SOHC Kirkham

[Grubby]

I think a Cammer would be most appropriate in a Kirkham or ERA. It seems like a really expensive engine for a FFR.

John

[Motorhead27]

John, that's what I was thinking, which is why I've changed the plans a little. Now I'm just trying to find out more about Kirkhams with Cammers in them. I know the foot boxes have to be modified, the FFR would have to be made for a mod motor. The headers have to be unique too, I think Kirkham has headers for this engine. Going with a Kirkham is a whole different beast, one I'm not as familiar with.

[olddog]

Well I guess you could argue that any car is an investment. There are car dealers who make a living at buying and selling them. However, for most of us I do agree with Bill that it is going to be a negative investment.

I understand Bill's point, but do not know any history the two of you may have. That said I also disagree a little with him. It would, in my humble opinion, be stupid to put a 40K engine into a Streetbeast. I don't care how well you build it, I would never buy it from you and pay more than what the individual parts in the car was worth minus my labor to disassemble it.

Of course the amount of money you will loose, when you sell a Cobra, is proportional to the reputation of the manufacturer, as well as the thought put into the car as a package.

FFR is a good kit designed for small blocks. Yes, you can put an FE in them, but FFR, from my talking to them, will steer you toward a small block as will many others. It is also not designed to be true to the original cars. It's a fine car that fits the desires of many people, but not what I would put a cammer in.

If you can afford it go Kirkham - I think keith Craft can set you up with exactly what you want.

[Motorhead27]

Originally Posted by olddog

Well I guess you could argue that any car is an investment. There are car dealers who make a living at buying and selling them. However, for most of us I do agree with Bill that it is going to be a negative investment.

I understand Bill's point, but do not know any history the two of you may have. That said I also disagree a little with him. It would, in my humble opinion, be stupid to put a 40K engine into a Streetbeast. I don't care how well you build it, I would never buy it from you and pay more than what the individual parts in the car was worth minus my labor to disassemble it.

Of course the amount of money you will loose, when you sell a Cobra, is proportional to the reputation of the manufacturer, as well as the thought put into the car as a package.

FFR is a good kit designed for small blocks. Yes, you can put an FE in them, but FFR, from my talking to them, will steer you toward a small block as will many others. It is also not designed to be true to the original cars. It's a fine car that fits the desires of many people, but not what I would put a cammer in.

If you can afford it go Kirkham - I think keith Craft can set you up with exactly what you want.

Your reasoning is the same reasoning why I'm going with Kirkham. Bill's advice doesn't really matter here, although good advice. I'm not planning on this car as an investment, that's not the purpose of it or even close to the devotion behind it. I know these cars aren't good investments, I've been around long enough to know that. I'm new here, but I've been a regular over on FFCars for a long time. That is where me and Bill know each other and the background behind my reply to him here. Kirkham has a great reputation, one you can feel good about dropping this engine in. FFR isn't cut out for this engine, plain and simple. If life took a turn for the worse and I had to part with my favorite vehicle (and engine), a Kirkham would have a better return than a FFR would with this engine. That is the reason why I have to be smart about the choice of brand. The build plan for the FFR was actually not far off from what this plan would cost. Partly due to the engine. Kirkham is what made the most sense.

Now onto other parts of the plan. I also plan on painting the Cobra, Lexus Spectra Blue Mica with silver stripes, I haven't decided on the exact silver. I'm also planning on doing an interior similar to this one, but in black leather with blue carbon fiber inserts. So this won't be your regular Kirkham either. I was planning on doing the interior myself on the FFR, and that wouldn't change with a Kirkham. I can be very particular and OCD on some things, this build would be one of them.

[patrickt]

Joe, if you put a cammer in a Kirkham, paint it blue, and then put in that hideous interior, you are absolutely, positively, guaranteed to lose your ass on any resale. The only benefit I can see from going with an ERA instead is that there would be about a year lag time while you waited in line and, hopefully, you would come to your senses. If you must do it, do it to an FFR.

[Motorhead27]

The interior isn't exactly like that one, just the quality of it is what I mean. But, painting a Kirkham and then doing a different interior, well, not everyone will like it. Some will see it as messing with a classic standard. Some might actually like it. In the end though, the car is designed for me and what I want. The resale thing is just should life go south, a Kirkham would be a better choice than a FFR with this engine. I don't actually plan on selling this car once I own it, ever. When I say life going south, I mean you're out of options and pretty screwed up no matter what you do. This isn't meant to be sold again.

[Dimis]

Originally Posted by Motorhead27

The interior isn't exactly like that one, just the quality of it is what I mean. But, painting a Kirkham and then doing a different interior, well, not everyone will like it. Some will see it as messing with a classic standard. Some might actually like it. In the end though, the car is designed for me and what I want. The resale thing is just should life go south, a Kirkham would be a better choice than a FFR with this engine. I don't actually plan on selling this car once I own it, ever. When I say life going south, I mean you're out of options and pretty screwed up no matter what you do. This isn't meant to be sold again.

Ignore my previous post...
It sounds like you have already made up your mind... and are looking to us for justification.

I'm sure you'll love the Kirkham...

PS: You don't need our justification...
PPS: In the end it will be sold... even if you aren't around to see it sold

Good luck

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Joe, if you put a cammer in a Kirkham, paint it blue, and then put in that hideous interior, you are absolutely, positively, guaranteed to lose your ass on any resale.

If you must do it, do it to an FFR.

This was approximately my first reaction. But you know what? Do what makes you happy, but be prepared to "write off" the cost (plus the cost to return it back to original spec) of the interior and any other deviations from the typical Kirkham/CSX/ERA build.

As for a SOHC engine in a FFR, my advice would be to not install a $100,000 state-of-the-art home theater system into $50,000 house in a lower-priced neighborhood in Any City, USA.

[Motorhead27]

The interior costs, because it would be done by me, wouldn't cost that much actually. A basic interior, doesn't cost much in a Cobra. The interior I'd put in would cost more, but not a huge amount. So if I was to rip it out and bring it back to stock, it's not a major issue. The bulk of the cost is in the engine and the vehicle. And like I said before, who knows, maybe people will like it for a modern Cobra feel.

I like the comparison between a FFR and a cammer with a house and an expensive theater system.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by Motorhead27

I like the comparison between a FFR and a cammer with a house and an expensive theater system.

Another way to say it is that you don't want to own that $1,000,000 house (cost basis) in a neighborhood of $250,000 houses. Your car's value will regress towards the mean.

[Stentor]

Originally Posted by Motorhead27

The build plan for the FFR was actually not far off from what this plan would cost. Partly due to the engine. Kirkham is what made the most sense.

It looks like you are suggesting that you would have almost as much in the FFR build as the Kirkham (in terms of cost)? How much money are you projecting you would have in each build (not sure the math adds up)?

As others have stated--at the end of the day, it's your car (so you should build it how you want). However, resale would likely be challenging in either case (a Kirkham finished in a way that's not aligned with the tastes of the vast majority of potential buyers; and a FFR car that's way beyond the typical budget of a prospective buyer).