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  #61 (permalink)  
Old 03-05-2003, 01:04 PM
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I have been reading your post and I feel your pain guys... its pretty cool to see some people step up and help other here with spare parts etc.
I have a question are they going to be at the Carlisle Kit Car Show in mid May?
Maybe you guys can all show up there and get some answers.
I am so thankful because I had seen the Kit CAr rag with it on cover etc and was thinking about calling them as I am in the market for one...but not now!!!!
thanks
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  #62 (permalink)  
Old 03-05-2003, 02:20 PM
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Time heals all wounds as they say. I still say Classic is one of the best engineered cars made. When they were making their presence known @ the run and guns the car always did very well and won top honors. DV will attest to the quality and engineering of the car. Why else would he have used it for his Double Venom platform. Over the years the car and the company have gone though trying times. Since the purchase of Classic by Imar last October a commitment was made to continue with the car division but with Gary at the helm not much has been accomplished. Most of the time spent with Gary is devoted to the boat division. I know his heart just isn't with the cars the way it was in the past. Management has come and gone and Gary has depended on them to do the right thing with Classic but it hasn't happened. As an example Bob Hart came in as GM and proceeded to throw away 5, 10 yard dumpsters of parts that he felt were obsolete. Trust me when I say there were many good parts. He also spent well over $100k in building renovation. Big plans, Big lies and no progress. I know of at least 5 GM's that had mostly self interest rather than any interest in the company. This has produced broken promises, lies, and general poor business practice.

I am sure all of you have been hearing rumors in the wind of changes coming @ Classic. I have been in contact with them for over 2 months now and am negotiating to purchase Classic along with 2 investors. I don't know if this will happen but we will make our final offer in about 2 weeks. If it doesn't happen then I probably will dissassociate myself with them because I to am tired of the BS.

The basis is there for a good company to rise from the ashes. I know what to do and how to do it. I spent many years doing accquisitions and mergers so I understand the complexities of the purchase. I'm also taking a big risk in persuing this venture. I have a letter of intent from DV and his group to become the US distributor for Classic products. He will proceed to setup a professional dealer network. I will make a committment to ship all product complete, be price competitive, honest, and make a profit for my investors. I have most vendors lined up and ready to produce. We will undertake a new builders manual and I have plans for many updated items for the car. I will listen to the customer and take suggestions seriously.

I'm tired of the industry and the ripoff artists that come and go. There is a place for good honest people in this business and we can pick several examples such as FinishLine. I think mine and DV's reputations speak for themselves. I will always continue to conduct any business I own with honesty and integrity. We as a group must stick together and not allow any company to take advantage of us anymore. I have devoted over 13 years of my life to this industry and I hope to give many more.

I do believe that if I can reach an agreement with IMAR that it won't be long that people can be proud to say they own a Classic.

I probably shouldn't have released this info yet because it's not a done deal. My main motivation is to let Classic customers know what is happening and why. With this in progress of course IMAR isn't real interested in stocking parts or filling backorders. I will assume all backorders and pending orders after the purchase. So I will post either way when a final decision is made.
Don
  #63 (permalink)  
Old 03-05-2003, 02:39 PM
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Don,
Good Luck! If I was closer I would love to work for you! Talk about a passion. I was so hooked after I built my first, I ordered my second and third immediately. I've been around manufacturing and the business world most of my life and can appreciate how little it's going to take someone to make this thing really take off!!!! Try to get a GT-40 mold!
  #64 (permalink)  
Old 03-05-2003, 02:58 PM
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Don,
Has said it all, Now if only IMAR will come to a reasonable agreement with Don and his investors, we will bring this company back to where it belongs.

The only way "we" can loose is, if "we" run it the way it has been run in the past. And that my friend will not happen. I know many of you don't believe or may not even know that Don and I have been in direct competition with each other since the late 80's, early 90's. We simply both do the same thing. Out of this competiton a trust, friendship and an admiral respect has been made.

We've cried on each others shoulders over the rough times with CR's, we've celebrated each other for our accomplishments in this business. We BOTH have tried for years to help CR's. Volunteering 1,000's of hours of our time. They simply gave us "lip" service.

A few years ago, the body's got so bad I warned, and I do mean warned them, if they didn't fix the quality control problems, "WE- Classics by Elite" was done! I was assured they would take care of the problem, that it was from a new supplier and that he had now been instructed on the proper way to lay fiberglass. I ordered SEVEN (7) kits, advising them if they hadn't improved I would refuse delivery.

