Big Dig Tunnel Thrill Ride

[wtm442]

Jams

Begin???????
Your a week late. Get out of bed!
You'd make a lousy politician

[chopper]

From today's Boston Globe:

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/edi...mbling_legacy/

How could anybody possibly blame the Dems for anything?

[wtm442]

Saturday Boston Herald Front page headline

"They Used Duct Tape to Fix Bolts".

Yowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

Then when you get into the article, you find out they taped the bolts in the hole while the epoxy set up. They they removed the tape. Simple.

But headlines sells papers

[Ron61]

I saw a small piece in our local paper yesterday that they had found some more bolts in another part of the tunnel that weren't in right and were going to inspect it. Don't they do any maintenance on those tunnels at all?

Ron

[wtm442]

Maintenance? Whats that? One of the tunnels was "supposed" to be opened tomorrow. Now they say it will be at least 2 more weeks.

This is the most important time for Gov Mitt Romney. He has been silently running for president all this year. He has been out of state more than in state this year (maybe that is not so bad - wish we could do that with our senators).

If Romney falls down on this big-dig crap, it will kill his chances. Of course, all of the Democrats are lining up trying to defeat the Lt Gov for office later this year. What a soap-opera!

[Ron61]

I saw an article in our paper this morning that the political candidates already have teams going around trying to dig up dirt on the opponents. Why doesn't one of them try something really different and run on their record instead of the opponents dirty laundry?

That would probably be the end of most careers.

Ron

[wtm442]

Originally Posted by Ron61

..... trying to dig up dirt on the opponents.

There is already too much dirt in the BIG DIG. This mess will go on for at least a year!

[Ron61]

Just a year? That would be a record. Out here it takes at least two years to just get a sidewalk fixed if it falls apart.

Ron

[wtm442]

How many people are inconvienenced by a damaged sidewalk? A few.

How many people in a large city are pissed off when one of the major roads are closed? Hundreds of thousands.

I'm just glad I do not have to drive thru Boston or get to the airport, like I did when I was employed (do not want to swear and use that 4 letter word that starts with a "w").

The "year" I mentioned is in regards to the roof panels. The mess about the entire big dig will live forever, even after it is replaced in 50 years.

[Ron61]

Warren,

Ask the people of San Francisco how many people are inconvenienced by a damaged sidewalk. When they were building BART, they tore some of the sidewalks up on Market street and also Battery Street. Only for a day or so until they could get a temporary set up. Two months later they were still not able to use them. Battery Street has the finincial area on it somewhat like Wall street. Those people are not accostomed to walking more than a few feet. However, you are correct that a main highway is a lot more inconvenience. And we have tunnels here. Try getting on BART and then have it go down while you are under the Bay. Really some experience.But now if it is going to be for more than an hour, they have ways for the people to exit the train and walk a few miles through maintenance tunnels between the main ones to get back above ground.

Ron

[mxcobra]

We sould start taking bets as to when it will open......

[Ron61]

Dave,

Sounds good. Maybe just in time for Warren to take a drive through it and rev his car up again and cause another piece to fall.

Ron

[Ron61]

Just saw this on the latest news headlines on my home page. This tunnel may never be finished.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060725/ap_on_re_us/big_dig

Ron

[wtm442]

If I had the chance to take over the Big Dig project, I'd make sure that all the bolts were checked by my personal assistant ....

[Sizzler]

Originally Posted by chopper

From today's Boston Globe:

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/edi...mbling_legacy/

How could anybody possibly blame the Dems for anything?

You're a prime candidate for terrorist aren't you.
You'll blindly swallow any doctrine as long as it is spewed forth by the Church of the Republicans.

Here's the unvarnished truth: There is no true (political) faith.

They're all pretty much whatever whoever is paying them wants them to be.

Democrats, Republicans, Independents, all are proof of the theory of evolution in that they only care about preserving their own careers/lives and passing on their accumulated wealth/power to the next generation. They will evolve their positions, their "understanding of the issue" to further their aims of self-preservation and passing on their "genes" (campaign funds).

