Pick your side

[RACER X #99]

Do you support SAAC... keeper of the flame or

Team Shelby who is trying to extinguish the flame?

[Ron61]

No Poll? With all the stuff being put out and I don't really know what is factual and what is twisted around, I will remain neutral at the moment.

Edited To Add: I am not sitting on the fence. I have made my preferences known and was a member of SAAC until a few years ago when I got to ill to attend any meets. I think from what I have read and heard the SAAC is more accurate is what they put out than some on the other side. If our votes would settle things, then the SAAC would get mine. I would just like to hear the real facts behind why Shelby and his organization has suddenly started this mess.

Ron

[1985 CCX]

I side with getting along and forwarding the hobby versus making waves and dragging it down.

[Blue66]

Been both a die hard Shelby fan/owner since 1965. Allways held CS up with the highest regards ... BUT really don't like what he is trying to do now.. Ill side with the SAAC!!! Or whatever they have to change their name to

[427sharpe]

SAAC
Clear enough?

[RACER X #99]

If Team Shelby prevails there is a good chance this site could lose the right to include Cobra in it's name. Seems like CS is looking for exclusive use. Better start thinking up a new name for Club Cobra, perhaps Club Replica.I don't think TS has claimed that one yet.

[Excaliber]

For those of you on the fence...

Plenty of people think 'dictators' are doing an OK job as well, in the beginning. Why make waves? Eventually most of the people figure it out, in time you might figure it out as well. But the damage will be done, to SAAC, because you didn't figure it out soon enough. This is WAR. Shelby is out to destroy SAAC, period. There is MORE than sufficient data to make a decision one way or the other, and you should. Get off the dam fence.

SAAC MUST PREVAIL.

Here's my plan for that stinkin' license plate frame on my car...

[Ron61]

Ernie,

I would like to see SAAC prevail, but I doubt if what I want or think is going to sway the lawyers and others a bit. They kept the Shelby Legend alive all those years he was gone, and I belonged to the club for years before I decided I was past my prime for racing. I still have all of my magazines that I got during that time.

I took anything that had Shelby on it off of my car quite a while before I sold it as they had to many people walking around at the car shows looking for that. Especially at the big one in April.

Ron

[Excaliber]

To all:
If you aren't currently a member of SAAC you should join them in membership. It's $47 for the first year and $40 for renewal after that. Your membership WILL help.

Sign up here.

Welcome to the official website of SAAC

My original plan was to join both SAAC and Team Shelby. Never got around to signing up for Team Shelby and now realize it's a good thing I didn't. No amount of showers could erase the shame I would now be feeling had I joined them.

[REAL 1]

Explain why you can't support both.
Explain why SAAC needs CS' endorsement and rights to the Cobra logo to survive.

[turnpike boy]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

Explain why you can't support both.
Explain why SAAC needs CS' endorsement and rights to the Cobra logo to survive.

Explain why CS needs all the accomplishments SAAC has generated.

That answer might give rise to why support for both is specious.

[Naumoff]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

Explain why you can't support both.
Explain why SAAC needs CS' endorsement and rights to the Cobra logo to survive.

From what I have read so far it is not just his name that he doesn't want them to use he wants everything SAAC has including the registry information which was not his in the first place.

If Shelby gets what his lawyer want, it will be like Christmas Eve in Whoville after the Grinch went through there and I don't think a change of heart will be in the next chapter.

Now explain how you can support both.

[John McMahon]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

Explain why you can't support both.
Explain why SAAC needs CS' endorsement and rights to the Cobra logo to survive.

[Jamo]

Now Johnny, ya know that weren't nice. Go stand in the corner.

Let's keep it down to a mild roar folks.

[Excaliber]

Why I personally can't support both and MUST support SAAC is simple:

What Shelby is doing is ethically repugnant.

[daltondavid]

SAAC did not back SHELBY in 93 with his amazing find in his old warehouse of 43 Franes he claimed were Authentic. Old vendettas die hard! Revenge is a dish best served Cold. so one Cold day in 1999 (after 14 years of operating without anything more than a handshake), he asks his pals at SAAC to sign this Paper that "Dont mean Nothin but it will make my lawyers happy."That is when Kopec and EBER mistakenly bit into the same Apple from the Garden of eden! 3 years ago Shelby quietly started Trademarking Names. He also coincidently Hires Amy Boylan who in a similar move while at "HOT WHEELS" formed a Corporate "HOT WHEELS CLUB" (Sound familiar??) together they form "Team SHELBY". His Club!! but how can it start let alone survive with SAAC around?? well, then last year he even applies to trademark "SAAC"!! STOP THIEF!! his lawsuit demands clearly shows his real intent. put SAAC out of business and take over the Registry. imagine how many "Eleanors" can be annointed as "Genuine Shelby Mustangs" if Ol Shel were to get his Mitts on that?? years ago when I first came to this forum, I beat the Carroll Shelby Drum till I was deaf. Guys would accuse me of drinking Snake Oil or Kool Aid! then one day I put the Drum down and tuned in to what was happening around here. I never picked that Drum up again! I remember the Carroll Shelby in pictures and who I thought he was fondly. the truth to who he really is makes me and many others wish we never heard of him before.

