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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 08-15-2011, 04:32 PM
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Default FE Cooling Dilemma

Ok,
I am running Evans NPG+ with all of the purported benefits it provides, but here is the situation:

I live in Central Florida, where it rarely gets below 40 degrees, but yesterday it was 96 with a temperature index of around 105.. with 80-90 percent humidity...HOT

Car runs around 200 - 220 with NPG+, brass/copper radiator, puller fan, etc.

I also am not sure what thermostat I have, but I think its a 180 or 190 by the way the temp gauge reacts. I also have a 13lb cap, which is wrong as I have read.

My 2 options are:
1) replace the cap (4lb if I can find one), change the thermostat (insure it's 180) and try it again with the NPG+

2) Get rid of the NPG+, put in distilled water and water wetter, a new thermostat (180) and keep the 13 lb cap.... with this option, I probably wouldn't put in any antifreeze, again, it doesn't get cold down here, and when it does, my garage is warm....

Comments and suggestions appreciated.
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 08-15-2011, 05:04 PM
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Humidity only affects things that are using evaporation to cool. Like people and industrial evaporative cooling towers. So, the humidity has little affect on a car's radiator.

Are you sure the thermostat is working correctly?

Radiator big enough?

Good air flow through radiator?

Water pump moving enough water?

One or a combination of these has to be the culprit.

220 is getting warm, but 200 would not bother me.

Last edited by olddog; 08-15-2011 at 05:06 PM..
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Old 08-15-2011, 05:38 PM
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Humidity was just to emphasize HOT.

Car is an ERA, radiator has worked well since '86
Fully shrouded
Not sure about thermostat at this point
Waterpump appears to be working well
Standard pulleys, not under driven

Really wanted comment on whether it is worth it to keep the NPG+, as I heard it does sometimes increase the operating temperature, especially if you don't have an aluminum radiator, even though the engine is fine that way.

With water, I assume I should be able to get down to 180-200...
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Old 08-15-2011, 09:57 PM
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No two cars are the same, so I wouldn't put a lot of stock when reading that things like a 13 lb cap are "wrong." The smartest investment I made when I was chasing cooling problems on my car was one of the little $50 handheld infrared temp guns from Summit. Take some readings at the intake manifold water exit, the radiator inlet and outlet; you need a solid 30+ degree drop happening in your radiator to adequately cool the beast. My radiator reads around 180-190 at the inlet and about 140-145 at the outlet. This was made possible by the Taurus cooling fan (use search function to find more info).

Your #1 and #2 options are right on, but be sure to check the new t-stat in a pot of water first so you know exactly when its opening and closing (no two are the same and you sometimes have to buy a few to find one that's dead on 180 opening.) Here is Houston where the heat indexes have been at or above 100F I am running a $7 NAPA MOPAR t-stat; the one with the bigger center hole.

You don't mention whether or not you are running a recovery system and this matters on the type of cap. If you aren't expanding and recovering coolant to and from an external tank, the cap needs to be the open, non-recovery type.

If your pulleys are the same size and none of this makes an impact, the you are down to either the fan isn't drawing enough air, the water pump is failing or the radiator could be clogged and full of deposits. But if you take your time you should be able to find hot spots on the radiator face with the little gun.

One last item...retarded timing will drive temps up quick. Might be worth checking that before you dig in too far.

Good luck.
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Old 08-16-2011, 04:56 AM
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Evans coolant has a much lower heat rejection factor and can not remove the same amount of heat as say a 30% glycol/water mix. If your cooling system is maxed out Evans coolant IS NOT the solution.
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Old 08-16-2011, 05:38 AM
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Thanks for the comments, I guess I phrased the question wrong. I have already read many of the FE overheating threads, and have a good handle on the issues. What I was looking for was some comments / suggestions like Undy's, is it worth it to keep the evans, or should I change to water/waterwetter/glycol? Do the benefits of evans in the heat we have down here outweigh those of water?
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Old 08-16-2011, 06:17 AM
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I live in Phoenix where heat is a constant issue. I've found that the most expedient and probably best solution to heating issues is a Hawes Aluminum radiator. I run straight distilled water with water wetter with a 168 degree thermostat. On the hottest days, my motor will run about 195 on the hiway and may get to 205 in town. As long as I keep airflow over the radiator, it works fine. Sitting in traffic when it's hot enough to over heat the engine is not fun anyway.
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Old 08-16-2011, 08:25 AM
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If the NPG is the waterless coolant that Evans sells, its boiling point is over 400F. I don't see a problem here, except your fan shouldn't come on until at least 200F.

Water transfers heat a little better than the NPG, but everything equalizes when you allow the engine temperature to be higher.
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Old 08-16-2011, 09:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flaflier View Post
Thanks for the comments, I guess I phrased the question wrong. I have already read many of the FE overheating threads, and have a good handle on the issues. What I was looking for was some comments / suggestions like Undy's, is it worth it to keep the evans, or should I change to water/waterwetter/glycol? Do the benefits of evans in the heat we have down here outweigh those of water?
Well actually you didn't ask a question, you solicited for comments and suggestions. So...

An FE should not run consistently at 200-220 in 100F weather if the system is built and working properly. If this car were mine, I would peel back the onion and find the real problem. And I would can the Evans because I want lower operating temperatures in my engine, not higher. Frankly, if you believe what Evans says, it could be contributing to your higher operating temps.

One last item to your original item #2 comment. Anti-freeze isn't JUST for freeze prevention. It increase the boiling temp of your mixture (same concept as the Evans), it lubricates your water pump and prevents rust in your cast iron engine. If not coolant, then you need to run something to deliver these benefits if you go back to water.

Its a 15k engine; I'd install a KNOWN thermostat and go back to distilled water 50/50 with coolant and sees what happens. And I wouldn't trust a 25 year-old dash-mounted temperature gauge without checking it against a temp gun.

Just my 02...

Last edited by elmariachi; 08-16-2011 at 09:26 AM..
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Old 08-16-2011, 09:26 AM
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I'd verify your gauge is giving you an accurate reading too if you haven't done so already.

John
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Old 08-16-2011, 03:15 PM
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Thanks everyone for the comments/suggestions. I am going to replace the stat with a new, tested 180, put a 4lb cap on, and keep the evans for now. I will check the temps with a gun vs the gauge. If I can get the temps down to 190/210, I will leave the evans. If I can't, then I'm going to pitch the evans and go back to water.
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Old 08-16-2011, 04:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flaflier View Post
Thanks everyone for the comments/suggestions. I am going to replace the stat with a new, tested 180, put a 4lb cap on, and keep the evans for now. I will check the temps with a gun vs the gauge. If I can get the temps down to 190/210, I will leave the evans. If I can't, then I'm going to pitch the evans and go back to water.
What if removing the Evans were to drop it below the 190/210, would it not be worth pitching it then? I think until you baseline the car and the run it both ways, you'll never know what the real advantage is of replacing it.

Either way, good luck.
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Old 08-16-2011, 06:00 PM
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My thoughts were if I can get it to a normal temp with the evans, I would keep it, as I like it's properties, just not the increase in heat, especially in FLA. If not, I will go back to H20 and lower the temp the old fashioned way...
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Old 08-29-2011, 11:58 AM
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Ok, I installed the new thermostat, cleaned and painted my expansion tank, put a 4lb cap on, and replaced the lower hoses. Runs right around 200-210 with the evans. Not sure I am ok with that, but I am going to go a while and see.
I put a milodon high flow thermostat (2.5")
over the original one. Drilled 1/8" hole at the top as directed.


Anyone have any issues, experiences with the Milodon? or should I have stayed with the original?
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