Tko600 Warning!!!!

[ByronRACE]

For those that don't wanna click:

[ByronRACE]

The letter says he reached for 3rd and it just seemed like the engine freewheeled. Like wow man...it just wasn't there.

Was that before or after the horrendous CLANK and GRIND sound that surely occurred sometime previously?

LOL, so yeah...he sent you a "I was on my way to church..." letter. So what, you sold a performance transmission to a guy for a performance application...of course he's going to drive it hard...that's what it's for.

Is this really about punishing someone for sending you a sugar coated, complimentary letter that contains less than the truth about the failure circumstance?

What if the letter said, "Enclosed is my transmission. I was hard on the throttle in 3rd gear at the 1000ft mark in the last round of eliminations, and the POS grenaded. You guys cost me a grand, thanks a lot. Car makes 599 foot-lbs, trans should have held it...fix this POS under warranty, and be quick about it." Would you have honored it then? No? Why? Didn't like his tone? It was truthful wasn't it?

At least the guy in the letter was complimentary and WAS a good customer at that point.

[KEISLERGENE]

Originally Posted by ByronRACE

The letter says he reached for 3rd and it just seemed like the engine freewheeled. Like wow man...it just wasn't there.

Was that before or after the horrendous CLANK and GRIND sound that surely occurred sometime previously?

LOL, so yeah...he sent you a "I was on my way to church..." letter. So what, you sold a performance transmission to a guy for a performance application...of course he's going to drive it hard...that's what it's for.

Is this really about punishing someone for sending you a sugar coated, complimentary letter that contains less than the truth about the failure circumstance?

What if the letter said, "Enclosed is my transmission. I was hard on the throttle in 3rd gear at the 1000ft mark in the last round of eliminations, and the POS grenaded. You guys cost me a grand, thanks a lot. Car makes 599 foot-lbs, trans should have held it...fix this POS under warranty, and be quick about it." Would you have honored it then? No? Why? Didn't like his tone? It was truthful wasn't it?

At least the guy in the letter was complimentary and WAS a good customer at that point.

Well I am having to get off the floor. I was laughing at your post so hard I fell. The bottom line we offered a solution he didn't accept. Him trying to sugar coat the situation isn't why they denied the claim. It was because the trans was abused.

We are trully not the bad guys here. We have thousands of satisfied customers these things always get blown and I wish they wouldn't.

I completey understand both sides. I myself would be upset if I had spent this kind of money and I broke it. I would look to blame someone else as well but that doesn't make it right. This day and age people dont take accountabilty for there action they are alway wanting to blame someone else.

I am losing weight getting on and off my soap box today

gene

[kayakjack]

Gene,

Thank you very much for posting Fordfan69s letter.

One's reputation is pretty much all you have thats worth much. Taking a shot at someone's reputation without being 100% upfront, complete and truthful is a very bad thing.

As others have said, there are two sides to most stories. In this one, it looks on the face of it that Fordfan69 told us in his first post that he broke the transmission on the track. Nice entertaining story. In his letter to Keisler it was the street. Nicely detailed story there too. Just different. If Fordfan69 can tell us how these two stories jibe, I'm all ears. Short of that, this is game over with Keisler's reputation intact.

By the way, in post #6, Fordfan69 says "Keisler pretty much turned their back on me". In post #34 Keisler says "we offered him free labor and discounting on the parts to fix his trans."

Now, who do you believe??

Jack

[ByronRACE]

Originally Posted by KEISLERGENE

Him trying to sugar coat the situation isn't why they denied the claim. It was because the trans was abused.
gene

Fair enough. If you're willing to take the time, can you please define abuse in either your terms, or Tremecs terms.

Skip the the obvious examples (applying 1500ft-lbs through a 600ft-lb transmission, downshifting to 1st at 100mph, etc...)

Does abuse mean taking your car to the track and racing it?

Does abuse mean sidestepping a clutch at redline?

How is abuse objectively determined?

Who has the burden of proof...the customer, or the manufacturer?

After reading this thread, I'm honestly afraid to buy a manual transmission if the burden of proof in situations like this is expected to be with the customer. You can't prove you didn't abuse it. Period.

And, if it comes down to personal reputation as a basis of whether or not to honor a warranty claim on a material purchase, that's pretty scary too. You decide someone is a liar, and poof...warranty void!

[KEISLERGENE]

Originally Posted by ByronRACE

Fair enough. If you're willing to take the time, can you please define abuse in either your terms, or Tremecs terms.

Skip the the obvious examples (applying 1500ft-lbs through a 600ft-lb transmission, downshifting to 1st at 100mph, etc...)

Does abuse mean taking your car to the track and racing it?

Does abuse mean sidestepping a clutch at redline?

How is abuse objectively determined?

Who has the burden of proof...the customer, or the manufacturer?

After reading this thread, I'm honestly afraid to buy a manual transmission if the burden of proof in situations like this is expected to be with the customer. You can't prove you didn't abuse it. Period.

And, if it comes down to personal reputation as a basis of whether or not to honor a warranty claim on a material purchase, that's pretty scary too. You decide someone is a liar, and poof...warranty void!

In this case Johnny misses the shift dumps the clutch when the gear is not fully engaged. Then drives the car home with the trans all screwed up and does even more damage. calls us and says I was going to the store and third gear is gone. Mean while his buddy post on the moparts forum about a guy that lost 3rd gear on the track this weekend and low and behold it was Greg.

No one is calling names here this is a case of glutony someone wanted something for nothing. I have proof he was misleading. you have read it in black and white.

Shifting gears is not for everyone, its just the only way to go.

There are way to many people out there burning rubber and having fun with these transmissions for you to be scewed by this guy. If you dont buy one from us at least buy one from someone else.

It is definatly better when you stick it !

[undy]

I too have been following closely.. I've a similar eperience with a Richmond 6 speed that I had in a 496 powered 69 Stingray. I pulled 2nd gear hard and engaged the clutch harshly before I was fully in second. The result was a fragged 2nd gear. Knowing that I had caused the failure, not the result of an inadequate tranny, I felt the burden of repair was mine. When I disassembled the unit there were "imprints" at the teeth fracture lines that indicated that the failure occured on partial engagement. At no point did I even consider holding the manufacturer/retailer liable for my crappy shift. I agree with Kiesler, for the most part, in his case. The customer tried to deceive them and our forum here, apparently to sway sentiment and pressure to force Kiesler into making an unjustified warranty repair. To me the apparent deceipt would indicate that the party "knew" they were in the wrong from the get-go.

I think Kiesler's offering to repair with free labor and a reduced parts charge was extremely fair.

I've never bought anything from Kiesler in the past and I definately would not let this sway me against spending my money with them. Nobody's dating my sister .... but she's 82 and single should someone care to make amorous advances..

[Buzz]

Posted by turnpike boy:
"Kiesler may indeed have reason to believe he's lying, but you do not offer any documentation whatsoever to support that posture, despite your contentions to the contrary. That makes your statements equally suspect."

It amazes me that people jump in at the end of a long thread and, having (seemingly) chosen not to read the previous posts, decide to make a decisive comment on the issue. A letter from Fordfan to Keisler outlining an inaccurate account of how the damage occurred was posted here:

Originally Posted by ByronRACE

For those that don't wanna click:

Fordfan also admitted that his original story was *ahem* less than factual.