Cobra Kits Australia

[guye]

Hi jasbel.

There are many threads on this forum I encourage you to read when forming opinion about the various kits. The pros and cons of each kit are many and will ultimately suit the individual. Things like size, body shape (a big differentiator for me), location, price, driveline options, etc, etc are all important factors. It also depends on your level of skill and/or willingness to fabricate bits, etc.

Just so you know, the kit manufacturers are also members of our various clubs and are variously our friends too - it is quite a small community really. We welcome and encourage healthy discussion on the forum, however you are probably best to go along to a few meetings - all the kits will be represented there and there will be no shortage of opinions and experiences you can benefit from.

I was reading some of your posts and I just wanted to mention this in case you wondered why you perhaps haven't seen the responses you might have expected to your thread so far. Many of us would feel uncomfortable having the discussions in writing, but would be happy to talk in person I think.

Just my 2c.

[Donunder]

Yes .... very well put Guy.

Nothing better than having a real live Cobra in front of you, and an owner prepared to discuss all aspects of the build and ownership experience when you're weighing up your options.

[Jasbel]

Hi all

I apologise if I may of offended and upset some members here as this was not my intentions, sometimes I get excited about things and forget where I am run off at the mouth with out thinking "Sorry Everyone"


Yes I need to do a lot more research before I make any further decisions as you all make good and valid points

Yes I need to go to some of the cobra events and talk and discuss with some of you about our loved ac Cobra's

I'll be the one waiving the White Flag

Once again my apologies to everyone

Cheers and best wishes to all

Darren

[guye]

No harm no foul Jasbel. You're all good.

I know what you mean about excited - now I've made the decision (took me 12 years!) I can't wait to start my build!

[Jasbel]

Hi

Anyone point me into the right direction to where I can obtain a Calander where these Cobra events are been held or do I need to sign for membership first?

After speaking to Andrew the other day from Fabrication 81 he said he is trying real hard to finish one of his Cobra ready for the next event, he also mention I could have a test drives as we'll, know that is something to really look forward to.

May I pick your brains again please, I ve also taking a liking to the Classic Revival Kits as we'll, seems there area lot of happy owners, tried to call there office to purchase one of there Brochures for more info. Unfortunately they are away on holidays until the end of the month.

I think I read somewhere that this gentleman is selling his business's due to bad health, from what I've been reading about the quality of his kits and his contribution this will be a great loss to the cobra community.

I hope he will be avaiable in the very near future if I decide to purchase one if his kits

Do you think there Will be any CR kits to see and drive at the events.

Here I go again talking and asking to many questions

Cheers Darren

[puttputt]

Mate, nothing you have said needs an apology imo. You have started an interesting thread
that is relevant to all folks that are at the same stage as yourself, heck, you even got Absolute Pace to respond, and it is nice to hear from the manufacturer.
So keep on firing away, because that is what the forum is all about.

I was very keen on the A/Pace kit, but decided I preferred a steel chassis, and they only seem to do aluminium, (but if it was a motorbike, then i would only want aluminium).

So good luck with your research, the only dumb question is the one asked when it is too late !

[Ryder]

I'm also (very slowly) building a Harrison, overall I'm happy with it. I ordered mine with mounts for LS2 as well, and like sambo said they were not even close to being right. I had to redo them. In hindsight I should have just ordered the kit with no mounts at all, they aren't hard to do. The fiberglass is fine, I think they have new moulds now, haven't noticed an alignment issue as yet. Oh I wasn't too thrilled with the angle between the steering shaft and the power steering rack either, but that's sorted out now.

So again, I think its a good kit, all kit cars will have their quirks and these have been around for long enough that you wont need to reinvent the wheel to get it how you want it. Good luck in your search

[Zeus]

Originally Posted by puttputt

Mate, nothing you have said needs an apology imo. You have started an interesting thread
that is relevant to all folks that are at the same stage as yourself, heck, you even got Absolute Pace to respond, and it is nice to hear from the manufacturer.
So keep on firing away, because that is what the forum is all about.

I was very keen on the A/Pace kit, but decided I preferred a steel chassis, and they only seem to do aluminium, (but if it was a motorbike, then i would only want aluminium).

So good luck with your research, the only dumb question is the one asked when it is too late !

Well said puttputt

I think what you have to consider is that everyone is going to be loyal to the brand they have chosen and the decision that they made to choose their particular car.

But to throw some fuel on a fire.

I'm sick and tired of all the BS about the pace car, its why I don't bother with this forum.

I actually suggested a friend of mine in NSW look at the Pace car but he gave up as his emails went continually un replied and phone calls not returned.

Clinch point for him was that when he approached an accredited Engineer in NSW, was actually the recommended Engineer from the NSW Cobra Club he was warned off the kit.

