Coyote 5.0L...thoughts?

[Dimis]

Originally Posted by eschaider

The bickering is nothing more than who thinks his dog is bigger.

Dimis, the most important thing to remember is, it is your car and you are paying the tab. As is so often said, 'beauty is in the eye of the beholder' and in this case, you are the beholder! Choose and build to make yourself happy and of course the local emissions nazis. At the end of the day the make yourself happy approach will yield the most smiles per mile - and after all that's what its all about ...

Ed

Ed - Not that I'm counting, but that is about the third time you have offered me sensible and sage advice. I figure for that, the least I can do is buy the drinks... so if your ever in my town, shoot me a PM.

Thanks again,
Anth

[fordracing65]

In that case get the vette motor and leave the coyote in the dust, hows that for advice. At least with the vette engine all the internals will be forged.

[eschaider]

Originally Posted by Dimis

Ed - Not that I'm counting, but that is about the third time you have offered me sensible and sage advice. I figure for that, the least I can do is buy the drinks... so if your ever in my town, shoot me a PM.

Thanks again,
Anth

Anth,

You've got a deal! Now I've got to find a way down to enjoy the drinks. I promise I will PM if I get down.

All the best on your build. Whatever you finally do I suspect you will deliberate enough to genuinely enjoy the project's end result.

Ed

[WardL]

I went by Hillbanks last week when I was in LA and they had a Coyote and an 8-stack FE for sale. I would prefer the Coyote. That is just me. They were both beautiful Cobras. I can see why some of the 1% have several collection cars, I haven't seen many Cobra's I didn't want.

[jhv48]

I guess I just don't get it. Why spend all that money to get a fairly accurate replica of a 60's automobile and then muck it up with a modern fuel injected engine? If you want a mustang, then buy a mustang!

Whenever I see a beautiful replica and then the guy pops the hood and I see a coyote engine, or any current FI ford mustang engine, I am disappointed.

Give me any FORD carbureted engine that belches fire, makes my eyes and ears ring, can be tuned with a screwdriver and a wrench, leaks oil and gas and I'm happy.

But that's just me.

[AL427SBF]

mvnaz, can't go wrong with a coyote, read through the thread linked below.
These characters who think you need a more expensive "period correct motor" to go into a replica KIT CAR are delusional on what they really own I know many would rather see a coyote 5.0 under the hood vs. a leaky FE any day of the week, including me.
BDR1085 - Ready to go ... Coyote 5.0
----

[SpecOp1]

Just a new find here....does not always takes cubes to gain HP..

Video: A Coyote 5.0 With Individual Throttle Bodies Hits 8,200 RPM - StangTV
Jus say'n....Bill

[Dimis]

Originally Posted by SpecOp1

does not always takes cubes to gain HP..

Yes true - the alternative is you can rev the sh!t out of them.

Nice find. Love the 8stack trumpets, always have probably always will.
Still down s bit on torque vs a BBF, but very impressive none-the-less.

Is it just me or does it lack that deep rumble and is more raspy in sound?

[Ant]

Originally Posted by jhv48

Coyote engine?

Might as well put a Chevy in it!

I agree, even though I have a Yates engine in my car. The LS7 Corvette engine is without a doubt the most popular engine for great horsepower etc, TVR, Ultima etc are using them, there is even a class started here in NZ called Supertourers much like aussie super cars and all the Ford and GM cars have the same LS7 engine, there is nothing out there naturally aspirated in the same class.

[fordracing65]

Originally Posted by AL427SBF

mvnaz, can't go wrong with a coyote, read through the thread linked below.
These characters who think you need a more expensive "period correct motor" to go into a replica KIT CAR are delusional on what they really own I know many would rather see a coyote 5.0 under the hood vs. a leaky FE any day of the week, including me.
BDR1085 - Ready to go ... Coyote 5.0
----

If you want no tourque get a Coyote, if you are worried about emissions, get a Coyote, if your worried about mpg get a Coyote, remember these are not even all forged engines, and I'm not delusional, I had a DOHC in my cobra, I actually drove this engine for years, its funny how people commit on how good a car is and they have just read about it. Now im on to an FE and cant wait till the day a Coyote pulls up next to me.

[fordracing65]

Originally Posted by Ant

I agree, even though I have a Yates engine in my car. The LS7 Corvette engine is without a doubt the most popular engine for great horsepower etc, TVR, Ultima etc are using them, there is even a class started here in NZ called Supertourers much like aussie super cars and all the Ford and GM cars have the same LS7 engine, there is nothing out there naturally aspirated in the same class.

