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-   -   Found this in my oil pan (http://www.clubcobra.com/forums/all-cobra-talk/138547-found-my-oil-pan.html)

RodKnock 05-31-2017 02:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickt (Post 1422956)
Me too. In fact, I'd run it a while revving over six grand.
Seriously, clients actually pay you money, not in sheep, cows or pigs, for your advice? :LOL:

dcdoug 05-31-2017 03:04 PM
I was wondering when Patrickt was going to jump in with some wisdom on this thread. :LOL:

He needs to be on his best manners though or he'll be seconded to the People's Republic of Maryland to help with engine removal. :cool:

RodKnock 05-31-2017 03:42 PM
"Wisdom" should be in quotes.

Six months from now he'll be defending himself saying how much he helps folks with his "sage" technical advice.

Three Peaks 05-31-2017 03:54 PM
How pliable are the pieces? Can you cut a couple apart to see what they are made of? Could be the edges of an intake gasket that broke off and went through the oil passages into the pan, or RTV that was used for sealing the intake, timing chain, valve cover, or oil pan gaskets. If it is that pliable, I doubt it could do any real damage to the engine unless it blocked some oil passages and reduced oil flow.
From the size of the pieces it seems to be something fairly substantial if they aren't soft- Piston skirts or babbit material are all that come to mind at the moment. If you have a torque wrench, taking the caps off one at a time and replacing them as suggested is pretty easy to do and will solve much of the mystery, IMHO.

dcdoug 05-31-2017 04:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Three Peaks (Post 1422965)
How pliable are the pieces? Can you cut a couple apart to see what they are made of?
They are very pliable, easy to bend, not brittle at all. They are quite thin too: 0.0130-0.0180". They feel like copper.

cdnus 05-31-2017 09:39 PM
Do you have bushing roller lifters or rocker arms rather than roller? If so, maybe coming apart on you. They are usually copper or bronze.
Just scratching for a solution.
Craig

olddog 05-31-2017 09:47 PM
The material has to be identified, in my mind. If this is copper RTV, I would not be concerned. Well maybe a little. By grinding the oil filter open, again I'm not certain the grit was in the filter before the grinding. I hate to see you tear an engine down for nothing. Also hate to see it damaged more by doing nothing.

dcdoug 06-01-2017 04:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cdnus (Post 1422993)
Do you have bushing roller lifters or rocker arms rather than roller? If so, maybe coming apart on you. They are usually copper or bronze.
Just scratching for a solution.
Craig
No, I have roller rockers.

dcdoug 06-01-2017 04:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by olddog (Post 1422994)
The material has to be identified, in my mind. If this is copper RTV, I would not be concerned. Well maybe a little. By grinding the oil filter open, again I'm not certain the grit was in the filter before the grinding. I hate to see you tear an engine down for nothing. Also hate to see it damaged more by doing nothing.
Unfortunately my tin snips weren't sharp enough to get it done. I figured any metal dust coming from a dremel wouldn't get into the middle of the pleats and wouldn't be as chunky as the stuff on the side or bottom of the filter housing.

Anyway to tell if it's copper RTV? I've never really use it, so not sure what it looks/feels like in it's dried form.

I just don't see how I can get to a place at this point where I won't feel comfortable pulling the motor and figuring out the problem.

blykins 06-01-2017 05:58 AM
Change the oil, put a new filter on, drive it for 50-100 miles, bring it back in, and cut the filter apart with a *filter cutting tool*.

lovehamr 06-01-2017 07:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blykins (Post 1423009)
Change the oil, put a new filter on, drive it for 50-100 miles, bring it back in, and cut the filter apart with a *filter cutting tool*.
+1 This is what I use. Leaves little to no crap in the filter from cutting.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-900510

https://static.summitracing.com/glob...-900510_xl.jpg

dcdoug 06-01-2017 09:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blykins (Post 1423009)
Change the oil, put a new filter on, drive it for 50-100 miles, bring it back in, and cut the filter apart with a *filter cutting tool*.
I knew I'd get grief for cutting it open that way.%/ I'll get a filter cutting tool for next time.

