427 Aluminum block Shelby motors

[tedster427]

Wanted to know about any motors leaking out the rear main, and how to fix. I've had 3 leakers. HELP. I'm about to go to the "old rope"!

[Jac Mac]

I assume you tried all the usual tricks. Offset the seal from the rear main cap approx 1/4"( one up-one down), removed the rope pin?,checked the knurl in the crank surface acts to return the oil to the pan( found on reverse rotation- marine cranks), oil gallery or cam bore plugs at rear of block.

[Excaliber]

This has been an issue with the Shelby alloy blocks for some time. That and the fact that they need considerable machine work before there actually ready to assemble. Check with the Shelby camp to see if they offer any warranty repair solutions (don't hold your breath).

Don't worry to much about the oil leak, after all, what you 'really' bought was the cool NAME!

[DP935]

There was a post on the FE board about enlarging the oil return holes, I believe, in the rear main bearing cap. I think Keith or George have mentioned this also and hopefully they can go into more detail. My Shelby engine was built in 2003 and so far no leaks.

[chuckbrandt]

Here is the discussion from the FE forum. It involves opening up the rear main oil drain back and also modifying any windage tray and pan blockages below it.

This is something to check on all FEs, mine leaks a bit too.

http://www.network54.com/Forum/74182/thread/1132207998/

I take no credit for the information, just parrotting what I think is some pretty good info! Mike Braun did all the work and made the original post.
- Chuck

And the pictures are:
George at Gessford milling rear main cap for ARP stud clearance

As delivered shelby oil drain back

Opened up shelby drain back

Opened up shelby drain back

Pan interference

Pan mod

Canton Windage Tray interference

Canton Windage Train mod

[DP935]

Thanks Chuck, I printed out the information this time so I would'nt loose it, if and when I might need the modification.
Mike

[Excaliber]

Chuck says, "this is something that should be checked on all FE's".

I guess you mean all SHELBY blocks. The 'REAL' FE's do not have this problem, there is 'nothing to check'.
EDIT: I run a Canton road race pan and windage tray on my original FE, which I built myself. There are NO leaks, period, dry as a bone on the bottom of the motor!

Personally, if I paid the BIG BUCKS for a Shelby block I'd be mad as hell. Shelby KNOWS it is a design flaw and has taken steps to correct the problem with FUTURE blocks.

Is there any warranty or machine shop expense reimbursement for the old blocks?

[chuckbrandt]

I'm quite certain my pan, windage tray, gaskets do not have the cutouts shown and it seems like that could be the cause of my however slight rear main leak. I'm pretty sure the drainback is in the same spot on a "Real FE".

EDIT: Okay Ernie, you're the expert

Chuck

[767Jockey]

In looking into aftermarket Aluminum blocks, I was surprised to learn that the Shelby block is in fact NOT a true Sideoiler block, but rather more of a center oiler configuration. While I realize that for street use the Sideoiler configuration is not necessary, the fact that it's going in a Cobra would make the Sideoiler configuration that much more desireable. I'm told that the Dove, Genesis and Pond blocks are true Sideoilers and in fact are almost identical in appearance to the original blocks, for those of us seeking a higher level of authenticity. Can anyone with more knowledge on this than I comment? Sal?

[Excaliber]

Chuck, just applying 'logic' to this situation.

Location of the drain back holes on a real FE has never been an issue or pointed out as a cause of rear main seal leakage. Nor have I heard to date of any modifications required to an after market pan to address such a leak.

Therefore I would have to conclude the location on the Shelby block is NOT the same as the original FE blocks. However, original FE rear main seal leakage in general HAS been something of a problem over the years. If it is not installed with great care, it WILL leak! But heck thats true of most motors.

The fact that the Shelby isn't a side oiler is neither here nor there to me. Genesis, Dove, Shelby or who ever, there all 'replicas'.

I thought Dove makes a iron block side oiler with a C5AE engine number cast into the block, just like back in the day? That may be the 'most accurate' of all the after market blocks. But I'm not sure it comes in alloy with the numbers cast into the block.

[Power Surge]

There's no reason to have a side oiler block, other than being able to say you have a side oiler block. That is, unless you plan to run your car at LeMans for 12 or 24hrs straight. And even then, oil system improvements and better parts tecnology have improved these motors vastly over the past 40 years.

You aren't just paying for Shelby's name on the Shelby block. It is, without a doubt, the strongest FE block you can buy. With it's main design, and valley webbing layout, it's the top dog of FE blocks.

The other aftermarket blocks are great also. While they don't have the overall block strength as the CS block, honestly, who really needs it? The Genesis or Pond blocks should easily handle more power than anyone could ever put to use in a Cobra.

