Mystery solved. Shelby Trust to sell Real Cobras

[REAL 1]

Originally Posted by kanuck

No I mean the front fenders, the rear flares, they radiator and oil coolers openings, and a few other things I might be missing, most of them if not all have been corrected over time. but when they were new if you lined up a dozen of them in a row you could see the differences. and just a note. I don't mean this as slam, I mentioning this as it was part of there charm each one being unique.

Dean


PS: I live down the street from Tasca Ford, and have had some pretty cool conversations with some of they old timers.

Sorry, I should have been clearer. I meant what gauge aluminum are they using in the new completion series? The originals had a much thinner gauge then the current series. Its just another detail.

[LMH]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Hillbank has CSX 1020 for sale right now for $240K:

http://www.cobracountry.com/cobra4sa...0-blak-BIG.jpg

Or you can build a CSX like Evan's for about $240K, which would you rather have?

A $240,000 replica and they can't get the wipers to park on the correct side!
Larry

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

Sorry, I should have been clearer. I meant what gauge aluminum are they using in the new completion series? The originals had a much thinner gauge then the current series. Its just another detail.

Per the old FAQ section on the Kirkham website, the 1960's 3000 series was made with 0.050" gauge aluminum. The Kirkham body was 0.059" thick. Not sure what they're using today and what anyone is using for the Resurrection Series.

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

Sorry, I should have been clearer. I meant what gauge aluminum are they using in the new completion series? The originals had a much thinner gauge then the current series. Its just another detail.

I didn't ask. But I would assume that the Kirkham is their standard. Drews are hand rolled so might indeed show some asymmetry.

[g8rnbft]

Pardon for interrupting (newbie), but how did the members or directors of a charitable trust become in possession of all these parts that supposedly at one time were the bread and butter of a manufacturing enterprise that still exists. How and why/when did the transfer come about???

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

That's a nice car no question. Depends which you would rather have. Mine is extensively more detailed and "correct" but if you want the "AC" connection you want the other one. Details are expensive and hard to do.

To me since neither is an original 3000 series chassis and both are genuine Shelbys one being a 1000 and the other a very early aluminum SAI 4000 which came with a lot more original details from the factory standard, personally it wouldn't matter to me. I would be happy with both.

Mine would take $240K to duplicate new and approximately 1.5 year wait... but we are talking a new car for that sum. Mine is 14 years old and has 8000 miles. If I sold it (which I have no plans to) I wouldn't ask $240K. Something less. Likely around $215K to $220K I think would be fair.

Since the AC connection is historical and they only made 14 of them, my personal opinion is that market would attach a premium to the CSX1000's, all other details being equal, which in this case they're not.

Certainly Hillbank has had almost new CSX4000's listed between $180-$200K and this CSX1000 with 21 miles or whatever is advertised at $240K.

[fordracing65]

A true collector would have every variety, then you could tell the story of why you can't drive one, why one is made of glass, why one is made from carbon fiber, why one is made of aluminum, why one has 50th ann badges, why one has a 4000 csx number, why the original one you have has a 3000 csx number and why the new one you just bought with all original parts except a few things here and there has a 3000 csx number, and on and on... And the how the stories will grow over time, I cant wait to see the barn finds in years to come and the huge tall tales of these cars, all of them...lol exhausting...

[mullen2]

FYI. The Hillbank CSX1020 car has no AC connection. Only CSX1001-CSX1013 were built by AC on AC tooling and body bucks by AC cars employees. I have been told NDM did the body on 1020. It has different shape than the AC body cobras. To the best of my knowledge after #13 AC Cars went to malta and pretty much was no more. AC heritage (Brooklands) now has all the remaining AC body bucks and tooling in their museum. They made a few bodies for Shelby as well as North Devon Craft after AC cars went away but I suspect this is why the CSX 1000 series stopped.

While CSX1020 is a english made body it is not on the original bucks,tooling, or by AC cars. The AC Body and Chassis on the earlier CSX1000 cars bring a premium vs the non AC built cars.

[REAL 1]

CSX 1000s do bring a premium and are more limited in number. What are they going for in general now? Where were most of them sold out of?

Also, I'm confused. If CSX 1020 it has no connection to AC Ltd why does it have a CSX 1000 vin?

Also Hillbank has CSX 3060 for sale at $259K. Clearly an original run Completion car.

[mullen2]

Attachment 25712

Originally Posted by REAL 1

CSX 1000s do bring a premium and are more limited in number. What are they going for in general now? Where were most of them sold out of?

Also, I'm confused. If CSX 1020 it has no connection to AC Ltd why does it have a CSX 1000 vin?

Also Hillbank has CSX 3060 for sale at $259K. Clearly an original run Completion car.