But the size of those copper (?) strips in the pan don't make you concerned?

lovehamr 06-01-2017 10:34 AM
Like others have said they'd do, I'd drop the pan and start looking at bearings. I'd start with the thrust and work out from there one at a time, re-torqueing them as I go. If I found nothing amiss with the mains I'd start looking at the rods the same way. If I found nothing there I'd button it all back up and drive the piss out of it. ;)

dcdoug 06-01-2017 11:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovehamr (Post 1423024)
Like others have said they'd do, I'd drop the pan and start looking at bearings. I'd start with the thrust and work out from there one at a time, re-torqueing them as I go. If I found nothing amiss with the mains I'd start looking at the rods the same way. If I found nothing there I'd button it all back up and drive the piss out of it. ;)
OK, can't hurt.

blykins 06-01-2017 12:22 PM
The strips look like they have formed a tube at some point....is that the way you see it? And the tube looks to be ~1/8" in diameter????

I can't think of anything that it would be. If it's got good oil pressure, breathers aren't pushing smoke out (I've seen some engines with bearing issues push smoke out, not from blow-by but from heat), and there wasn't flakes in the pleats of the filter, then I'd drive it for a bit and recheck it.

dcdoug 06-01-2017 12:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blykins (Post 1423032)
The strips look like they have formed a tube at some point....is that the way you see it? And the tube looks to be ~1/8" in diameter????

I can't think of anything that it would be. If it's got good oil pressure, breathers aren't pushing smoke out (I've seen some engines with bearing issues push smoke out, not from blow-by but from heat), and there wasn't flakes in the pleats of the filter, then I'd drive it for a bit and recheck it.
Either a tube (could be wider diameter than 1/8" potentially - hard to tell from the pieces) or maybe some sort of "shaving" that ended up with a but of a curve to it?

I only have a breather on the oil fill tube (closed valve covers and road draft tube off oil vapor separator tank). I haven't noticed any smoke from it, but will check again if I end up checking the main bearings/thrust bearing.

I'm sort of leaning towards doing that and then driving it for 50 miles or so then checking the pan and filter again.

patrickt 06-01-2017 02:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcdoug (Post 1423034)

I'm sort of leaning towards doing that and then driving it for 50 miles or so then checking the pan and filter again.
... and remember, the harder you thrash it, the greater your sense of comfort will be when you don't put a window in through the side of the block.:cool:

dcdoug 06-01-2017 02:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickt (Post 1423043)
... and remember, the harder you thrash it, the greater your sense of comfort will be when you don't put a window in through the side of the block.:cool:
Will not be driven hard IF I inspect the bearings and then give this a try. I'll probably send the oil in for analysis too. I should of done all of this last Oct...lesson learned.

Or I could just drive it 500 miles to Lykins Motorsport in Kentucky :p

RodKnock 06-01-2017 03:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcdoug (Post 1423044)
Will not be driven hard IF I inspect the bearings and then give this a try. I'll probably send the oil in for analysis too. I should of done all of this last Oct...lesson learned.

Or I could just drive it 500 miles to Lykins Motorsport in Kentucky :p
I'm no expert, but I assume something will go wrong at idle almost as much as DumbDumb's comment of 6,000 RPM. You seem to know what you're doing. Follow the advice of checking everything you can, both under the valve cover and with the oil pan removed. And as Brent said, assuming all looks good and tight, change the oil and filter and drive it. Slowly at first and as your confidence grows after a whole lot of miles, then increase the RPMs.

Hopefully, everything is OK and the known remains an unknown. Or as Patrick's idol once said:

"As we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns—the ones we don’t know we don’t know."

I think these particles in the oil were "unknown unknowns" and now are "known unknowns." :LOL:

wolf k 06-02-2017 07:44 AM
Interesting, your particles look similar to these;
http://www.clubcobra.com/forums/smal...ound-sump.html


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