Out of curiosity I called the Engineer myself although I have absolutely no interest in ever building one. He said he had 3 customers intending to build pace kits but he would not look at them until the design fault in the suspension had been rectified.

It was something about a design fault that would cause the vehicle to be dangerous should a spring or shock failure. He was astounded that Pace were continuing to offer the kit to the public in its current design.

I must admit, I am blown away with the number of people who have committed to this kit when there is not even one that has been registered.
Not even a Factory Demo or R & D vehicle.

Perhaps Mr White could elaborate on these two points. I know that he is aware of the issue as the Engineer had discussed with him personally.

I'm not attacking Craig as I accept that his reputation and ability are 1st class but if it is correct that the Pace was released almost 3 years ago why are there none completed.

If I was in his position I would have wanted some more piece of mind that my customers were going to be safe by way of building and registering a car rather than trusting in a computer drawing programme that it should all be ok.

To then actually accept orders from customers who have acted in good faith on the hype that you have created when not even one had ever even hit the road.
Wow that's balls.

Thought it was pretty curious also how Mr White just seemed to vanish off this forum when he was confronted by Damage over his dealings with Absolute Pace on his Kirkham. (Last I heard AP now has a lawsuit to answer on this one).

I'm on my 3rd Factory Five in just under 3 years and couldn't be happier. The product is 1st class and the support ( not that I needed any) was there if I did. Cobra went together like a meccano set and flew through full ICV rego. The 33 Hot Rod was a little more challenging but all done inside 12 months and now I'm onto an 818.

And Absolute Pace has 20 employee's?? Well what the f#*k are they all doing.
If the kit is as complete and superior as you say then why don't you just stop them for a day or two and build a car. If it was a Factory Five you could.

And to all those Pace boys with your spread sheets, how bout you wait til you have a registered car and have added up the receipt file before you get too sucked into spreading all the hype about how good these cars are.

$85k already on a spreadsheet for a gel coated finish car with stick on stripes, good luck with that.

Ok boys kick away, Only thing I'll add is that unless you have built and registered your Pace 427 please don't bother.

[Wazza]

I was at the factory today....these cars are awesome....their GT40 is amazing.

It would blow you're tiny mind Zeus if you want to go and get some facts before you write this rubbish.

By the way....
We were also standing around a Factory Five Daytona,in there getting headers made......it was a bloody mess....roughest body I've ever seen.

That car is part of a batch of Factory Five Cars that arrived here on the Gold Coast 7 years ago...5 Daytonas,and one Cobra....I helped unload them from the container.

They were all a bloody nightmare to construct...nothing seemed to fit right,and very poor quality in many of the components...One is registered,and Two more will be registered in a month or so...but that's been 7 years...and the one we were checking out today has a LOT of work to get to rego....so you're experience with Factory Five cars is surprising..but good luck to you.


I don't know where to start on your post?

The first AP chassis to go into proper construction was just on ONE year ago....it's currently a matter of weeks away from being ready for rego.

He has since sold something like 35 AP Cobras to people who have taken the time to come and check out all of the facts ,checked out the product,and made informed decisions to build an AP Cobra.

I'm not sure other Australian Cobra manufacturers started out by building a Prototype,getting it registered,just to start selling to the public?
Maybe BDM,but who else?

If Craig had have built a "practice one" a couple of years ago,it would not really be the same as the current car anyway...there are a lot of innovations and improvements developed in the last 12 months.

Today there were TEN brand new LSA ( 6.2 supercharged 556 h.p.) engines and gear boxes sitting on the racks,just arrived and ready for installation in to Customers cars under construction.
There was one already installed in the Cobra we were checking out.
The whole factory is buzzing,and there is a ton of work going on.

Craig didn't vanish from the forum ...but once you've answered the same rubbish comments a dozen times...there's not much point in feeding the flames.

You might be a bit mixed up on that court case comment also...I think it's the other way around if anything.

Spend a few hours with Craig,and his mobile NEVER stops...but he won't answer calls,while he's talking to someone...he simply cannot get to every call,and returns as many as possible...emails are the best chance I'm told.

I've also seen comments on this forum about how certain clients thought they were on the "do not reply" list ,or some such nonsense ...and then seen on Craig's email screen,where that client had received over 100 emails,over a long period of time,at the rate of once or twice ( or more) emails a week....so don't believe a lot of what you read on this forum.

Your post is full of comments that seem to be intent on trying to hurt Craig's business..I'm not sure what your agenda is...but I'm sure you'd have a completely different attitude if you took the time to go and actually check their operation out.

What are his staff doing???.... FFS.....35 Cobras in 12 months!!...and a truck load of innovations that will completely change how Cobras and GT40s are built in Australia from now on..... You're a hard marker mate.

I don't own an AP Cobra....but I still give credit where credit is due...and I urge you to go and check these machines out...visit the factory,and talk to Craig....
Trust me,you'll be impressed.
Cheers,
Warren.