The original batch of CSX1000 cars were ordered by Carroll personally from AC in England back in 2003 timeframe. The first one CSX1001 he kept and was his personal car titled and registered in his name, he later donated it to be raffled off to a lucky winner for his foundation.

It took a long time for AC cars ltd to make each body and chassis and customers who already paid for the cars were getting impatient. The relationship between Carroll and AC went south at some point and AC closed up shop and left England in 2006 to Malta.

Edited

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by mullen2

The original batch of CSX1000 cars were ordered by Carroll personally from AC in England back in 2003 timeframe. The first one CSX1001 he kept and was his personal car titled and registered in his name, he later donated it to be raffled off to a lucky winner for his foundation.

It took a long time for AC cars ltd to make each body and chassis and customers who already paid for the cars were getting impatient. The relationship between Carroll and AC went south at some point and AC closed up shop and left England in 2006 to Malta. At that point AC cars was pretty much was no more. Only 13 cars were completed and made it to Shelby in Vegas. Shelby continued to sell the CSX1000 series as english premium aluminum body cars but they were no longer "AC" Shelbys. The remaining CSX1000's were finished by either North Devon Craft Metals or Brooklands to the best of my knowledge.

Basically bringing back the AC English built cars on AC tooling and body bucks fell apart after only building 13 cars.

CSX1020 is a beautiful car and in my opinion a deal at the asking price. But only the CSX1000 cars with bodies and chassis actually built by "AC" with the "AC Shelby Cobra" nose badge leagally attached from the shelby factory(See attached photo) and special "AC" vin plate under the hood are considered AC built and the most desirable of the series. I am pretty sure only the first 13 of the series are considered "AC Shelby Cobras".
Attachment 25712

Interesting history. There is a csx1000 topic or two here would you be willing to post this in those too? I'm on my cell phone so searching for the right place and linking would be difficult. Search for csx1000 should get you to one of them

[mullen2]

Originally Posted by REAL 1 "Also Hillbank has CSX 3060 for sale at $259K. Clearly an original run Completion car."



CSX3060 at Hillbank has a strange history. Not sure if it is even a Shelby. vin is really CSX30601 here is the story I was given by Hillbank a while back when I looked at it.

"This car was serial numbered CSX30601 by Brian when it was first built. The car was sold to a gentleman in Japan where the car was raced in Japan and Malaysia. In the 90's the car was shipped back to the US to be refurbished. Shortly after shipping the car to the US the Japanese owner was incarcerated and abandoned the Cobra. U.S. Customs Department removed the serial number tag and turned it over to the shipping company. They put it up for auction and it was purchased by a California resident who completely restored the car to concourse quality condition. The car was thought to be the Shelby continuation car "CSX3060" as in the '97 Shelby registry. It is stamped CSX30601 on the frame but the "1" and the end of the VIN number was hard to read. The car was sold in 2003 for over $400,000 to a very prominent collector of Shelby's and was in his world class museum ever since. Recently the owner of the real CSX3060 surfaced and the true story of this car came alive. This car is even talked about in the current Shelby registry.
This is truly more of a true original Shelby Cobra then the eight Shelby continuation cars that were built in the 90's and sold for over $500,000 new. Those cars were thought by the public to be built with original bodies and chassis left over from the original 60's production. The cars were not even built by Shelby, they were all contracted to be built by Mark McCluskey in Southern California. All the bodies and chassis were built by Mark in the 90's.

The body and chassis on this car was built in England by AC Cars Ltd using all of the original tooling used to build the original AC Cobras in the 60's. When this AC Cobra was restored in the 90's, they want above and beyond to make this car appear to be an authentic Shelby AC Cobra 427 S/C to anybody looking at it. Just to give you an example they used genuine Shelby pin-drive knock off wheels, Shelby wood steering wheel, original ford auxiliary fan motors, Lucas headlights, gauges, Goodyear Eagle racing tires, 36 gallon fuel tank etc. Even the wiring looms are done exactly like the original cars. This is perfect mirror image to the original Shelby AC Cobra 427S/C built in 1966 and is correct in every detail."

[twobjshelbys]

Csx3060 vs 30601 doesn't seem to have the "those that shall not be named" status of a few others here but it's gotta be close. It's a gorgeous car none the less

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by mullen2

The original batch of CSX1000 cars were ordered by Carroll personally from AC in England back in 2003 timeframe. The first one CSX1001 he kept and was his personal car titled and registered in his name, he later donated it to be raffled off to a lucky winner for his foundation.