[Jamo]

Asscuse me, but I said a mild roar.

Everyone's cooperation is appreciated...and expected.

[mrmustang]

Back to the subject at hand.

#1: I support SAAC in this fight.
#2: I admire Shelby for what he was back in the 60's, not for what he has now become.
#3: I have already stated publicly and in writing that Shelby, Shelby Licensing, and any and all corporations or partnerships held by S.A.I. do not have my written permission to use any my information as held in trust by S.A.A.C. and it's corporate officers.
#4: Let the fight begin.

[John McMahon]

Sorry Jamo, not picking on Evan, but I don't think this is a case of standing on the sidelines. A line was drawn and IMHO yer on one side or another. Plus, I was dying to use that .jpeg!

Sorry Evan, that is how I see it. I though with all your talk over the years about The Registry and originality, that you would have been the first in line with your Golden Wonka ticket, just waiting for the SAAC Forum to come online so you could join with the other CSX owners. Instead you signed on with Team Shelby. You are a strange bird, no doubt!

I think Shel is entitled to whatever was loaned to SAAC by him and whatever was agreed to for the use of the license ($1 a year me thinks?). All else belongs to SAAC. Without their perserverance over the years Shel would have been forgotten after his $helby Omni in '84 or the Viper.

I stang firmly behind SAAC in this fight.

...and thats all I gots to say about that!

[computerworks]

Let's lay some stuff on the table, now that a lot of this has been revealed to the public.

I am a Shelby enthusiast...have been since I bought my first GT350 in the 60's. I am in this hobby for the fun. Have met more good people over the years, went to endless events, sanctioned or not, did a lot of racing, got far too many speeding tickets, etc.
...all because of the hobby and the pure fun it brings to a brand-loyal car guy.

Maybe you're in it for the fun, too? Most of us are.

At first, it was really sad to see the anger and the arguing that was going on... on all the boards...among the fans and enthusiasts.
Now, it has passed the point of fraternal disagreement... and has entered the most dangerous zone ever seen by the car enthusiast...one that will have far-reaching consequences in the hobby forever.

A manufacturer is suing his own fan club.

In what is now clearly an attempt to accelerate the success of a marketing program at the expense of an independent club that might be competition to the program.

But, some forget, that although Shelby Autos may look like they are having fun sometimes...they are in it for the money.
Not a bad thing you see...because, unlike most all of us, they are in this as a business...which means you are supposed to be in it for the money.

Team Shelby is a marketing plan. It is designed to foster brand loyalty and sell more stuff. A good plan.

Car clubs (and websites/forums) are created by enthusiasts, who want to foster and share their passion for a certain car or marque.

Clubs (and websites/forums) are created by manufacturers as part of a brand marketing/brand loyalty program. To keep the existing customers thinking about you, to attract new, potential customers, to create a mailing list and to sell hats and t-shirts.

There's a difference...and you can't do that overnight. It took SAAC 33 years to build a worldwide organization of adoring Shelby fans, through the good times and the bad.

When Team Shelby was unveiled at SEMA in November, I thought two things...one, well, that's neat...and, two, hoo boy, now another forum to check regularly.
I joined the forum and got the lay of the land. It wasn't new, it was an existing online club of S197 fans that had been re-branded.
That's OK...you can't build a community overnight...it's taken CC more than 6 years...so go out and buy one.

The first alarm was when we started seeing quotes like, "...Team Shelby is the only club officially recognized by the Shelby factory."
The next alarm began with the sordid sequence of events revolving around SAAC and the licensing of all words and things Shelby and the quick turn to legal actions, which I will spare a rehash here.
Further bells went off as more content and promised features became private, features for only those that sent in $50 and got on the mailing list.
Now, this "unified registry" shows up on Team Shelby....where you fill out your personal information and, oh yeah, some info about your car.
... but you are going to have to pay the $50 to read it.

Something's up.

Fast forward to Jan. 31, 2008.

Sparing all the foreplay that lead up to it...

Carroll Shelby Licensing has filed legal papers against SAAC that is a clear attempt to destroy the organization and capture the Registry, the lifes-work of the club.