[Wazza]

By the way.....

My Cobra is a "Cobra Kits" car....(which is what this thread was originally asking about)...so I would ALSO highly recommend them as a tried and true kit...and certainly worthy of consideration.

I LOVE my Cobra,and in a perfect world I wouldn't mind also having an AP....

So take the time to check all of the different companies out....ask owners...and make an INFORMED decision on your purchase.

The AP rant above is simply trying to give some credit where it's due.

Cheers,
Warren

[d488y2]

Wazza's Cobra is awesome! I've seen it in for real it a real credit to him and Harrison.

I'm having a Pace built right now so Zeus go to the AP factory and see it getting built.
The crew At AP work dam hard and they are all passionate at what they do. And no one is more passionate about the work at AP then Craig White. Craig has gone out his way to help me build my car. He is storing engines, gearboxes and other parts for me. All free of charge, I've even offered to pay him rent for the storage, but Craig said No!
As as far as Craig not answering phone call/emails well he answers my calls and if he doesn't answer the 1st one we'll maybe he's busy! FFS his running a business !
Craig also sends me weekly updates on the build progress And I can't ask for any more
End of Rant!

[Cobra01]

Hello to all the knockers.

If you think you can do a better job then go and do it.

Don't castigate people on this Forum this is not what it is for.

Zeus how about a name of the NSW Engineer . Has he seen the CAD files of the design of the Absolute Pace Cobra , I don't think so.

What are you Moderators doing this rubbish shouldn't be allowed to be on this Forum.

I will let My Pace 427 SC do the talking for me.

Brad

[Dimis]

Wazza,

I just want to call you out on one item in Zeus's defense.

Your critiquing of FFR is a little unfair considering those kits were probably mark3 7yrs old kits (and not the new MarkIV), yet defend AP for not having a demo because of only 1yrs development and therefore the completed car no longer being relevant.

Craig is lucky to have a friend as loyal as you.

I've no dog in this fight... Just saying, I'm with Zeus on FFR being a solid bit of kit.

As for AP. hard to judge from my cheap seats


Ps. Good luck with your selection of kit Jasbel.

[Cobra01]

Originally Posted by Dimis

Wazza,

I just want to call you out on one item in Zeus's defense.

Your critiquing of FFR is a little unfair considering those kits were probably mark3 7yrs old kits (and not the new MarkIV), yet defend AP for not having a demo because of only 1yrs development and therefore the completed car no longer being relevant.

Craig is lucky to have a friend as loyal as you.

I've no dog in this fight... Just saying, I'm with Zeus on FFR being a solid bit of kit.

As for AP. hard to judge from my cheap seats


Ps. Good luck with your selection of kit Jasbel.

Jasbel

I have and will not ever criticize another Cobra Kit and I have not criticized the FFR kit (Read my post carefully)

Fact 1. The body of my car was laid in the mold April 2013 (Check my first Post)

Fact 2. I started work on the assembly of the chassis in June 2013 In the Absolute Pace Factory at the invitation of Craig.

Fact 3. I have seen the Chassis on the CAD and witnessed the torsion test and it was 100 to 200 percent above the minimum standard. (I cant remember the real number it was so long ago It may be more.)

Fact 3. The opinion from someone who quotes another persons opinion and not supplying names is a cowardly way to criticize another persons product and leaves them open to a defamation action in court.

Fact 4. The Absolute Pace Cobra 427 SC was first thought about 3-4 years ago and progressed slowly at first due to getting the body shape as Craig wanted it and the design of the Chassis on the CAD as good as it is today.

Fact 5. Production ONLY started early in 2013 ( I should know because I was there every couple of weeks.)

Fact 6. The Cobra that you own is the best in the world because you own it. (Unless you have 2 Cobras)

Cheers

Brad

[guye]

Originally Posted by Cobra01

...
Fact 6. The Cobra that you own is the best in the world because you own it. (Unless you have 2 Cobras)...

You would still own the best cobra in the world brad, you'd also happen to have the second best one as well!

[guye]

I was thinking the other day that most local kit manufacturers probably evolved from wanting to build a Cobra themselves, and had the skills, resources and perhaps acquired a body mould or something as the impetus. Having built one they realised the demand and started producing them for others. Maybe variations to this story, but would this be a fair guess? Perhaps warwick or marty or someone can attest to this - I have no actual idea who but I am sure some started this way.

If this is the case, their first car was effectively their 'prototype', even though that was perhaps not intended.

This approach seems to be completely reasonable, and just different to AP's approach. One is more theortical and the other more practical. One uses pure hands-on mechanical skills (brilliant! - I am in awe of this by the way) where the other uses computer aided tech (that I might add was possibly not even readily available when previous kits were designed!).

I do not believe either is inherently superior. Neither is better or worse. Just different.

