Really fed up with expansion tank leaks.

undy · #1 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 05:14 AM

I'm currently running a OEM style brass expansion tank on my FE. The repeated leaks, typically from where the elbow from the intake enters the tank on the tank's bottom, are really getting old. This tank's been repaired 3 times thus far. I like the OEM look but I'm ready to make the leap to aluminum or stainless for durability. My problem is.. the tank is custom made. The elbow's been chopped to drop the tank down some for hood clearance issues. I don't think the aluminum or stainless tanks offer what I need. I can take some relative measurements of the tank, height and outward spacing. Is there any vendors that are willing to take the time and possibly compare some measurements?

I'd already tried a board vendor's "standard" stainless offering and it was almost 1/2" too tall. The hood rested on it and still lacked 1" from closing. Any help or suggestions?

If I can't find anything I'll clean up the leaking joint and repair it myself with some hi-tensile, silver bearing soft solder I have. I have a HVAC background so soldering is sort of second nature. With this solder you can actually build a respectable shoulder on your solder joints which should enhance it's vibration surviveability.

Dave

xracerbob · #2 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 06:02 AM

The tank ERA offers has been lowered around 3/4" of an inch for clearance. You might try that one.

I bought a used (pressure tested) tank on Ebay for $15 and had a very experienced radiator restoration company lower the tank and move the hose connection to the correct side. Did a great job for about $100.

Here is who did it:
http://www.highlandradiator.com/

undy · #3 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 06:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xracerbob

The tank ERA offers has been lowered around 3/4" of an inch for clearance. You might try that one.

I bought a used (pressure tested) tank on Ebay for $15 and had a very experienced radiator restoration company lower the tank and move the hose connection to the correct side. Did a great job for about $100.

Here is who did it:
http://www.highlandradiator.com/

ERA, according to their web site, only offers a brass tank. I want to get away from the brass tanks, as I'd stated. They're a leak waiting to happen.

Dave

EarlsflyinCobra · #4 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 06:59 AM

You could go this way..................................

http://www.clubcobra.com/classifieds...uct=1498&cat=4

undy · #5 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 07:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EarlsflyinCobra

You could go this way..................................

http://www.clubcobra.com/classifieds...uct=1498&cat=4

The locations/angle for the outlet hose and tank inlet are all different from the "OEM" style unit. Since it's a Dove, did you have it pressure tested? If I can't find what I'm looking for it might be an option.

Dave

Rick Parker · #6 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 08:40 AM

Dave:
I think you are looking for a one of deal using the OEM tank. If it has been cut down to reduce the height, is the plate normally used as a brace still part of the assembly. Your remarks about using Silver Solder are a very sound. It is much stronger than lead type and less prone to damage from expansion, and the violent shaking these heavily cammed motors exibit. Check you radiator cap too, it may be rated too high for what these tanks were originally intended for (13# was max as I recall(???).
You're on the right track if you know how to Silver Solder well.

undy · #7 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Parker

Dave:
I think you are looking for a one of deal using the OEM tank. If it has been cut down to reduce the height, is the plate normally used as a brace still part of the assembly. Your remarks about using Silver Solder are a very sound. It is much stronger than lead type and less prone to damage from expansion, and the violent shaking these heavily cammed motors exibit. Check you radiator cap too, it may be rated too high for what these tanks were originally intended for (13# was max as I recall(???).
You're on the right track if you know how to Silver Solder well.

Rick, The reinforcement plate's still there. You're right, it's that violent shaking that seems to do it in over a period of time. I talked w/George @ Gessford. He has a hi-polished stainless tank that may work. He took some measurements of it and gave me a call back with them. I'll compare them to mine this evening. I think I'll opt for the stainless tank (if it fits), repair and resell mine. The brass can be a pain in the a$$.

Dave

Joe@KMS · #8 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 09:16 AM

Undy,

You can try one of ours. Let me know if you need measurements.

http://www.kirkhammotorsports.com/pr...k_coolant.html

Joe

Nantucket427 · #9 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 09:21 AM

The radiator shop claims that it is very hard to get them clean enough to solder after they leak. The anti-freeze gets into the metal. I ended up buying a new one from an SPF dealer. It is like the original but polished. Not cheap but no leaks and everyone that sees it loves it.

Excaliber · #10 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 11:03 AM

Antifreeze gets into the metal...