The full text of the filing is out there...but here are two key elements...

1. They are claiming licensing rights to the following WORDS and THINGS...
...and are pleading to the court that SAAC NO LONGER HAS THE LEGAL RIGHT TO USE THESE WORDS:

CS Designs
Shelby
Carroll Shelby
Carroll Shelby's Photograph, Likeness and Voice
Carroll Shelby's Signature and Initials
Shelby American Inc.
Team Shelby
Shelby Cobra
Shelby GT-350
Shelby GT-350H
Shelby GT-350R
Shelby GT-350 Europa
Shelby TA Boss
Shelby Lonestar
Shelby GT-500
Shelby GT-500KR
Shelby Cobra 427
Shelby 289 Cobra Coupe
Shelby Cobra 289FIA
FIA 289
FIA Mark2
Shelby Cobra 427 S/C
Cobra
Cobra 427 S/C
427 S/C
Cobra 427
427
Shelby Cobra 427 Roadster
Dragonsnake
Competition
Twin-Paxton
Fliptop
Sunbeam Tiger
Shelby Cobra 289 Sebring Roadster
Lemans Hardtop
Cooper Monaco KIng Cobra
Riverside
Dragonsnake
Slalom Snake
FIA Roadster
King Cobra
Can-am Roadster
Can-am Racer
Competition Roadster
Shelby Cobra Coupe
Super Coupe
King Cobra
Shelby Series 1
Shelby Series 1 Logo
Shelby SP350
The Cobra Snake design used with any variants of the 1960's Cobra
The appearance and shape of the Cocra 260, 289, 427, Coupe and Shelby Series 1.

Shelby Licensing is claiming they will be irreparably damaged in the marketplace if SAAC continues to use any of these words, phrases or things.

2. They are asking the court to rule that:

The defendant (SAAC) must discontinue the use of the Licensed Properties and the Total Properties and discontinue the manufacture, distribution and sale of any Licensed Properties, including but not limited to any past or future editions of the products manufactured and sold by Defendant, e.g. The Shelby American World Registry, Shelby Automobile Club newsletters or other publications of the Defendant.

Yes... let me rephrase that... They are seeking a ruling to prohibit SAAC from publishing a Registry and sending Newsletters to the membership.

This is clearly ...a methodical...premeditated... attempt to dismantle and destroy SAAC.

Team Shelby may have been a good marketing idea at the start...
...but this tactic by the Shelby empire has simply killed it for any vintage Shelby enthusiast.
You can't separate CSLI and Team Shelby...any attempt is pure spin.

So, Evan, back to your question:

Originally Posted by REAL 1

Explain why you can't support both.
Explain why SAAC needs CS' endorsement and rights to the Cobra logo to survive.

How is it possible for any vintage enthusiast to not see it for what it is?

Evan... I checked. You have invoked the words of SAAC about 800 times as the ultimate authority of your car's provenance.

Originally Posted by REAL 1

To me its simple. The new Cobras are not a replica of a Cobra as they are Cobras. Ask Welcome to the official website of SAAC As SAAC puts it, the only difference between the original series and the Continuation series is the time frame they were made. I agree.

Originally Posted by REAL 1

Simple fact is there are "rules" on what is and is not a REAL Cobra. That controlling rule making body is SAAC. I would refer all those who don't get or understand the difference between the Continuation Series (the new series of REAL Cobras) from the original series (the original series of REAL Cobras) to Welcome to the official website of SAAC. The explanation and answer to this perplexing problem for some is right on their main page.

Like it or not the Continuation Series is a REAL Cobra. Thats SAAC's answer. I'm just repeating it and have been for years.

Without SAAC, who, now, becomes your validator for that distinction? ...the actual manufacturer? ...yeah...that's validity.

And, we spoke about this on the phone... One month ago you asked a Cobra question on Team Shelby...that went unanswered for 30 days, until Amy finally guessed at the answer last night.
I waited to see who would provide the expertise...no one did.

And, now, if you want to talk about vintage GT-350 or GT-500 stuff...the Team Shelby site automatically bounces you to Randall's shelbyforums.com site, because there's no vintage talent on TS in that area either.
...and who has provided all the expertise on Randall's site? ...SAAC members, that's who.

And try and post anything about SAAC on TS and find yourself mugged by insiders, with threads closed and deleted.

So, take sides? There is now a hard line in the sand.

I am a live-and-let-live kind of guy, and the newgen guys can have a nice home at TS...

...but seeing now that it needed a lawsuit to gain an advantage at the expense of thousands of Shelby enthusiasts..

Unless some things change, that place is dead to me.