In this particular instance, while there are a lot of people to legitimately point fingers at, including Democrats, it is pretty clearly the Republicans who messed up this time.

Yes, Democrats got the Federal Goverment to fund the project, but it took the Republican autocrats in charge of things at the 'payment and oversite' level to make this a murder scene. Sort of like FEMA. Yeah, it had problems under the Democrats, but it was under the Republican appointed leadership that showed just how important good management is.

Tax and spend, borrow and spend, at least the Democrats realize that we're not living in a fairytale world.

The public works project was spawned during the administration of Governor Michael S. Dukakis, a Democrat. The Bay State's congressional delegation kept it pumped with billions in federal dollars. A powerful Democrat -- the late, legendary House Speaker Thomas P. ``Tip" O'Neill Jr., who died in 1994 -- helped secure much of the funding. But, for 16 years, Republicans -- William F. Weld, Paul Cellucci, Jane M. Swift, and Romney -- ruled the executive branch and, for most of that time, the Turnpike Authority board, whose chairman oversees the Big Dig. Amorello is a Republican, as were his two predecessors, Andrew S. Natsios and James J. Kerasiotes. Cellucci reluctantly forced Kerasiotes to leave the job in 2000, after a federal audit charged that project managers concealed $1.4 billion in cost overruns. Actual Big Dig defects -- leaks, slurry wall deficiencies, and the ceiling collapse -- came to light while Romney was in office.

As a gubernatorial candidate in 2002, Romney called for merging the Turnpike Authority into the state Highway Department, a move he said would save money and consolidate control in the executive branch. State legislators thwarted his efforts. As governor, Romney also asked the state Supreme Judicial Court if he has the power to ``de-designate" Amorello for `mismanagement, neglect of duty, and/or fiscal irresponsibility." Under Massachusetts law, the Turnpike Authority operates as an independent entity.

[wtm442]

Sizzler

Sorry to disagree. No party is to blame. Not Republicans, not Democrats, not Independents.

No company is actually to blame. A company is nothing more than a bunch of people working together to make a profit.

The system is to blame. Politicians who are elected should NOT have authority on complex construction projects.

When Shell or Mobil build hugh offshore platforms or refineries, they do not have the problems we see when the project is government related.

Just my 3 cents worth

[Ron61]

Wasn't it Bob Hope that once said the Govt. meddling could screw up a wet dream?

Ron

[Don]

The Massachusetts AG is reviewing both civil and criminal cases:

John J. Keaveney, on-site safety officer for the Interstate 90 connector tunnel -- in a starkly-worded two-page memo sent in 1999 to Robert Coutts, senior project manager for Modern Continental -- wrote that he could not ``comprehend how this structure can withhold the test of time." (Globe Staff Photo / John Bohn)

Memo warned of ceiling collapse
Safety officer feared deaths in '99, now agonizes over tragedy
By Sean P. Murphy, Globe Staff | July 26, 2006

The on-site safety officer for the Interstate 90 connector directly warned his superiors at contractor Modern Continental Construction Co. that the tunnel ceiling could collapse because the bolts could not support the heavy concrete panels, and feared for his conscience if someone died as a result.

John J. Keaveney -- in a starkly-worded two-page memo sent in 1999 to Robert Coutts, senior project manager for Modern Continental -- wrote that he could not ``comprehend how this structure can withhold the test of time."

Keaveney added: ``Should any innocent State Worker or member of the Public be seriously injured or even worse killed as a result, I feel that this would be something that would reflect Mentally and Emotionally upon me, and all who are trying to construct a quality Project."

Keaveney, in an interview last night, said that after he raised the concern, his superiors at Modern Continental, the company then building the tunnel, and representatives from Bechtel/Parsons Brinckerhoff, the private sector manager of the Big Dig, sought to reassure him. They told him that such a system had been tested and was proven to work.

He said Coutts told him, `` `John, this is a tried and true method,' " he recalled. He also raised the concern in person with Bechtel/Parsons Brinckerhoff officials in subsequent conversations, but they said simply that they were doing the work to design specifications and that the ceiling would hold.