Seven kits came in....SEVEN kits were sent back, not even unloaded from the truck! Now THAT got their attention. The era of the lousy bodys came to an end on that day/

Don, you know I'm behind you more than a thousand percent! You make em' we'll build and sell them!

IMAR- I know you're there. If you pass on Dons offer, and you stay on the same self destructive path that CR's has taken so many times before, you too will find.... well lets just say your previous investment will be practically worthless.

DV..it can be done and done RIGHT.
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  #65 (permalink)  
Old 03-05-2003, 04:42 PM
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Default Don Scott built Classic Roadster Cobra

Could not resist adding how fortunate I was in having bought a few years ago , from the first owner that had to relocate, a Don Scott built Classic Roadster Cobra with only 650 miles. Total Satisfaction !!!! The New England winter really will end someday, predicting snow again tomorrow, and then pure pleasure for the first drive.

I came so close to purchasing the kit , after numerous phone calls . Initiative to inquire, judgement and discretion to make the right decision.

Don.........hope all goes well
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  #66 (permalink)  
Old 03-05-2003, 04:51 PM
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On February 19, 2003 I wrote: "I'd like to say that I'd like to see Don or DV purchase CR and "do it right" ... but I wouldn't like to put the headaches of CR onto either of these fine gentlemen!"

WOW!

Don, you da man and the best of luck with the purchase! DV, you too!

If there is anything I can do to help you two, just let me know. I'm pretty good with writing manuals and building web sites.

CR has one of the best engineered chassis out there, it's great to see that it will still be available ... but now from someone with honor.

WOW!
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  #67 (permalink)  
Old 03-05-2003, 05:27 PM
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My heart goes out to you guys. Been there. Done that. It's 1991 - '92 all over again.

The trick to completing the car is finding second sources for everything you can't - didn't get from CR. Wiring harnesses are easy to make.

I do have a complete set of VDO gauges with 160 speedo, and 7k tach. I used Autometer gauges instead. Very good price if you need gauge set to complete car.
  #68 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2003, 03:27 AM
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Don Scott and DV, my hats off to you guys. YOU two make the Classic Roadster Cobra what it is and can be. IMAR, if your listening. The sound you are currently hearing is your investment burning up. If you had any intellegence you'd sell to Don, as Classic Roadsters won't be worth a cent in you continue as you have. I will never, I repeat NEVER, purchase anything from you as long as you still own this company. You simply just DO NOT CARE about the customers. I will also never reccomend you to anyone else for future purchases. It's just not worth dealing with the BS your type lays down. To me it's worth double the money to buy and equal product from honest people. Sell now before it's too late.

Jim Downard
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  #69 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2003, 05:26 PM
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Jim,your comments need to be heard by Gary Rutherford and the whole IMAR group.We all need to be heard by these people.What they are doing just isn't right.I've been lied to so much,I don't know what to believe.I'm sure that I'm not the only one. After numerous attemps to get someone on the phone,I got to talk to Pete Johnson about the missing parts and the body damage.Doesn't know when parts will be available to ship and he stated he needs a written estimate on the body damage and they would not replace it. I got two estimates this weekend. I will fax them to Pete at CR when I receive the written estimate by thurs..The damage wasn't much,$300.-$500.,but thats not what I bought.I should mention here that the damage was conceiled by rain water when it was delivered.
After all the misleading info coming out of Classic Roadsters and now IMAR I decided to file a formal complaint with the Better Business Bureau in St. Paul MN.,which serves Fargo,ND..Gary J.Rutherford's response in part was quote)"Classic Roadsters has delivered 100% of over 8,ooo kits."The letter closes with the following statement:"Regarding repair of the claimed body damage,I don't see any way to help Mr.Robbins,unless he brings it here.If he were to do so,we would repair it."
The tone of the letter was that I was the only one complaining.I certainly have better things to do than "claiming damage".And what about that costomer service.All I need to do is bring the body from Pennsylvania to Fargo,ND. and Gary Rutherford will fix it for me!! What a guy!!!
All I want is what I paid for...OR...my money back.I'm sorry,but Gary Rutherfords business practices leave a lot to be desired.
I guess I'm venting,but hopefully it will prevent someone else from making the same mistake that I did. Based on the way I've been treated and misled from ALL at CR;I believe my dream car will never get built. All I got for my money was a pile of incomplete parts and a damaged body.
  #70 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2003, 05:42 PM
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Starwolf,
If you posted it, I missed it. You will get your car completed!
Describe the damage to me please. Pictures if at all possible, and where is Coopersburg?

