Looking For An Alloy CSX4000? Here Ya Go

[Excaliber]

When I rebuilt my engine I made a decision to stay true to the original specs within reason. While I would prefer a more accurate car to start with than the ERA we all do the best we can with what we have. Some like modern stuff, others strive for more original when/where they can within their budget.

For my engine, I chose to stay with iron heads, replaced the roller cam with a flat tappet, kept the Le Mans rods, etc. I DID make a concession with the pistons, 12.5 to 1 just won't cut it with todays pump gas, so I reluctantly went modern with a lower compression ratio. I just hate myself for giving in like that, but my therapist assures me it's "OK".

[RodKnock]

Ernie, you can raise your compression back up again, because when you come to CA and live near Redwood City, there's a solution. There's a nearby gas station that sells the following: 100 octane unleaded race gas straight from the pump, 110 octane leaded Sunoco race gas or finally, 112 octane leaded Sunoco race gas. The leaded varieties cannot be pumped directly into your car though.

Don't ask the price, but you now you can relive the '60's with some high performance gas.

[Excaliber]

Don't ask the price,

Therein lays ONE of the problems! The other is availability. I could also buy race gas at a pump here on Oahu. ONE pump, ONE station. Terribly inconvient when your on the other side of the island.

What I miss most is the sound, the exhaust note. High compression is like a cannon boom, now it sounds more like a mouse in comparison.

[rollinggeorge]

This thread has been interesting and has taken a few curves in the road.

Saving money is worthy pursuit.

Aluminum bodied cars with FE Engine is the drivable trophy if one has the means to spend the bread.

Keith Craft 482 Aluminum Pond Block 600+ HP runs quite well on pump gas Race gas performance is desirable...costly but not conveniently available on the streets.

My conclusion for driving pleasure...better engineered surpasses duplicating outdated technology. The purist cars are true museum trophies.

I prefer a Corsair over what the Wright Bros. flew at Kitty Hawk.
That is why they make both Ford and Chevrolet...albiet Government Motors may end this choice as they introduce the approved peoples car which I fear may be roller skates in the near future.

It took a couple of years to reach a decision for my Cobra...Enjoying the ride as custodian for this future Legend.

[Excaliber]

Thats a good point, not all, but some of these cars will still be around when we are long gone. We are but temporary stewards.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by Excaliber

We are but temporary stewards.

... and the owner doesn't choose the Cobra, it's the other way around.

[Excaliber]

There seems to be little question that the market price goes down with age. But I tell you this, the BEST (OK, boy there's a term that varies widely in it's definition),,, the BEST replica's I've seen are in fact many older versions. I recall a stunning Contemporary here on island a few years back. Webers, accurate detailing, just the right amount of "bling". Whew, don't see many like that anymore. But such a build was reasonably common a decade or so ago. Back then the ONLY people that could get in the Cobra game had deep pockets, even a common brand would set you back a $100K. Side oiler of course! Not much after market stuff around, you had to improvise.

Today it's fairly easy for a lot more folks to get into the Cobra scene. Far less money required now than then. Copies being cranked out on a daily basis, modern this that blah blah. Well, OK, so we have a new ball game then. And I have a deeper appreciation for the "old school" replica's myself.

There are some VERY NICE true to original spec replica's or Shelby's built today, and like "back then" it still costs a bunch to get there. If you want the very best, bring a big wallet!

[REAL 1]

Yup, just as I suspected. After one thread where everyone was all warm and fuzzy you guys are back at throwing sand in each others eyes. I didn't even start this thread but as usual there will be those that will blame me anyway.

I'm one of those "morons" that valued the Shelby name.

Very simply, the way I see it here is that there are two groups here. (1) those that truely don't see the added value of owning a Shelby but they have the money but don't see the value in spending the extra $$$ to buy a Shelby. (2) then theres the group that denigrate the "value" of the Shelby name that don't have the money to step up and buy a Shelby and make themselves feel better by knocking what they really would've rather have had (a Shelby) but can't afford and by knocking the Shelby "value"/name" they somehow feel better about what they chose to buy thereby elevating their own intelligence above the "morons" that bought a Shelby.

I'd be willing to bet the latter group out numbers the former here.

Lets review some facts shall we:

1. AC supplied the chasis and body for original Cobras
2. Original Shelby's by and large sell for more than original ACs.
3. Kirkham supplied many chasis and aluminum bodies for a majority of the Continuation Cobras.
4. Continuation Cobras by and large sell for more than Kirkhams and resale for more then Kirkhams.
5. At there core these cars (Origianl Shelbys, Continuation Shelbys and Kirkhams) are nothing more than a collection of parts that are more or less similar or eqivilent in design and cost. Thus there are "intangible" factors that seems to be playing a role in dictating value here. Hmmmm...what could they be?
6. If I may...those intangibles seem to be year of construction (when built) and .....gee what do you know...Name.

What I am sure of is this. Yes. Aluminum Shelby's cost more than Kirkhams. Yes, glass Shelby's cost more then SPFs and the rest of the glass replicas but in the end the Shelby's also resale for more.

Will the Continuation series increase substantially in value in the future? If Shelby Autos continues to make more, they will likely hold there value better then others that aren't Shelbys but increase substantally or at all... probably not.

