SunBurst Knock Off Wheels

[fast_4]

I think you have our attention and intrest in these wheels!

[TEAM THREE WHEE]

Went to test fit the wheel i have on a csx48-- car. It had PBR front calipers and 6 pin , the wheel fit with plenty of clearance for the brakes. We plan to change the rear of the wheel in the drop center area to give some more clearance for other brakes. Any other early 6 pin, girling brake cars in the bay area would be of help.

scott

[franklin]

I would want the 15's with the front & rear wheel filled as my trigo's fill the front & rear. Perhaps it would be good to test fit these on a Kirkham with the upgraded Willwood brakes as well? Too bad I don't live closer? I know there are cars in your area though, if someone can volunteer?

[kurtmart]

I second Franklin's concerns.
Call Tom Eplin Jr and test them on his Willwood equipped Kirkham. He's in San Leandro.

[LMH]

I may be the only one but I think it looks kind of neat to have the rear tires tucked in.
Just makes it look old (read "original").
Larry

[Tony Ripepi]

To each their own.....

All of these cars now are replicas of the originals, having it to be the image of what you want is the reality of today !!!!

My divergence from the original will be SPF with, 5-speed 427 small block, possibly the Olthoff spacers to make the windsor look like the FE etc. etc.

If I go with the Shelby five speed full wheel wells and it will have to have the FE.

The kirkham will also have the Five speed, FE but filled wheel wells with wider meat on the rear tires.

Hope Scott can come through with the Sunbursts.

Tony R.

[Larry N Johnson]

"Different shape" in what way?

Spinners have same 60* angle:


Spinners have same thread pattern.
Vintage spinner in Trigo wheel:


Holes for pins same diameter.

Bolt pattern the same.

Put these same Vintage wheels on an SPF last week; went right on, no issues.
Hubs same inside diameter.

Here are Vintage wheels on Trigo adapters:


The adpaters may be made differently, but the wheels have the same machining, so they are interchangeable, as are the spinners.

[LMH]

Is the angle on the adapter in the same place on both manufacturers adapters?
Larry

[Larry N Johnson]

Originally Posted by LMH

Is the angle on the adapter in the same place on both manufacturers adapters?
Larry

Not for sure, but either wheel fits either adpater w/out interference from the angle.

[TEAM THREE WHEE]

the wheels will be 6 pin, 5 pin, and bolt on. the 5 pin will be 15 x 7.5 3 5/8 backspace, same as trigo, and can be cut to 4".
scott

[FrankJohnson69]

Originally Posted by TEAM THREE WHEE

the wheels will be 6 pin, 5 pin, and bolt on. the 5 pin will be 15 x 7.5 3 5/8 backspace, same as trigo, and can be cut to 4".
scott

None made in 9.5 x 15 with 3 5/8 back space? Just to fill the rear wheel well?

[DanEC]

Team Three - any update on production and release date yet??

Dan

[Larry N Johnson]

Bob Lacey of Vintage Wheels makes this comment on the thread Pin drive bolts splitting Help Please

2)Adapters -
material forged steel ,zinc plated
The standard vintage adapter has same external dimensions as other pin drive set ups for interchangeability.
Vintage adapters are both hub centric and stud centric

Here on the right is a Trigo adapter; note how tall the angle is?

I have installed three sets of wheels on Trigo adapters:
1. Hallibrand magnesium "Cobra II" for the 427 S/C
2. Trigo aluminum 427 S/C
3. Vintage aluminum 427 S/C

So the tall angle does not interfere.

