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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 10-18-2002, 06:51 PM
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Default oil temp

Bob,

Yes, I am a psycho. I do drive in this cold weather. But I find that the oil temp takes a long time to get to a point where the temp even registers on the gauges. Is this detrimental to the engine? I have an oil cooler and am wondering if there is something I should do to impede the flow of air.....?

era620
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Old 10-18-2002, 07:22 PM
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Hi era620:
Hope you don't mind me butting in, but I've had a lot of experience with oil-temperature control with my aircraft engine and high-performance engines in general. With that said, I like engine oil to operate at a minimum of 180 degrees F, or about 82 degrees C. This allows the oil in hotter areas of the engine such as the heads to reach 212 degrees F, or 100 degrees C, which boils off impurities in the oil such as the dreaded corrosion causing moisture. To do this I simply apply the old 200 mph tape over 1/2 to 2/3 of the oil cooler depending on ambient air temperature. Caution: If you're in the competition mode, don't do this because the engine should get all the cooling it can when under heavy load, so restrict it to street operation only.
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Old 10-18-2002, 07:27 PM
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Have to agree with speed220mph, I've been blocking off my oil cooler for the last month with duct tape... it does bring up the old question though... where are you taking the temp from - pan, oil line? It makes a difference

Dan
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Old 03-01-2020, 01:13 PM
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This is a really old thread, but I'm wondering about oil temp as well and it seemed better to reply to this than create a new thread. I have Smiths gauges, and my oil temp usually reads 40C. The highest I've seen is 60C, even when the oil cooler is taped. The water temp behaves normally, quickly coming up to 80-90C, where the fan does a good job maintaining water temp. I'm running 15W40, so oil pressure is about 65psi when cold. Once the oil temp comes up to 40C, the oil pressure behaves normally, i.e. comes up to ~60psi at 3k RPM, dropping down to 25 psi at idle so it seems like 40C is adequate for good lubrication. I'm just a bit concerned with not getting the oil hot enough to drive off water, etc.

I'm wondering whether the oil temp capillary is losing enough heat to affect the reading. It seems unlikely that there would be a 30C difference between oil and water temperature at steady state?

Last edited by ACHiPo; 03-01-2020 at 01:36 PM..
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Old 03-01-2020, 01:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ACHiPo View Post
I have Smiths gauges, and my oil temp never gets above 60C, even when the oil cooler is taped.
Your gauge is broken. There's no way your oil temp will stay at 60C unless you're driving in the Arctic.
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Old 03-01-2020, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickt View Post
Your gauge is broken. There's no way your oil temp will stay at 60C unless you're driving in the Arctic.
Thanks. Will send a note to Nissonger.
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Old 03-01-2020, 03:23 PM
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I dont think the gauge is broken, I live in CA My ERA oil temp rarely moved off the pin. I disconnected the oil cooler all together. For street use I dont think the oil coller is needed.
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Old 03-01-2020, 03:39 PM
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Well just pull the sensor out of the pan and stick it in a pot of boiling water.
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Old 03-01-2020, 03:40 PM
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60*C = 140*F.

If you have a good oil cooler in cold weather, this is common.

without a cooler, Oil temp will usually be sorta close to water temp. Oil is heated predominantly by RPM's. In street use, your oil will never be hot enough to need a cooler. Even with a thermostat, you could have a tough time getting the oil warm enough to work well.

People think you need to get the oil temp above 100*C to boil off the water. That just isn't true; if it was your kitchen floor would never be dry. Water will evaporate at most any temp above freezing.

But, oil does have an operating range. Oil companies keep that number close to the vest, as I have never been able to find anything specific. Above 180*F seems to be a common consensus. But racers like to see it above 200*F or so.

Studies done on military vehicles in Alaska showed that oil temps below 160*F will cause increased cylinder wall wear.

I would not recommend a 15W oil. Too thick when cold to really lube the engine well in that first 60 seconds or so; where most engine wear occurs. I would change to a 0W or 5W.
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Old 03-01-2020, 03:57 PM
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Even before I fabbed my cover, I would always get up to 80C even on a cold day, it just took longer. The cover speeds up the heat up time and keeps the oil temp around 90C on a summer day. It's easily removable by just reaching around the fender wells.


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Old 03-01-2020, 04:52 PM
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Default Oil Temp

I am in the same boat. Car came with an oil cooler but it's not needed with my Roush engine. Temp barely moves in the winter and maybe gets to 150 in the summer on the hottest of days. I am considering disconnecting it or installing an oil temp controlling valve on it.