Right now there are approximately 180 aluminum continuation series Shelby Cobras existing. Less then the original series.

However, if SAI stops making them or goes out of business and especially when CS passes...I'm willing to bet those that could have afforded the "Shelby" and bought the Kirkham or the SPF instead will feel like the well..... "morons"

Another thing for sure. If you have a Shelby Cobra, its a "Cobra" and not a replica thereof and always will be a Shelby Cobra at the end of the day. If you have a SPF, ERA, FFR or whatever, at the end of the day thats all your left with a replica of what the moron Shelby owners have...a Cobra. Sorry them is the facts. Ask SAAC.

Takes care.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

... then theres the group that denigrate the "value" of the Shelby name that don't have the money to step up and buy a Shelby and make themselves feel better by knocking what they really would've rather have had (a Shelby) but can't afford and by knocking the Shelby "value"/name" they somehow feel better about what they chose to buy thereby elevating their own intelligence above the "morons" that bought a Shelby.

Now that's sure to put you right at the front of the popularity line around here. Care to join me for sensitivity classes on Tues/Thurs nights?

[Silverback51]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Now that's sure to put you right at the front of the popularity line around here. Care to join me for sensitivity classes on Tues/Thurs nights?

Can I join too? I'm sometimes a real A-Hole.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by Silverback51

Can I join too? I'm sometimes a real A-Hole.

Of course, there's always room for one more. Maybe you could pick up ERAChas & RodKnock on your way over?

[Gunner]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

(2) then theres the group that denigrate the "value" of the Shelby name that don't have the money to step up and buy a Shelby and make themselves feel better by knocking what they really would've rather have had (a Shelby) but can't afford and by knocking the Shelby "value"/name" they somehow feel better about what they chose to buy thereby elevating their own intelligence above the "morons" that bought a Shelby.

I'll bet you buy Bose audio products, too.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by Gunner

I'll bet you buy Bose audio products, too.

Hey those Bose cubes are the best!

[Got the Bug]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

However, if SAI stops making them or goes out of business and especially when CS passes...I'm willing to bet those that could have afforded the "Shelby" and bought the Kirkham or the SPF instead will feel like the well..... "morons"

You must be smoking the wacky tobacky. When CS passes, you have no idea what his heirs might do.

They could potentially make licensing decisions that dilute the value of the brand. Their main focus is going to be to generate revenue and they won't think twice if impacts the value of the existing continuation (replica) Cobra market.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by Got the Bug

When CS passes, you have no idea what his heirs might do.

"Licensed and Authorized by the Heirs of Carroll Shelby," not bad. How 'bout "the CSX-X3___ series, A Tribute to a Legend," even better. It'll only be done for a while though -- the next generation just won't be buying them and our cars (both the "real" continuation cars, plastic ERAs, and FFRs will all be relegated to the peculiar category of replicas of something that only sits in museums and the occasional private collection. The fact that CS signed off on Evan's replica (or the fact that he signed off on my replica) really won't make a difference.

[RodKnock]

The CSX that was in my original post, CSX4385, sold for $106,300.

An older Kirkham with a Southern Automotive engine (cast iron block/aluminum heads/not detailed for sale) just recently sold for $75,000. Another Kirkham on Cobra Country just recently sold (actually twice) for the low $90K's.

That's anywhere from $15,000-30,000 premium over a nice Kirkham, all things being equal. Isn't that about the cost of the Shelby premium?

CSX 4385:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...K%3AMEWAX%3AIT

[GTED]

Did it sell privately, after the auction ended? I saw it was "reserve not met".

GTED

Originally Posted by RodKnock

The CSX that was in my original post, CSX4385, sold for $106,300.

An older Kirkham with a Southern Automotive engine (cast iron block/aluminum heads/not detailed for sale) just recently sold for $75,000. Another Kirkham on Cobra Country just recently sold (actually twice) for the low $90K's.

That's anywhere from $15,000-30,000 premium over a nice Kirkham, all things being equal. Isn't that about the cost of the Shelby premium?

CSX 4385:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...K%3AMEWAX%3AIT

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by GTED

Did it sell privately, after the auction ended? I saw it was "reserve not met".

GTED

Dag-nabit. I made a mistake. Must be a senior moment, but then, I'm not a senior.

I didn't see those three words earlier during the day. Now that my eyes are working again...My fault.

BTW, I very offended by the term "moron." The politically correct term is "developmentally challenged."

Is an aluminum CSX worth more than a Kirkham because of the name? I think so. Will it appreciate or depreciate faster than a Kirkham? I'll have to disagree.

[madmaxx]

Wait a gd minute, I purchased a SPF with Carol Shelby name on the VIN plate and is know to be the only licensed replica by CS. Which the fuk is it Real 1 does CS name add value or not???

PatrickT, that is the best you could come up with? wow, you must have a hiernated disc and be on vicadin. Get back in the game.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by madmaxx

PatrickT, that is the best you could come up with? wow, you must have a hiernated disc and be on vicadin. Get back in the game.

I sensed Evan was borderline apoplectic and wanted to take a "lighter approach." He's too easy to bait -- it really takes the fun out of it. Kind of like doing card tricks for a five year old.