Finally a possible reason why SO many people have trouble getting these tanks soldered up to stop the leaks. A theme thats been repeated on various threads here for a number of years. Maybe the silver solder will actually bond, I've used it, good stuff.

undy · #11 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 01:32 PM

George called me with the top bolt to the top of the radiator cap measurement on his polished stainless tank, 6 1/4". Mine is 5 1/2". His is 3/4" taller. Actually, it's probably only 1/2" too tall as I allowed a small amount of fudge factor with mine. It looks like I'll be fixing mine as no one offers what I need in anything other than brass.

Joe, Whats the measurement from the centerline of the top thermostat bolt to your tank's top fill w/the radiator cap on it?

Earl, ..the same question for you too.

Does anyone custom make a stainless or aluminum tank???

Dave

ENTDOC · #12 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 01:38 PM

Superformance has stainless tanks, Kirkham aluminum. I have had both and neither leak.

double ugly · #13 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 03:38 PM

SA has stainless tanks. I couldn't bring my self to get it powder coated black after seeing the tank. No more leaks.
John

Joe@KMS · #14 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 04:15 PM

Ours is 6" from the center of the top bolt to the top of the cap.

mickmate · #15 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 04:19 PM

I think the silver solder is a good idea and worth a try. The brass ones I have repaired are swiss cheese and just a tailchasing operation on leak repairs. If you need an aluminum or stainless one adjusted on height let me know.
http://www.actoncustom.com
John's (Nantucket427) SPF one is stainless, that's a nice piece but pricey.

kris-kincaid · #16 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 04:32 PM

Ford silver soldered the elbow to the thermostat flange originally, but the elbow to tank joint was soft soldered. If the joint at the tank to elbow isn't made properly, it will never stop cracking and leaking. It needs to have a flange, not just a hole. The elbow needs to fit snugly into the flanged hole. If the joint design isn't right, you can have a ring put around the tube and this will reinforce the joint. This is all pretty basic stuff that all radiator shops know. If a radiator shop is telling you that it is difficult to clean it up after it leaks, find another shop. I worked at a radiator shop for a few years after I got out of high school, and the first things they had me work on were surge tanks because they are so easy to repair and really hard to screw up.

I use brand new copper/brass surge tanks on everything I build, then modify them to work in the Cobra application. I have never had a tank leak. It's a non-issue for me.

Antifreeze gets into the metal, eh?

undy · #17 (**permalink**) 08-26-2008, 05:13 AM

All the "pre-made" stainless and aluminum tanks that I've measurements for are too tall. None of the vendors are willing/able to modify them either. I've compared Gessford's, Kirkham's and SA's tanks/measurements. The Dove and any other offerings I've not. The relative measurement I'm using is the distance from the center line of the top 'tank to intake manifold' mounting bolt to the top of the installed radiator cap. That measurement's 5 1/2" on mine. Thus far, everyone else is between 6" and 6 1/2". If anyone has a aluminum or stainless tank that fits those measurements I'd like to hear about it.

I hate to spend $500 for a tank then spend another couple hundred or so to have it cut up, refitted, rewelded and repolished, a whole lot of "re's". Not to mention voiding any leak warranty I have from the original manufacturer/vendor.

I've a few good radiator shops around here so I might make a few calls...

I might even consider breaking out the small oxy/acetylene rig with a little 45% hard silver solder and redo the elbow into the tank bottom fitting. I'll have to clean off the old solder real well though. It's in the center of the tank so I should be able to control the heat from spreading and unsoldering nearby soft solder joints.

Dave

Tom Kirkham · #18 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 08:19 PM

Kris,
Not everyone has a nuke certified welder to solder their tanks

cobred · #19 (**permalink**) 08-25-2008, 08:31 PM

Dave, when I built my car I bought a tank from ebay for $10, glass beaded it, and did the mods neccessary. Then I glass beaded it again and brought it to a local rad. shop and had all the seams resoldered. 3 years, no leaks. I think the cleaning with the glass beads helped, you cant clean the brass enough when soldering.

Rick Parker · #20 (**permalink**) 08-26-2008, 08:16 AM

Dave I think the term "One Of One" applies here. No one can make it better than yourself with tools in hand. Then 100% satisfaction guaranteed. If necessary disassemble what you have, remove all traces of existing solder, glass bead it to clean and use a propane or oxy/acetalyne torch to carefully apply the Silver Solder and you,ll have a structurally sound piece.