Fred
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Old 03-01-2020, 04:58 PM
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Quote:
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I am in the same boat.
Skinny little Roushes and big burly FEs are like cats and dogs.
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Old 03-01-2020, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FredG View Post
I am in the same boat. Car came with an oil cooler but it's not needed with my Roush engine. Temp barely moves in the winter and maybe gets to 150 in the summer on the hottest of days. I am considering disconnecting it or installing an oil temp controlling valve on it.

Fred
Fred I installed a Earls sandwich thermostat on the remote oil filter housing.
Stays in 10% bypass, Starts opening @ 160f, fully open at 180f.
https://www.holley.com/products/plum...t/parts/502ERL

A nicer one is the Improved Racing integral housing and has multiple thermostats to choose from.
Remote Engine & Transmission Oil Filter Mount with Thermostat ENV-170
I like the sandwich or integral types more the the in-line as they use one less hose. (4 vs 5) and look mucho cleaner.

There are a couple of pics in my gallery of the Earls sandwich thermostat.
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Old 03-01-2020, 07:08 PM
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Patrick
I had that big burly L-72 427 in my 66 vette. Too heavy, too hot........bad on handling. It was more for panache. This engine is better. I like the oil cooler cover.


Fred

Last edited by FredG; 03-01-2020 at 07:17 PM.. Reason: text
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Old 03-02-2020, 11:13 AM
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Evan - if this helps any I took my ERA (no oil cooler) for a ride today. It was in the low 70s and my water temp peaked out about 83 C and my oil at about 82 C. Sounds like your gage could have a problem.
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Old 03-02-2020, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickt View Post
Even before I fabbed my cover, I would always get up to 80C even on a cold day, it just took longer. The cover speeds up the heat up time and keeps the oil temp around 90C on a summer day. It's easily removable by just reaching around the fender wells.
Am I seeing even more springs on your car?
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Old 03-02-2020, 11:40 AM
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Am I seeing even more springs on your car?
Yes, I love springs. They hold things down, stop rattles, they're easily removable, and they store energy. Why do you think they say "Life springs eternal?"
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Old 03-22-2020, 04:36 PM
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Update:
Took the car out for about an hour today after wrapping the oil cooler in metallized 3/8" ceramic wool thermal barrier. The air temp was in the low 60s. The water gauge read between 80C and 85C. The oil temp gauge read a tad above 40C. When I got home I put an instant read thermocouple on the remote oil filter mount and it read 180F (82C). That makes me feel better that everything (except the oil temp gauge) is working the way it should. I'm guessing either it's just a calibration issue with the bourdon tube, or the tube is cooling the liquid inside and messing up the reading. I can live with it being low, as long as the oil is not too cold.

I did hear back from Nissonger and they recommended checking calibration by pulling the bourdon tube bulb from the engine and submersing in boiling water. I may try this next time the car's on the lift. Or just live with it.

Last edited by ACHiPo; 03-22-2020 at 04:49 PM..
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Old 03-22-2020, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobcowan View Post
60*C = 140*F.

I would not recommend a 15W oil. Too thick when cold to really lube the engine well in that first 60 seconds or so; where most engine wear occurs. I would change to a 0W or 5W.
Bob,
Thanks. Not sure why I didn't see all these responses over the past few days?

Anyway, I agree the 15W40 is probably a little viscous, but everything is a compromise. The engine builder recommended 10W40 Honda motorcycle oil.
After some research I decided I'd rather have something with higher ZDDP.
Rotella has 1200 ppm ZDDP which I want for wear resistance since I'm running flat hydraulic tappets. The other option is to run race oil or add $15 of ZDDP additive every oil change. I realize the additional cost is mice nuts in the grand scheme of things, but I also have advice from an ex Chevron race oil engineer that sings the praises of diesel oils (Delo or Rotella) because of their optimum ZDDP at 1200 ppm. Delo has since reduced their ZDDP concentration and augmented their chemistry with other additives. Shell has kept the ZDDP in Rotella constant.
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Old 03-22-2020, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanEC View Post
Evan - if this helps any I took my ERA (no oil cooler) for a ride today. It was in the low 70s and my water temp peaked out about 83 C and my oil at about 82 C. Sounds like your gage could have a problem.
Dan,
Thanks. Pretty sure it's a bourdon tube issue. After my measurements I'm comfortable the engine coolant and oil temps are where they should be.
Evan
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