DV..nothing else to say other than what has already been said
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  #71 (permalink)  
Old 01-30-2004, 11:27 AM
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Hello All...

I just registered on this board because I thought I could provide the good people whose posts I've been reading with some truths, good or bad. I worked for Leisure Industries (parent company of Classic Roadsters and Sugar Sand Jetboats) for several years until 1999. I'm usually all too willing to give a person the benefit of the doubt, but I think the gist of what I have to say is this: Gary Rutherford is a crook.

Some facts and observations about the company:

- The reason for the last change in ownership is that the company was on the verge of declaring bankruptcy (which would have been the second time).

- Gary has some very good people working for him, including some of the people whose names are unfortunately mentioned on this board in a less than positive light. I can say from experience that I was forced by Gary's business practices and sometimes by Gary's direct influence to treat customers/vendors/dealers in a way I was not at all comfortable with (The main reason I quit).

- As long as Gary is still the President, I have no confidence at all that the situation will improve beyond the first obligatory efforts of the "new management".

- Over the years, before the purchase by IMAR, Gary had been encouraged to sell many times. He would never, ever relinquish power unless there was no other option.

- Gary's reputation is Fargo is bad, to say the least. He left a lot of people in very bad situations after Leisure's first bankruptcy. For several years afterward, for example, the biggest boat dealer in Fargo refused to carry the Sugar Sand line because they had been so badly burned. (I believe they're selling them again after the change in ownership.)

It's a sad situation at Classic Roasters, always has been. Mismanagement like you would not believe. Rutherford never allowed anyone to manage (except him), therefore there effectively WAS no management. One thing I can say for Gary is that he's a talented spin doctor. Don't ever trust that he will do anything right by you, the customer. He won't. Man, I feel bad for saying all this, but I feel you all have a right to know about it. Feel free to post questions for me, I'll try to watch the board for a while.
  #72 (permalink)  
Old 01-30-2004, 12:54 PM
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Howie,

Apparently you are not aware that as of last summer, Don Scott purchased Classic Roadsters and the manufacturing operation is now in Sauk Centre. There is no longer any connection to Gary Rutherford/IMAR/Sugar Sand.
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  #73 (permalink)  
Old 01-30-2004, 01:44 PM
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Howie, I appreciate the fact that you want to set the record straight. It has been brought up many times about Gary and his "hold" on Classic. But if you would please take the time to find out the facts on what has happened since last July you would know things have changed.

I bought the entire Classic operation which includes all models. I have spent over $150k to fill all customer backorders and we are almost 100% caught up. I have all the shelves full and we have been shipping product over the last month (9 Cobras and 3 Badlands). The company has been moved to Minnesota and I have absolutely no affliation with Gary. I brought Pete with me and he has been doing a great job. The new company is Classic Roadsters II. I am very proud of what has been accomplished in the last 6 months. We no longer sell factory direct and I have setup Classics by Elite (Jay Kowalik) as the USA distributor of the entire Classic line.

I don't mean to sound irritated but this is old news and I don't want people to think the new company isn't doing what I promised.
Don Scott

As a side note, Leisure Industries was bought out by IMAR and Gary and his wife are no longer employed by them. The new CEO, Tom Eide has done a great job, production is up over 40% with the same amount of people. In the last year since the buyout IMAR is the number 1 boat mfg in the USA. They are doing very well.

Last edited by dscott; 01-30-2004 at 01:51 PM..
  #74 (permalink)  
Old 01-30-2004, 03:11 PM
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Howie,

Ok, so you were with a company and you did things you didn't want to do to the customers of the company. So... are you looking for absolution or something?

Classic Roadsters II is the company I wished I had purchased my Cobra from. Don is the type of person I LIKE to do business with ... and I'm sure Don feels just fine with the way he treats his customers!
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  #75 (permalink)  
Old 01-30-2004, 04:50 PM
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I agree with Petek. I wish I had bought my Classic from Don Scott. I have had dealings with Don while upgrading my CR. I would do business with Don any time without hesitation. I found him to be a man of his word with integrity. Don is the reason I am proud to say I own a Classic Roadster Cobra.

Paul
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