Godzilla 7.3L Swapped Cobra

[jbmatth]

Originally Posted by saki302

I had a live axle in my old FFR. Biggest difference was in ride quality. The superformance IRS is worlds better.

Raw handling (when the road is smooth), the live axle was fine.

It's not something you'll miss until you have it though.

The live axle I had was a 3 link with panhard bar. With swaybars front and rear and power steering, it handled like a go kart ��

The superformance with IRS is smoother despite my fairly high spring stiffness. The manual rack is much less twitchy on the freeway, though I do miss power when on a track (great workout though).

I'm a big fan of IRS, there is a reason all manufacturers use it for new high performance vehicles, but the cost to get one and find a way to install it in my car currently set up for a single triangulated 4 link (fox body style) just doesn't pay out. I don't plan to ever track the car, maybe a few autocross events, but most of my time behind the wheel will be spent on the road, but do love getting into twisty roads but not many of those in Oklahoma near me.

I have manual steering on my car as well, it is only a slight pain when going slow/parking lot manauvors. I've considered replacing the entire front suspension and crossmember with a better setup than the Mustang II it has and would like to have electric assist if I go that route. My concern with doing that is loosing all steering feedback. I already have enough trouble with packaging and would hate to try to fit a power steering pump in there, but that would likely give better feedback.

JB

[twobjshelbys]

Amazing. When the engine was announced I wondered when one appear in a Cobra and who would do it. Great accomplishment!

[jbmatth]

In other news my wiring harness arrived earlier this week, I did a quick test fit to make sure all of the connectors were correct then put in orders for a new IAT sensor (actually a manifold air temp sensor), power cable for the controller, and a communications cable:


Once my intake arrives I'll be to the point where I should be able to fire it up, it is expected to be here in a couple weeks. I'm really getting excited!

JB

[Tom Wells]

JB,

Have you figured out how to get the oil pan ground clearance back to 5"?

Just curious,

Tom

[jbmatth]

Originally Posted by Tom Wells

JB,

Have you figured out how to get the oil pan ground clearance back to 5"?

Just curious,

Tom

Tom,
Yes, the new intake is supposed to be a hair under 2" lower than the factory intake excluding the much higher TB location. Once the intake arrives I'll rebuild the motor mounts and raise the engine 1.5", realign the trans and driveshaft angles to make all happy and be done.

When I built the headers they had a bit of a gap at the top where they exit the body and this will be about the max I can raise the engine without having to rebuild the headers. I'll likely have to redo one of the remote oil filter AN lines and possibly a fuel line, also AN, hopefully that is all but it rarely works as easy as I'd like.

JB

[Tom Wells]

JB,

That gets an LOL. Sorry...

You're demonstrating something you and most of the rest of us know already - I call our cars "ZEN cars" after the Buddhist belief: if you change one thing on the car, everything else has to change because every part is connected to all the other parts.

Sounds like your car will be quite wonderful after it is done,

Tom

[jbmatth]

Originally Posted by Tom Wells

JB,

That gets an LOL. Sorry...

You're demonstrating something you and most of the rest of us know already - I call our cars "ZEN cars" after the Buddhist belief: if you change one thing on the car, everything else has to change because every part is connected to all the other parts.

Sounds like your car will be quite wonderful after it is done,

Tom

No joke, I'd laugh too if I didn't want to cry so much sometimes. I did a complete LS swap in an S10 and it took less than 4 weeks and was running after 2, I've been working on this swap since late September and ordered 100's of parts. There are so man unknowns out there and so few resources that it is very tough to know what to expect and what to buy ahead of time, add to that this car is a B&B and not a Factory 5 or one of the common replicas available.

Just like eating an elephant, one bit at a time. The first time I fire it up you won't be able to wipe the smile off my face...if it works.

JB

[saki302]

Rather than try and re-engineer everything, going from a 4 link to a 3-link (with panhard bar) or something like the levy 5 link would be improvement enough.

If you go with reasonable spring rates, the ride isn't too bad unless your roads are terrible like ours!

[jbmatth]

Originally Posted by saki302

Rather than try and re-engineer everything, going from a 4 link to a 3-link (with panhard bar) or something like the levy 5 link would be improvement enough.

If you go with reasonable spring rates, the ride isn't too bad unless your roads are terrible like ours!

I will have to look into it, but as of now I have enough on my plate and won't be able to begin to make it happen by driving season. Sadly I'll be out of state for 2 months starting in April so my car will be untouched until the hot season is here. I have 5 weeks to finish it, I should be fine.

JB

[Dumpling]

Curious as to why this is posted in the "Small Block Talk" forum....

[jbmatth]

Originally Posted by Dumpling

Curious as to why this is posted in the "Small Block Talk" forum....

I debated this as well, but couldn't find a better place for it, if you go by cubic inches it would be better placed in big block. However, an aftermarket SBF block was developed to 460 in^3, and some big block Mopars were under 400. I therefore decided to base it off of bore spacing:
SBF 4.38"
SBC 4.4"
Godzilla 4.53"
BBC 4.84"
BBF 4.9"

So based on bore spacing the Godzilla is closer to small blocks than big blocks, thus I chose Small Block Talk. Is there a better place for it, I'm all ears, I haven't frequented this forum for many years but wanted to share what I've done to answer some questions for others.