[LMH]

I don't doubt you that one wheel fits on another adapter. You're dealing with a standard bolt circle of 5 X 4.5" and pin diamaters the same size. My issue comes in with the angle inside the wheel, the angle on the adapter and the angle on the spinner all mating up.
If both Vintage and Trigo have all those in the same place, then they are truly interchangable. If they don't, then they aren't.
Larry

[Larry N Johnson]

Originally Posted by LMH

I don't doubt you that one wheel fits on another adapter. You're dealing with a standard bolt circle of 5 X 4.5" and pin diamaters the same size. My issue comes in with the angle inside the wheel, the angle on the adapter and the angle on the spinner all mating up.
If both Vintage and Trigo have all those in the same place, then they are truly interchangable. If they don't, then they aren't.
Larry

Larry,

I understand what you are saying, but is it not true that the wheels seat on the face of the rotor, not the angle? If that is true, then the wheels must be machined enough to clear the angles, not touch at all. Therefore the angle height and the angle itself do not matter as long as it clears the wheel.

Are we on the same page yet?

Larry

[Rick Parker]

I believe that all the wheels are initially cast and subsequently machined leaving the mounting pad, center hole to slip over the threaded part of the adapter. Then after the order comes in for a specific offset and bolt circle, the wheel is fit into a lathe, the height of the pad then reduced to create the required offset and the inner hole enlarged to allow for a flush fit against the face of the adapter while accepting the 45 degee portion on the adapter. I don't think the angle plays any actual part in the registering of the wheel. It's the OD of it and the pins themselves.

[LMH]

Originally Posted by Larry N Johnson

Larry,

I understand what you are saying, but is it not true that the wheels seat on the face of the rotor, not the angle? If that is true, then the wheels must be machined enough to clear the angles, not touch at all. Therefore the angle height and the angle itself do not matter as long as it clears the wheel.

Are we on the same page yet?

Larry

Well, I think we are basically on the same page but I'm more "A R" than you are.
I have two sets of Trigo wheels. I'll have to put the adapter in one of the wheels and study it a little closer. I don't think I would use a Vintage adapter on a Trigo wheel or vise-versa though...but that's just me.
Larry

[Tony Ripepi]

Hi Guys,

All good points....I'm waiting for Scott at Team Three to chime in and give us his perspective from the way they manufacture the adapters, Wheels etc. etc.

Tony R.

[TEAM THREE WHEE]

Okay:
From the picture above, silver adapter is "A" and black adapter is "B".

First the wheel bore has 2mm clearance on the tapered transistion so this is not an interferance issue for different brands of simular adapters,ie. vintage, trigo ect.
Now if we have a wheel that fits "B", then it might be possible to machine the rear of the mounting pad to make the wheel fit "A", but if the center section of the wheel is not thick enough or has features , ie spokes or pockets, then the pin holes will become exposed on the face side. This is common on most race wheels, the pin holes go completly thru the wheel. The next problem may be the brake caliper, if the caliper on adapter "A" protrudes past the pin face then most likley it will hit the back of the spoke area. Since we machined the pad away to fit the adapter.

The wheel is cast for a pin pattern, 5 pin or 6 pin ,the mould has different top cores to reduce the amount of waste material. The center bore is solid in the as cast state and then machined to what ever is needed. So a blank wheel can be machined for a custom adapter and pin pattern provided it is within the design envelope of the wheel.

As for widening the wheel, it could be widened to the backside, but not to the face side. since the drop center well needs to be within a specified distance from the front bead seat. If we extend this distance the tire will not be able to mount. And the wheel design has spokes that extend to the bead seat diameter, so a stepped lip design would change the diameter of the center section and make the wheel look strange. Also if we make the wheel a reverse profile in 15" most disc brakes will not fit.

I am working on the scanned wheel 3d model now, to bring the tube side profile to current industry speifications, ie safety beads and drop well diameter. Some draft angles need to be adjusted , since the original wheels were sand cast and we will use permante moulds and counter pressure casting process.

scott

[mr bruce]

all these requests for different sizes, bores, bolt/pin patterns, cripes, "can you make them in 22" diameter?" are many of the reasons my wheel guy wouldn't go near this project. Make the darned things to stock specs. Who wants a set ?, send Scott a check.