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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 06-22-2018, 01:25 PM
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Default CSX2196 pics before Sebring 1964?

Can anyone point me to pictures of CSX2196 prior to being modified for Sebring in 1964?

I have a couple of Friedman pictures of the 427 being installed, and one of Bondurant testing at Riverside, but I'd really like to see more.

Thanks........Bill
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Old 06-23-2018, 03:27 AM
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Hi Bill,

I think this is CSX2196 at Sebring in 1963....
***correction: this is Sebring, '64 ***




Cheers,
Glen

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Old 06-23-2018, 01:55 PM
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Thanks, Glen...it's a nice picture, but I think it is actually the 1964 race. The info I have says that Sebring 1964 was the first race of that version of the car.

I'm hoping to find some pictures of the car as tested at Riverside in 1963 when it still had wire wheels.
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Old 06-23-2018, 05:16 PM
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Bill, I’d love to see the Riverside picture.
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Old 06-23-2018, 05:29 PM
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I'll try to scan it and post it tomorrow evening, Craig.
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Old 06-23-2018, 08:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mudhenk27 View Post
Thanks, Glen...it's a nice picture, but I think it is actually the 1964 race. The info I have says that Sebring 1964 was the first race of that version of the car.

I'm hoping to find some pictures of the car as tested at Riverside in 1963 when it still had wire wheels.
You are definitely correct Bill; it's Sebring 1964 at the car's debut race.
I read in the Registry that Miles' co-driver, John Morton, had never driven a race Cobra of any type previously, so his race debut was in the extremely powerful and 'evil' handling CSX2196

Cheers,
Glen
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Old 06-24-2018, 09:04 AM
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Here you go, Craig. I apparently remembered the date incorrectly. It looks like the engine was installed in 1963, but tested in 1964.
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Old 06-24-2018, 10:07 AM
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Here's the installation.
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Old 06-24-2018, 10:39 AM
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Thanks Bill!
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Old 09-03-2021, 08:21 PM
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Default Confused by ref, to Miles-Morton prototype Sebring '64

I am looking at a new book on Cobra and it shows that car , each time calling it a 427 Cobra in the captions.


Factually that writer steps into the same sand trap as many a writer trying to describe the prototype big block entered in Sebring in 1964 .He calls it a 427 and so do several other sources But if it was CSX2196 it was an aluminum 390 (a big block) going into a leaf spring chassis.(Production big blocks were in the CSX3000 SN range) Yet the usually reliable site Racing Sports Cars
says CSX2196 (https://www.racingsportscars.com/pho...964-03-21.html) was a 427 Cobra. This is the car with three Ferrari 250GTO style nostrils above the grille.

I think it should be identified during that race as the 390 Cobra.They weren't fooling the FIA because it was run as a prototype hence there was no limit on engine size.
He also mentions it was tossed into the scrapheap after the race when there's rumors it is in France wearing a replica Daytona coupe body; Half the sources I looked up say it evolved into the flip-top prototype which is in turn identified in many articles as CSX2166. If the author can't solve the SN conundrum he can at least identify the car that Miles hit the tree with as a 390, not a 427 though, true, it was built to see if a big block Cobra would be controllable. (It wasn't-it crashed but they scheduled the 427 Cobra as a production car anyway)
I'd like to quote The Bible , the registry, but don't have it, I wished I would have talked to the flip-top owner when he was at Pebble. It was there on display in 2021.
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Old 09-03-2021, 09:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Historybuff View Post
I am looking at a new book on Cobra and it shows that car , each time calling it a 427 Cobra in the captions.


Factually that writer steps into the same sand trap as many a writer trying to describe the prototype big block entered in Sebring in 1964 .He calls it a 427 and so do several other sources But if it was CSX2196 it was an aluminum 390 (a big block) going into a leaf spring chassis.(Production big blocks were in the CSX3000 SN range) Yet the usually reliable site Racing Sports Cars
says CSX2196 (https://www.racingsportscars.com/pho...964-03-21.html) was a 427 Cobra. This is the car with three Ferrari 250GTO style nostrils above the grille.

I think it should be identified during that race as the 390 Cobra.They weren't fooling the FIA because it was run as a prototype hence there was no limit on engine size.
He also mentions it was tossed into the scrapheap after the race when there's rumors it is in France wearing a replica Daytona coupe body; Half the sources I looked up say it evolved into the flip-top prototype which is in turn identified in many articles as CSX2166. If the author can't solve the SN conundrum he can at least identify the car that Miles hit the tree with as a 390, not a 427 though, true, it was built to see if a big block Cobra would be controllable. (It wasn't-it crashed but they scheduled the 427 Cobra as a production car anyway)
I'd like to quote The Bible , the registry, but don't have it, I wished I would have talked to the flip-top owner when he was at Pebble. It was there on display in 2021.
I was at Pebble and I talk to him about it being a 2000 series yet it had a big block. He told me it was a one off prototype.
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Old 09-04-2021, 05:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Historybuff View Post
I am looking at a new book on Cobra and it shows that car , each time calling it a 427 Cobra in the captions.


Factually that writer steps into the same sand trap as many a writer trying to describe the prototype big block entered in Sebring in 1964 .He calls it a 427 and so do several other sources But if it was CSX2196 it was an aluminum 390 (a big block) going into a leaf spring chassis.(Production big blocks were in the CSX3000 SN range) Yet the usually reliable site Racing Sports Cars
says CSX2196 (https://www.racingsportscars.com/pho...964-03-21.html) was a 427 Cobra. This is the car with three Ferrari 250GTO style nostrils above the grille.

I think it should be identified during that race as the 390 Cobra.They weren't fooling the FIA because it was run as a prototype hence there was no limit on engine size.
He also mentions it was tossed into the scrapheap after the race when there's rumors it is in France wearing a replica Daytona coupe body; Half the sources I looked up say it evolved into the flip-top prototype which is in turn identified in many articles as CSX2166. If the author can't solve the SN conundrum he can at least identify the car that Miles hit the tree with as a 390, not a 427 though, true, it was built to see if a big block Cobra would be controllable. (It wasn't-it crashed but they scheduled the 427 Cobra as a production car anyway)
I'd like to quote The Bible , the registry, but don't have it, I wished I would have talked to the flip-top owner when he was at Pebble. It was there on display in 2021.
Hey Wally,

At Sebring, the car had a 427 in it. After it was converted to the flip-top, it had the experimental alloy 390 motor. When it was later sold by Shelby American it had a 427 in it again. Apparently the original aluminum body was pulled from the scrap heap and hangs in somebody's garage.

Perhaps you should consider buying a copy of the registry someday. Does SAAC have a list of people that they refuse to sell merchandise to and Wally is at the top of the list? If so maybe you could get a used copy of eBay.
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