If I were going to buy an aftermarket FE block (and someday I will), it would be an aluminum Pond block. They have had the least issues, and have the most accurate casting to an original side oiler block.

[Burgs]

Originally Posted by Excaliber

I thought Dove makes a iron block side oiler with a CAE5 engine number cast into the block, just like back in the day? That may be the 'most accurate' of all the after market blocks. But I'm not sure it comes in alloy with the numbers cast into the block.

The Pond alloy block has both the casting number, and a date code under the oil filter mount.

[ST]

Just curious but shouldn't that casting number be upside down?

Here's an original side oiler.

[Excaliber]

Eh eh, gotta love that! THATS what I'm talking about when a guy is in search of TRUE originality!

As I've said many times, reaching for the highest levels of authenticity is a worthy goal, and by far most of us fall short (it's OK). But I certainly admire those 'keepers of the flame', at least I'll KNOW where I fall short!

Thanks ST!

[767Jockey]

[quote=Power Surge]There's no reason to have a side oiler block, other than being able to say you have a side oiler block. That is, unless you plan to run your car at LeMans for 12 or 24hrs straight. And even then, oil system improvements and better parts tecnology have improved these motors vastly over the past 40 years.


Sal,
I couldn't agree more. However, when folks on the street see your Cobra, I'll bet the first three things asked, in order, are:

1- Is it real? I can't imagine how tiring it must get to keep answering this question. Then again, I can't wait to find out!

2- Is it a 427 under the hood? Assuming the question is yes,

3- Is it a sideoiler? Granted it's not a feature needed anymore, and granted the vast majority of people asking this question have no idea what a sideolier even is, but having to explain one less thing to the casual observer is worth it to me, amongst other reasons.

Many of us, myself eventually included, buy these cars to fulfill childhood dreams, and to fulfill promises we made to ourselves. As a child, looking at the poster on the wall year after year, my Cobra was always blue with white stripes, and had a 427 sideoiler in it. You can be sure that when my day finally comes, my Cobra will be blue with white stripes, and have a 427FE sideoiler in it. Logic and reason will have nothing to do wiith it. I made a promise to that 13 year old boy in me too many years ago, and I'm going to fulfill it. No logic, no reason, just passion. It's time.

[jdog]

[quote=767Jockey]

Originally Posted by Power Surge

There's no reason to have a side oiler block, other than being able to say you have a side oiler block. That is, unless you plan to run your car at LeMans for 12 or 24hrs straight. And even then, oil system improvements and better parts tecnology have improved these motors vastly over the past 40 years.
Sal,
I couldn't agree more. However, when folks on the street see your Cobra, I'll bet the first three things asked, in order, are:

1- Is it real? I can't imagine how tiring it must get to keep answering this question. Then again, I can't wait to find out!

2- Is it a 427 under the hood? Assuming the question is yes,

3- Is it a sideoiler? Granted it's not a feature needed anymore, and granted the vast majority of people asking this question have no idea what a sideolier even is, but having to explain one less thing to the casual observer is worth it to me, amongst other reasons.

Many of us, myself eventually included, buy these cars to fulfill childhood dreams, and to fulfill promises we made to ourselves. As a child, looking at the poster on the wall year after year, my Cobra was always blue with white stripes, and had a 427 sideoiler in it. You can be sure that when my day finally comes, my Cobra will be blue with white stripes, and have a 427FE sideoiler in it. Logic and reason will have nothing to do wiith it. I made a promise to that 13 year old boy in me too many years ago, and I'm going to fulfill it. No logic, no reason, just passion. It's time.

I agree, accept it's black, w/no stripe!

jdog
P.S. And I can answer: Yes, Yes, Yes!

[computerworks]

jdog... not one single picture?

[strictlypersonl]

Originally Posted by 767Jockey

In looking into aftermarket Aluminum blocks, I was surprised to learn that the Shelby block is in fact NOT a true Sideoiler block, but rather more of a center oiler configuration. While I realize that for street use the Sideoiler configuration is not necessary, the fact that it's going in a Cobra would make the Sideoiler configuration that much more desireable. I'm told that the Dove, Genesis and Pond blocks are true Sideoilers and in fact are almost identical in appearance to the original blocks, for those of us seeking a higher level of authenticity. Can anyone with more knowledge on this than I comment? Sal?

It's my understanding that the Shelby block is loosely based not on the FE block, but on some highly modified GM configuration. Doesn't make it better or worse, unless you're looking for that oil passage on the left side.


Sideoiler FE

[jdog]

Originally Posted by computerworks

jdog... not one single picture?

OK, here is one, CSX4795 at Shelby in Las Vegas last Sunday:




jdog
P.S. Check my photo gallery for a larger picture.