It took a long time for AC cars ltd to make each body and chassis and customers who already paid for the cars were getting impatient. The relationship between Carroll and AC went south at some point and AC closed up shop and left England in 2006 to Malta. At that point AC cars was pretty much was no more. Only 13 cars were completed and made it to Shelby in Vegas. Shelby continued to sell the CSX1000 series as english premium aluminum body cars but they were no longer "AC" Shelbys. The remaining CSX1000's were finished by either North Devon Craft Metals or Brooklands to the best of my knowledge.

Basically bringing back the AC English built cars on AC tooling and body bucks fell apart after only building 13 cars.

CSX1020 is a beautiful car and in my opinion a deal at the asking price. But only the CSX1000 cars with bodies and chassis actually built by "AC" with the "AC Shelby Cobra" nose badge leagally attached from the shelby factory(See attached photo) and special "AC" vin plate under the hood are considered AC built and the most desirable of the series. I am pretty sure only the first 13 of the series are considered "AC Shelby Cobras".
Attachment 25712

Interesting history. There is a csx1000 topic or two here would you be willing to post this in those too? I'm on my cell phone so searching for the right place and linking would be difficult. Search for csx1000 should get you to one of them

[rodneym]

Ah, yes. The old, "the 1 at the end of the VIN was hard to read, excuse".

[fordracing65]

Like I said, here come all the stories of where and how these cars came about and no body really knows crap...

[Jamo]

Originally Posted by fordracing65

A true collector would have every variety, then you could tell the story of why you can't drive one, why one is made of glass, why one is made from carbon fiber, why one is made of aluminum, why one has 50th ann badges, why one has a 4000 csx number, why the original one you have has a 3000 csx number and why the new one you just bought with all original parts except a few things here and there has a 3000 csx number, and on and on... And the how the stories will grow over time, I cant wait to see the barn finds in years to come and the huge tall tales of these cars, all of them...lol exhausting...

One of the reasons I collect watches...

[fordracing65]

Originally Posted by Jamo

One of the reasons I collect watches...

Do you have a Paul Newman Rolex Daytona, original, or replica, or a kit watch from the US ebay market, or one from Asia, lol, I think it happens in everything...

[Jamo]

Yup...but it sure as hell takes up less room.

I hate Rolex watches any way...too damn small. Got my first Panerai in 98 when only Sly and Awnold knew WTF they were...now everybody has a weird crown protector. So recently I go for stuff that even the magicians in Hong Kong have a tough time duplicating...Omega Ploprof, Doxa, Ball.

We haven't heard the final story yet on these super-duper continuation thingies because nobody's thought it up yet.

[mrmustang]

I'd buy it if SWMBO would allow me her last "highly coveted" indoor garage space

Bill S.

Originally Posted by mullen2

Originally Posted by REAL 1 "Also Hillbank has CSX 3060 for sale at $259K. Clearly an original run Completion car."



CSX3060 at Hillbank has a strange history. Not sure if it is even a Shelby. vin is really CSX30601 here is the story I was given by Hillbank a while back when I looked at it.

"This car was serial numbered CSX30601 by Brian when it was first built. The car was sold to a gentleman in Japan where the car was raced in Japan and Malaysia. In the 90's the car was shipped back to the US to be refurbished. Shortly after shipping the car to the US the Japanese owner was incarcerated and abandoned the Cobra. U.S. Customs Department removed the serial number tag and turned it over to the shipping company. They put it up for auction and it was purchased by a California resident who completely restored the car to concourse quality condition. The car was thought to be the Shelby continuation car "CSX3060" as in the '97 Shelby registry. It is stamped CSX30601 on the frame but the "1" and the end of the VIN number was hard to read. The car was sold in 2003 for over $400,000 to a very prominent collector of Shelby's and was in his world class museum ever since. Recently the owner of the real CSX3060 surfaced and the true story of this car came alive. This car is even talked about in the current Shelby registry.
This is truly more of a true original Shelby Cobra then the eight Shelby continuation cars that were built in the 90's and sold for over $500,000 new. Those cars were thought by the public to be built with original bodies and chassis left over from the original 60's production. The cars were not even built by Shelby, they were all contracted to be built by Mark McCluskey in Southern California. All the bodies and chassis were built by Mark in the 90's.

The body and chassis on this car was built in England by AC Cars Ltd using all of the original tooling used to build the original AC Cobras in the 60's. When this AC Cobra was restored in the 90's, they want above and beyond to make this car appear to be an authentic Shelby AC Cobra 427 S/C to anybody looking at it. Just to give you an example they used genuine Shelby pin-drive knock off wheels, Shelby wood steering wheel, original ford auxiliary fan motors, Lucas headlights, gauges, Goodyear Eagle racing tires, 36 gallon fuel tank etc. Even the wiring looms are done exactly like the original cars. This is perfect mirror image to the original Shelby AC Cobra 427S/C built in 1966 and is correct in every detail."