too short) and I had to purchase new ones to fit. Not that big a deal but still beware. Today I noticed the bracket attached to the differential where the lower rear shock/spring is attached has started to bend. Too much stress so I need to have it reinforced. I now wish I had left the old spring in place to give more support. A much stronger design, I'm not sure why the coil over is thought to be an improvement in the rear. Both are height adjustable. Another issue is I couldn't get the front end aligned all the way to spec. The camber is maxed out and can't quite get to neg. The tech said it should be ok but I am the sort of person who thinks right is right and not almost right. The car definetly rides better, cornering and especially over bumps. No more bottoming out the tires into the fenders (old springs were weak). If anybody has had experience with similar problems I am open to some ideas for corrections. Thanks. This forum has been very quiet, are there not many CR's out there?

John

With the front suspension camber adjustment, I wonder what happens if you find with fast road driving, or you go to the track and need to crank some camber on? Some front suspensions needs to have some static Neg camber to allow for roll etc, even though a suspension has camber change designed into it.

[flyboy1997]

Heard thru The Grapevine that CR11 was being bought out by another Co., came from another Kit Car Co. so MAY be true? I own a Excalibur also so I hope they stay in business for parts but I did have headers on order for months & never got them or a call, ended up with K. Craft making me a set.
Not trying to pass rumors but had some of the same worries when phone & email messages went unanswered while building my Lonestar & They are now under new ownership with Major Improvements !

[capteddie]

Thanks for the info on CRII. I wonder what kind of mess it will be getting already paid for, but not delivered parts from a new owner?

Ed

[G_Edmonds]

First let me say that I have no first hand knowledge of CR's ownership status but Don or his son called me about a week ago to verify a parts order and say that it was shipping within two weeks. I have a second, third, fourth hand CR so all I have bought is parts. They have never charged me until they were ready to ship. This could very well be a supplier problem.
I would really like to do my business with Don but I totally understand wanting to finish the car and being held up waiting for parts.
-Greg

[capteddie]

Sorry for side tracking this thread off the original subject of coil-over problems.

I've started a new post with regards to the current state of CRII here...

What's up with CRII? This could be bad... - Club Cobra

Ed

[flyboy1997]

I guess I should have asked if IF anyone else had heard this, Don ( I think) did not charge me just qouted a delivery date for headers & when I checked on order they did not even have a jig for them. I think what hear say I heard was another kit co. taking over, beats me ? Nothing first hand by no means but could explain things but I also think I saw them answering on another thread?

[MaSnaka]

Ok, I still haven't got the coilover problem licked yet because I haven't had the time yet, but I do think I need new bushings for the rear end links. I'm not sure if this is the right terminology but is it a 4-link? There are 2 short arms (approx. 12") on the upper and 2 longer ones (approx. 30") on the lower side that hold the differential to the frame. I had my son rock the car back and forth with the ebrake on and I could see and hear lateral movement at the lower link which connects to the frame. Figure it would do to replace them all. This may help eliminate the slop and noise I have been noticing. I did pick up a new bolt kit per DV's suggestion I just havent pulled the assembly apart yet to install. Where do I go for new bushings and does anyone know what they are? Do these come from CR? Thanks.

John

[tcrist]

MaSnaka,
Here is a link to a thread where Don gave a P/N for the lower bushings. From what I understand the upper trailing are bushings are stock late 70's-early 80's mustang. I might be goofed up on the dates. Maybe someone else could chime in on that.

Terry
CR rear lower control arm bushings.

[Double Venom]

To All: I certainly hope you guys don't mind me jumping in on these problems?
Rear lower control arms, it is VERY unlikely that the bushings are bad, look at them and see if they have major cracking in the rubber itself- rare, if not it is probably not the bushing causing the slop or noise on rocking the car back and forth or the slight slop that a good driver will feel in hard manuevers BUT a to small diameter lower mounting bolt! This will allow the entire lower control arm to rock against the bolt.
Easy to check, take the weight of the rear end by raising the "Frame" then support the rear end and remove the lower control arm bolt. My bet is the bolt will be tight going into the lower cotrol arm bracket but has slop in the bushing. Simply drill out the lower mounting bracket to the same size hole that is in the bushing, install new bolts for both sides: Problem solved.

Side note: Lower control arms are weak BUT only if you are pushing more than an honest 500 HP and really getting into the road race stuff. (Testing at Honda's test track-Marysville, Oh. by a profesional driver- we sarted out with skid pad testing and only got approximately a .78 skid factor using stock un-modified parts, by the time we got done we were getting 1.78 skid data- this is exceptional for any car let alone a replica! While doing the above bolt repair, look at your rear supplied lower control arms; you will see they look sort of like a railroad track with two parallel arms welded on each end with the bushing support, simply take a couple of 1/4" (+/-) plates, weld them across the tracks top and bottom and box them in. You can't get a better lower control arm anywhere. If any one wants this done and has trouble finding sopmeone with the tools by all means know let me know. You pay shipping both ways and I will be glad to do this for you for free. Only cost is if I have to have a friend cut us some steel. A previous person absconded with my plasma cutter so I can't cut them anymore.

Hope this is on target...and it helps
DV

[tcrist]

DV, No problem with me with you chiming in. I think we all appreciate your help.

Terry

[MaSnaka]

DV, I find your advice helpful, keep it coming, please. By the way my lower control arm is solid aluminum. Someone before me must have replaced the original. I will check on the bolt sizes there and see if that is indeed the problem. Noway my car is near 500hp.

John

[TC Cobra]

Hey DV!

Good to see you back on the forums!

When you box in the lower control arms, what provision do you make for the sway bar?

What other tricks did you do to achieve the 1.78 skid factor?

Thanks for your help!
Dwain