Ive said this before also, the LS7 is the best emmision motor for these cars, who cares if its a chevy, plus the Coyote is bigger than an FE in size, with less power, and cannot gain any more cubes, its a square motor. Even Tom and Dave Kirkham love the LS7 motor in these cars, we talked about it for hours at the open house last week.

[eschaider]

Originally Posted by Dimis

... Is it just me or does it lack that deep rumble and is more raspy in sound?

It does Anth, but that is because of the variable cam timing. The engine at idle actually spreads the lobe separation angle for emissions, idle quality and vacuum. By reprogramming the ECU to tighten lobe separation angle at idle, the traditional rumpity rump sort of idle returns along with increased emissions and reduced idle vacuum.

The programable, variable nature of the cam to crank phasing brings a lot of interesting capabilities to the n/a version of the motor including the lack of a visible PCV system. Ford has been able too achieve the same PCV function on the Coyote by adjusting cam to crank phasing.

Ed

[RACER X #99]

Originally Posted by fordracing65

If you want no tourque get a Coyote, if you are worried about emissions, get a Coyote, if your worried about mpg get a Coyote, remember these are not even all forged engines, and I'm not delusional, I had a DOHC in my cobra, I actually drove this engine for years, its funny how people commit on how good a car is and they have just read about it. Now im on to an FE and cant wait till the day a Coyote pulls up next to me.

Another of your ridiculous posts. Since the Coyote only came out last year you have not been driving a Coyote for five years as you have posted.

The 5.0 in the Daytona prototypes (modified Coyote)makes over 500HP and is faster than the 500HP Fe's in the original Ford GT J cars.

Just because you want a car show engine in your Kirkham is no reason to be knocking the Coyote which you know nothing about.

Chances are any Coyote in a Cobra is going to be for somebody who want to do serious track time and not a show piece.

While there is nothing wrong with car show Cobras with polished FE's please don't confuse them with serious track Cobras.

No doubt you may find some very fast FE powered Cobras running on the track but none are in stock form of 425 HP

If you want to get right down to it any Cobra running a former Cup engine of 358 CI will kick the Crap out of any Cobra running any big block. Considering Cup engines have very low torque down low that blows the torque wins theory out the window.

You might be able to impress the car show crowd with your talk of big block torque but at the race track you won't be impressing anybody.

[fordracing65]

Racer X let me school you here, Ford racing has had a 5.0 litre DOHC in the Ford catalouge since 2005 known as the t-50 cammer or r-50 cammer for sale to the public, and now that the Coyote is out some people on here think its the next coming of GOD. Never said the Coyote is not a nice motor, just do a little research about these motors thay are the same, sure the Coyote has vvt, big f ing deal, like I said if you want emmisions get a Coyote. Again build your motor for how you drive, who wants to drive around town at 7500 rpm to make power, again to each is own, we can argue all day on opinion, Now research Paul Browns winning Boss 302s, it doesnt have 500 hp his has 404hp,(and with his motor he uses a $35000 dollar computer) same specs when the cammer was used, now with that said these engine were built for one reason, emmisions, which in the USA doesnt apply to these cars, if you want to drive around at low rpm and fell soggy get a Coyote, if tq is important get anything else. (never said the fe was the best I prefer the windsor and you cant even compare a coyote to that, the coyote and dp engines are two differnt animals, just like a 425 hp fe and a built fe) oh ya its 2012 the coyote was realesed at end of 2009 thats 2.5 years. (I drove Lances superformance coyote when he drove my superformance cammer, so dont tell me I havent driven one, again i speak from real world experience)

[aa909]

Originally Posted by AL427SBF

These characters who think you need a more expensive "period correct motor" to go into a replica KIT CAR are delusional on what they really own I know many would rather see a coyote 5.0 under the hood vs. a leaky FE any day of the week, including me.
BDR1085 - Ready to go ... Coyote 5.0
----

Guys is this true? I was under the impression that while a coyote was only ~$7K the cost of the additional labor to install plus the parts and modifications required to make it work was significantly more and really pushed the total price much higher. At least that was my experience when considering the coyote vs a more traditional dart block 427. To put it another way the dart block 427 was more expensive than the coyote but the total cost including install was much cheaper than the coyote. may be I misunderstood the OP's post

[lovehamr]

Art, you're right. Lots of feces being slung in this thread.

