ABS / Traction Control

[DaveW]

Howdy,

Whats involved in ABS braking and Traction Control ?

In the bits i'm accumulating, all the hubs have sensors, picked up the VE 4 channel ABS unit with plug end for nothing when i was scouring for VZ knuckles and hubs, Is there any other computer involved, does it integrate with the ECU somehow.

Same for traction control, dose it connect to ECU or is it all done by brake modulation ?

Cruise Control, i love my cruise control, what would be involved with adopting a factory setup from a commodore ?

Anybody actually fitted and got operating ?

Cheers

Dave

[Rwillia4]

There are some guys here that have installed TC on their rides. I think there are two type break modulation type which can independently control each rear and required sensors on each hub (including fronts). There is also CPU based TC that could use independent sensors but you could also use a driveshaft sensor. this system could cut spark, cut fuel or retard timing.

There are a number of companies that make controllers, I know of FAST. There was a recent thread that talked about this with some more particulars.

[OZCOBRA]

If memory serves me right I believe John Cini's car was fitted I know he was dabbling with it years back!!!


Have a look at RaceLogic as well.... Racelogic - Experts in data logging, video logging & GPS

[sambo]

The BA(?) Falcon ABS setup has been fitted to at least one Melbourne Cobra that I know of. Only necessary if you have a boat anchor up front.

[Zedn]

The issue that you might run into is if the donar vehicle has ESC. Then i think the ABS and traction control may be all integrated into it.

Sideshow probably has expirience with the electronics side of it.

[Rog246]

Originally Posted by sambo

The BA(?) Falcon ABS setup has been fitted to at least one Melbourne Cobra that I know of. Only necessary if you have a boat anchor up front.

Why would someone put a Chev engine on an anchor chain ? Don't you just throw 'em overboard ?
Rog

[Rebel1]

Originally Posted by Rog246

Why would someone put a Chev engine on an anchor chain ? Don't you just throw 'em overboard ?
Rog

Hehehe very bluddy funny

[Gaz64]

Using VE gear could be difficult.

The ABS (or EBCM - Electronic Brake Control Module) is in the middle of the GMHSLAN, GM High Speed Bus.

You'll need the VE PCM for the engine, plus virtually every other HS Bus module.

The cruise control is PCM controlled by stalk and brake/clutch switch inputs driving an electronic throttle body.

[sideshow]

cruise control is piss easy to get working if yoru running a gen 4 ls2 ls3 etc
just get person who is doing your motor loom to fit the necessary parts
abs is abit of a pain depending which way u go
u need to get the correct abs module and the ve one is the wrong one
like i always tell people when u get things for free 99% of the time they r the worng bits hehehehehe

we can do the whole loom etc for what u want
if u get someopne else then we are not really interested in fixing the fkups from others who have attempted to do the job
we have so much on if anyoen has a job already done by another auto elct i normally just say go back to them
im not even selling them parts to fix their problems getting too many problems when fixing fkups and then they come back and blame us

anyway do some more research and maybe even go see the guys at holden
they should help u heheheheheh

[sideshow]

also the later ecus have a different brake signal setup to the early ecus
so u basically need to look at the whole engine wiring first and revise that setup
if u plan to run abs and cruise and trc

so have u got any other bits apart from your ve abs unit
also what year is your motor
and please dont say u bought a gm performance ls2 ls3 loom kit
cause i would advise to throw it in a bucket of water as thats how they work the best hahahahahahahah

[kyleb]

I have an LS1 from a C5 Vette which incorporates DBW with a painless performance harness which went together ok, it also has wiring for the cruise control, I also was wondering if I want to get this working is it just a matter of hooking up a stalk with the on/off, resume and accel/decel function?

[sideshow]

think he has an ls7
so if he is running the e38 ecu he needs ti fit a pim
or run a ve bcm big pain
usa cars dont run pims
usa ls1 use different tac module to aussie ls1s and also differnet dbw pedals
dbw ls1s have cruise go thru the tac module
so depends what he is running will depend which way to go about it
he is in melb so might even be worth calling castle auto elects

[Zedn]

Sideshow,

What is wrong with the GM performance controller and loom kits? They are cheap enough and seem like an easy install. I know they take away work from you guys, but by the sounds of it you arent crying out for more work.

Intersted to hear you opinion on them.

[OZCOBRA]

"Sideshow,
I know they take away work from you guys, but by the sounds of it you arent crying out for more work."

"Interested to hear you opinion on them"............hehehehehhhehhehhehhehehehehehehe hehehehehehehe....

As usual gives some GREAT advice!!!!!!

Then says "pi$$ off ....... COBRA guys are a pack of whingers and not worth the trouble!!!"