Andrew Paven, a spokesman for Bechtel/Parsons Brinckerhoff, declined to comment last night.

Efforts to reach representatives of Modern Continental last night were unsuccessful. Coutts was on vacation and unavailable, a family member said last night.

Keaveney's memo, written May 17, 1999, while the ceiling was being installed, almost eerily foretells the collapse that crushed Milena Del Valle to death two weeks ago.

Investigations launched after Del Valle's death are increasingly focused on the bolt-and-epoxy system and why concrete panels weighing as much as 2,800 pounds were hung from the ceiling bolts without reinforcement. Keaveney's memo is the strongest evidence that the contractor on the I-90 project was given specific warning of the risks of the ceiling system.

Keaveney told the Globe that he was not alone in his worries and that he decided to write the memo to reflect what he called the collective concerns being voiced among ironworkers installing the ceiling and other Modern Continental employees on the scene that the ceiling wouldn't hold.

Keaveney wrote in the memo that the amount of weight being suspended from the ceiling appeared to be ``excessive," given that the bolts were ``only inserted into concrete with epoxy."

He also said that he observed water dripping down out of the holes that construction workers drilled before the epoxy and bolts were inserted. Given the water pressure on the tunnel ceiling, he asked whether the epoxy would hold. ``I question whether the epoxy is suitable for a wet environment and how long can it withstand that force?" he wrote.

In the memo, he outlined other major concerns about the soundness of the ceiling system, including that the bolts and tiebacks were ``exposed to the elements" prior to their installation, sitting on pallets, and appeared to have signs of rust.

He also wrote that the bolts ``will be subject to horizontal and lateral movement . . . every time the Vent Building utilizes the Ventilation fans."

Keaveney wrote in his memo that while workers were doing the project according to specifications, he worried that when the state took control of the tunnel, maintenance and vigilance would be neglected.

``My concerns are for that of the State when they assume control. They have a record of poor maintenance, and I just can envision that these sections will not receive the constant vigilance it would require," he wrote.

Keaveney was so worried about the ceiling weight that he urged that all workers be prohibited from working underneath the ceiling until he could ``receive assurances from Independent Engineers that the fastening method is sound immediately after installation." He also urged that workers working above the ceiling be harnessed in case the ceiling gave way.

Keaveney, who was paid a salary of approximately $70,000 on the I-90 project, was responsible for on-site safety in the I-90 connector.

Keaveney, 43, who received his engineering degree from the University College Galway in Ireland, has had a long career in construction and is now safety officer for Shawmut Design and Construction, based in Boston.

Keaveney's letter was mailed to a Globe reporter without Keaveney's knowledge. He was contacted and verified it was his letter.

He said he really began to worry about the ceiling after a third-grade class from his hometown of Norwell came to visit the Big Dig for a tour in spring 1999. He showed the class some concrete ceiling panels and pointed to the bolts protruding from the ceiling, explaining that the panels would one day hang from those bolts.

A third-grade girl raised her hand and asked him, ``Will those things hold up the concrete?"

He started voicing concerns among his colleagues and then to managers after that. ``It was like the [third-graders] had pointed out the emperor has no clothes," he said. ``I said, `Yes, it would hold,' but then I thought about it."

He travels frequently and was in New York City on a job when Del Valle was killed. He returned to Boston July 12 and was watching the television news with this wife when the story came on.

``I said, `Oh, my God,' that's my job," he said.

Keaveney said he blames himself. ``I am part of the problem," he said. ``I failed to open my mouth. I failed to push the letter I wrote for results. I am partially responsible for the death of this mother."

``Oh, yeah, it has been very difficult," he said, his eyes welling up with tears.

He said he has not been able to sleep since it happened. ``I failed there. There's nothing I can do about it now."

[jams]

Now I know why engineers built a tunnel instead of a bridge.....If they build a bridge they would have nothing to epoxy the bolts to!

[wtm442]

Jams
One of the parts of the Big Dig was a new bridge. Sorry

That bridge will not start to fall down until all of the ceiling panels are fixed. Us Massachusiens like to spread out our fiascoes!