[RACER X #99]

Originally Posted by fordracing65

Racer X let me school you here, Ford racing has had a 5.0 litre DOHC in the Ford catalouge since 2005 known as the t-50 cammer or r-50 cammer for sale to the public, and now that the Coyote is out some people on here think its the next coming of GOD. Never said the Coyote is not a nice motor, just do a little research about these motors thay are the same, sure the Coyote has vvt, big f ing deal, like I said if you want emmisions get a Coyote. Again build your motor for how you drive, who wants to drive around town at 7500 rpm to make power, again to each is own, we can argue all day on opinion, Now research Paul Browns winning Boss 302s, it doesnt have 500 hp his has 404hp,(and with his motor he uses a $35000 dollar computer) same specs when the cammer was used, now with that said these engine were built for one reason, emmisions, which in the USA doesnt apply to these cars, if you want to drive around at low rpm and fell soggy get a Coyote, if tq is important get anything else. (never said the fe was the best I prefer the windsor and you cant even compare a coyote to that, the coyote and dp engines are two differnt animals, just like a 425 hp fe and a built fe) oh ya its 2012 the coyote was realesed at end of 2009 thats 2.5 years. (I drove Lances superformance coyote when he drove my superformance cammer, so dont tell me I havent driven one, again i speak from real world experience)

Sorry but the Cammer you speak of is not the Coyote that you continue to diss.
The Coyote is the base of the 5.0 that the DP ran at Daytona, the engine that the Ls6 based Chevy's could not keep up with even though they had 50 more HP and more torque.

The folks at Ford say the Coyote is the best engine they ever built and now that they make a 351 version it only gets better.
Yes I know 5.0 has less torque that a 428 FE by why does it move a Mustang faster then the FE (2011 GT vs 68 Cobra Jet)

That FE you are putting in your Kirkham is just fine for the car show circuit and originality but it's design is 60 years old and in order to beat a 5.0 Coyote you have to build it to 500-600 HP. does that make any sense?

That real world experience includes how many years on the road courses?
You can BS the newbies here but I've been around too long to be "schooled" by another newbie.

Read here you will learn something,

2011 Ford Mustang GT 5.0 Coyote Engine - 5.0 Mustang & Fast Fords

And here so you know something about LS race engines,

Chevy LS6 Engine Page

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by RACER X #99

That FE you are putting in your Kirkham is just fine for the car show circuit and originality but it's design is 60 years old and in order to beat a 5.0 Coyote you have to build it to 500-600 HP. does that make any sense?

That real world experience includes how many years on the road courses?

I honestly don't want to participate in a debate about the Coyote vs. FE, but a couple things.

1. For many years now, dating back to the early 2000's, any new cast iron or aluminum FE stroked with a basic aluminum Edelbrock head (or if you want more HP, then a Blue Thunder head) will produce 600+ HP. 600-650 HP is "commonplace."

2. There are very successful FE's running in road race circuits. Morris and CSX3170, here on CC, come quickly to mind. A Kirkham Cobra beat a new Ferrari with traction control by alot.

Is the FE a modern powerplant? No. Does the Coyote benefit from 40 +/- years of technological advances? Yes. Is the FE for the "car show circuit" only? No.

You should peruse the FE Forum and see how others have been successful with the FE.

And lastly the 428 Cobra Jet in the '68 1/2 Mustang is not the same engine as yesterday's or today's sideoiler/topoiler engines.

[aa909]

Not sure why this thread has become a debate over which engine is "better". I'm new to this hobby but it seems to me that these cars are very individual in terms of what the owner wants. I really think the back and forth around "better" this or that is a waste of time since its really very subjective.

I personally wanted a reproduction with an old school set up with a carb and a 427 engine, tons of torque and a loud mean rumble. And my expectations have been met. The coyote guys want something more modern and their expectations have been met. Would I trade mine for theirs or vice versa, no... But we're both satisfied. Why the competitive pi$$ing match over which is "better". How do you define "better". And honestly who cares, if you're happy with your setup that's all that counts

Just my 2 cents

[fordracing65]

The tiltle says 5.0 Coyote, thoughts? I drove one and gave my thoughts, I could care less if you want a Coyote or not, by the way the DOHC cammer has more wins in DP racing than the Coyote, again to each is own, if you dont want an opinion dont ask.