Why don't you stick with the other forums that make it so profitable for you!!! ...but NO we can see the potential here with all the GM gear going in can't we!!!...careful biting the hand that feeds you!!!
...Zedn just joined the growing number on here whom see the 2 headed Snake!!!

[400TT]

If you are serious about traction control, then I would recommend to go with an aftermarket adjustable setup.

Originally Posted by Zedn

What is wrong with the GM performance controller and loom kits?

We use the GM Performance Kits exclusively here. We need to modify the looms to suit, but they work out perfectly. Cheapest option and all the parts and loom are OEM quality.

Just keep in mind GM Performance use the latest E67 ECU's in a lot of their Kits. They can be fully programmed by HP Tuners/VCM Suite, but we have heard of problems doing mafless tunes if that is the direction you want to take. The HP Tuners software may be updated enough now to fully support mafless with E67, not something most of our customers worry about.

[DaveW]

Sideshow,
I have the LS7, its a 2009 crate motor, came with Controller and Engine Harness.
In terms of collecting ABS parts all i have at the moment are the VZ front hubs and VE rear which are all fitted with sensors.

The VE module is neither here nor there, picked up for nothing, someone else may have a use for it. Its from a low 26K GTS roll over that had traction control if anybody is interested and i don't end up using it, There are heaps of VZ ones around sitting in wrecks everywhere, what about those.?

I'm not at the stage of wiring harness yet, but would like to know what i need before i get there.

What car should i get an ABS module off, if VE isnt the go?

How can i tell the type of controller i have, it has bar codes and part numbers "12597121" & "12603892" but nothing the resembles "E38" what ever that means.
What Controller should i have got for ease of operation ?

RE: Cruise control, if factory isn't the go, what is,
Where does it pick up the speed signal from, ABS Sensors ? Speedo ?, something else?, do i need a separate controller or is it part of Engine controller.

Do i look at aftermarket stuff, it seems to me that a lot of this OE stuff is not the usual wrecker pickings and therefore is cheap.
But maybe not worth the effort ?

Anyway, any info / education i can get from here is all good, otherwise i will get from somewhere else.

[Doubledip]

Originally Posted by DaveW

How can i tell the type of controller i have, it has bar codes and part numbers "12597121" & "12603892" but nothing the resembles "E38" what ever that means.
What Controller should i have got for ease of operation ?

RE: Cruise control, if factory isn't the go, what is,
Where does it pick up the speed signal from, ABS Sensors ? Speedo ?, something else?, do i need a separate controller or is it part of Engine controller.

so ECU's have E38 on the white stickers .. others dont... but on the finned side if you look closely at the top you will see a tiny casting saying E38 (or E40 , E67)

as for the service part no.s 12597121 is a E38 (MY07 - originally VE) 12603892 is a E38 (MY06 - originally VZ)

as for curise i would recommend just sticking with factory setup... GM dont spend millions on this stuff to do it wrong. It can be setup and works excellent in a no Holden vehicle.. Speak to the workshop that is going to supply the harness for you and they should be able to set it up for you along with the ABS

[Doubledip]

Originally Posted by Zedn

Sideshow,

What is wrong with the GM performance controller and loom kits? They are cheap enough and seem like an easy install. I know they take away work from you guys, but by the sounds of it you arent crying out for more work.

Intersted to hear you opinion on them.

So its an unbiased opinion i will take somepics of a GMPP loom today and post tonight if i remember. You can then be the judge to whether you would like one of these looms on your pride and joy or not

[Zedn]

Sideshow and Doubledip,

I just wanted your opinion on it for which you are entitled to have. Thankyou for that. Sounds like the issue isnt the equipment but the availability of people that can tune them. Dont worry, i wouldnt be buying from Eagle if thats who you are refering to. The kits are half the price elsewhere.

Craig,

Have you had an emmissions test done with the GMPP controller? I was told they dont comply with emmissions and that only the E-Rod does but that information may not be correct.

Cheers

[Doubledip]

Originally Posted by Zedn

Sideshow and Doubledip,

Sounds like the issue isnt the equipment but the availability of people that can tune them.

for me the tuning isnt an issue personally as i am not a tuner - tuning is a problem from what i hear for others... my issue is the loom is made to be very universal in its application and this is where it falls done big time for people wanting a nice job. AS i said once i post pics it will be a little clearer for those who havent seen one in the flesh. I hadn't until about a week ago and i just shake my head at this poor customer and the amount of money he has spent on it (along with the GMPP transmission controller - as the GMPP looms dont do auto) and it still needs to be modded now to fit his Aussie Alternator etc...