Like crowd funding or venture capital, there is an inherent risk for early adopters (such as current Pace427 buyers, or early buyers of great kits like FFR for example, or early Harrisons or CRs - all have significantly evolved to what they are now) that what you get may not be 100% as expected and it is up to the individual to make their own assessments as to the level of risk they are prepared to take. I have never seen one single build thread, or heard of one kit build that did not involve some fair degree of fabrication, emissions challenges, re-fabrication, modification or something in order to make an engine fit, exhaust work, body fit, wiring reach, wheels and tyres not rub, etc, etc.

In the end, people do business with people, not companies, so the large part of it is based on the rapport you build with the manufacturer, their agent, or your recommender.

Hence why I encourage you to talk, face to face, with other cobra owners, builders, engineers and manufacturers.

[/soap-box]


Great thread by the way.... ... I do hope it is helping Jasbel!

[Zeus]

Wazza
Anyone who has known about you for long enough knows that it was YOU that imported the Factory Fives in the country first. And you must have hated them so much that you didn't order anymore..... did you.

NO you copied them and called them your own.

A Harrison is nothing but a Badly done copy of an old Factory Five, as is YOUR OWN so called Coupe which is again a poorly done copy of a FFR GEN 1 65 Coupe. You might have made some mod's(very few) but that is a FACT.
Stay retired where your relevant.
As for listing details on who the NSW Engineer is I don't feel it as my position to do so but the statement is a fact and Yes I believe he has reviewed the CAD drawings. If your concerned call the NSW Cobra Club and ask for their recommended Engineer, he's based down near Wollongong.
And wow 488 I'm sure you car is going together well, free loading a ride in the Pace factory where any f/up is fixed in house that's really building a car yourself. Lend his tools too do ya mate.... I'm sure you'll be the first to brag Ï built it myself".
By the way... Factory Five is in its 20th year next year and has made almost 9000 Cobra replica's. No doubt in my mind they will be around when I need them. Time will tell if you can still get parts for your Pace in 20 years time, probably more chance I guess than getting Harrison parts. Oh sorry I forgot you could probably use FFR parts on a Harrison, that's one advantage of it being a copy of the worlds most popular Cobra replica.

[Wazza]

Congratulations Zeus....
I've re read your last post a few times....and for the first time in my LIFE....
I was speechless!!

That's gonna give a few boys out there a smile !

This has GOTTA be a wind up....

Or this is just proof that knowing absolutely F/all about a subject,does not stop someone from having a very strong opinion about it.

It's all yours Zeus....load up and get the other foot.

Sincerely yours,
Warren Warwick Harrison-Boylan-White !!!

[Cobra01]

Hi Zeus

Please read all the previous posts before you reply.

Your last response didn't make any sense to me at all.

Brad

[750hp]

OK, so only minutes ago I told someone offline that I wasn't going to come in with an opinion about what you've said Zeus, because Craig White can respond about your engineer "claim". If he wishes to allay any concerns that you've raised about the suspension, it's his business to do so.

That said, your follow-up post was without doubt the most inaccurate cr@p I've ever read on this forum.

Warren does not equal Warwick.
Harrison did not copy FFR
When you state something is a FACT (in capitals) and it isn't, you look stupid.
"488" gets bagged for stating that he's happy with how things are progressing for him???
Your does not equal you're.

Anyway, what might have lead to a reasonable discussion about your original post has been blown out of the water by the post below. I've quoted it to keep it online for all eternity, because it's too funny to lose if you go back and edit it when you realise how almost every word is inaccurate. Nice work champ!

Originally Posted by Zeus

Wazza
Anyone who has known about you for long enough knows that it was YOU that imported the Factory Fives in the country first. And you must have hated them so much that you didn't order anymore..... did you.

NO you copied them and called them your own.

A Harrison is nothing but a Badly done copy of an old Factory Five, as is YOUR OWN so called Coupe which is again a poorly done copy of a FFR GEN 1 65 Coupe. You might have made some mod's(very few) but that is a FACT.
Stay retired where your relevant.
As for listing details on who the NSW Engineer is I don't feel it as my position to do so but the statement is a fact and Yes I believe he has reviewed the CAD drawings. If your concerned call the NSW Cobra Club and ask for their recommended Engineer, he's based down near Wollongong.
And wow 488 I'm sure you car is going together well, free loading a ride in the Pace factory where any f/up is fixed in house that's really building a car yourself. Lend his tools too do ya mate.... I'm sure you'll be the first to brag Ï built it myself".
By the way... Factory Five is in its 20th year next year and has made almost 9000 Cobra replica's. No doubt in my mind they will be around when I need them. Time will tell if you can still get parts for your Pace in 20 years time, probably more chance I guess than getting Harrison parts. Oh sorry I forgot you could probably use FFR parts on a Harrison, that's one advantage of it being a copy of the worlds most popular Cobra replica.