JB

[cycleguy55]

Originally Posted by jbmatth

I debated this as well, but couldn't find a better place for it, if you go by cubic inches it would be better placed in big block. However, an aftermarket SBF block was developed to 460 in^3, and some big block Mopars were under 400. I therefore decided to base it off of bore spacing:
SBF 4.38"
SBC 4.4"
Godzilla 4.53"
BBC 4.84"
BBF 4.9"

So based on bore spacing the Godzilla is closer to small blocks than big blocks, thus I chose Small Block Talk. Is there a better place for it, I'm all ears, I haven't frequented this forum for many years but wanted to share what I've done to answer some questions for others.

JB

Absolutely. Based upon cylinder bore spacing Ford's Godzilla is generally considered a small block.

Reminder that Ford made / makes SBW / SBF / Windsor crate engines up to 460 CID / 7.5 L, while Godzilla is 7.3 L.

[Dumpling]

Originally Posted by jbmatth

I debated this as well, but couldn't find a better place for it, if you go by cubic inches it would be better placed in big block. However, an aftermarket SBF block was developed to 460 in^3, and some big block Mopars were under 400. I therefore decided to base it off of bore spacing:
SBF 4.38"
SBC 4.4"
Godzilla 4.53"
BBC 4.84"
BBF 4.9"

So based on bore spacing the Godzilla is closer to small blocks than big blocks, thus I chose Small Block Talk. Is there a better place for it, I'm all ears, I haven't frequented this forum for many years but wanted to share what I've done to answer some questions for others.

JB

That is GM/Mopar thinking,, clueless supermarket Hotrod/Car Craft drivel, big block vs small block. Ford has always had at least 3 block sizes, small, medium, and large.

The Godzilla is just a modern FE, with slightly smaller bore spacing.
Can you imagine the BILLIONS of dollars Ford could have saved by just continuing production and updating of the FE instead of re-creating it decades later? You can easily buy the components for a 445 FE today.

https://www.motortrend.com/how-to/md...-block-engine/

[twobjshelbys]

Just like cost and price are rarely related, one cannot derive big block vs small block from displacement

[eschaider]

I think current Pro-Mod Rules use 4.500" as the bore spacing line of demarcation between small block engines and big block engines.

[cycleguy55]

Originally Posted by eschaider

I think current Pro-Mod Rules use 4.500" as the bore spacing line of demarcation between small block engines and big block engines.

Here's what I see in 2021 Pro Mod rules relating to bore centre:

SECTION 6
E3 SPARK PLUGS NHRA PRO MOD
DRAG RACING SERIES PRESENTED
BY J&A SERVICE

ENGINE

internal-combustion, reciprocating, single-camshaft, 90-degree

V-8 automotive-type engine mandatory. Crankshaft centeriine must
intersect cylinder bore centerlines and be symmetrical. Nitrous-
assisted entries are limited to a maximum bore center of 5.300.
Maximum bore center on turbocharged billet hemi cylinder-head
entries is 4.840 inches, 5.000 inches on all other turbocharged
entries. Maximum bore center on supercharged billet hemi cylinder-
head entries is 4.900 inches, 5.000 inches on all other super charged
entries.

I see no distinction in bore centres between small block and big block, only between supercharged, turbocharged, and nitrous-assisted, as well as between "turbocharged billet hemi cylinder-head" and other turbocharged engines.

[eschaider]

At PRI 2021, I stopped by the Noonan booth and was looking at some of his stuff when I saw a Hemi that looked right, but on second glance, didn't look right, so I asked him why my eyes were playing games with me.

He said the, were not. In fact the engine was based on a 4.500 bore center build model not the usual 4.800 Chrysler bore center model. Before I could ask him why, he began to explain that one of his ProMod customers and apparently a significant contributor to the class (financially) was looking for an advantage.

The advantage they came up with was a rules defined small block that looked (at first glance) like the real McCoy — except on a 4.500 bore center. If I recall correctly, he said, the customer bought ten engines from pan to injectors at $100K each. NHRA apparently pushed back and the competitor threatened to pull back his funding for the class. Out of the clear blue it suddenly became obvious it was a small block and could race at small block weights breaks.

I was impressed because the small block version had the same or very similar porting and valving compared to the big block version of the engine — go figure? It looked as if the porting and valving of the BB version was directly carried over to the SB version. Sort of a Smokey Yunick style upgrade. I think Smokey famously once said something like, 'The rules just tell you what you can't do. They don't say anything about what you can do ...'

In the FWIW bucket, I just checked Noonan's website and there is no mention of, nor pictures of a 4.5" bore center Hemi block.

[jbmatth]

I am once again humbled by the knowledge of others on this forum, wow. I'm not all that into racing and don't follow any racing classes whatsoever. I do enjoy watching a race but simply don't have the time or bandwidth to keep up on everything that interests me. Some great info above and thank you for sharing.

In other news DCE called and my intake will be ready next week and I should have all of the wiring complete by that point and all that will be left is swapping the intake over and building my intake tube. It is getting closer.

JB

[twobjshelbys]

Does anyone actually make what would be a modern "big block"? I would think the physical size would make it not practical. Economically, from both engine physical size and the space it would take to mount it, it would increase the size and weight for little gain over an equivalent small block...

[cycleguy55]

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

Does anyone actually make what would be a modern "big block"? I would think the physical size would make it not practical. Economically, from both engine physical size and the space it would take to mount it, it would increase the size and weight for little gain over an equivalent small block...

Ford Performance catalog still lists big block crate engines. 572 CID. 655 Horsepower @ 5500 RPM. 710 lb.-ft. torque @ 4500 rpm. Pump gas.

Front sump: https://performanceparts.ford.com/part/M-6007-572DF

Rear sump: https://performanceparts.ford.com/part/M-6007-572DR