Cal epa has gone too f&f*$ far.

[kevins2]

When you live in a place that has less than perfect weather, you really appreciate it more when the weather is good. And, if I repeat that enough times, I may actually start believing it myself

[joyridin']

It is really hard to get excited about your car..or most things...when you see tomorrows temperature is going to be a whopping 9 degrees with 35 mph winds and blowing snow.

[Bartruff1]

Well, I live at a ski area in the Cascade Mountains and it is beautiful and I do enjoy it, but I have to admit that California has it all.

From Sac Town in a short days drive you can visit any State in the Union and never leave California.

Now you would have to go to a zoo to see a alligator or a polar bear but you need only go to the beach to see a bubble butt.

Having your orange juice and coffee at the beach at Santa Barbara is not a bad way to start the day.

[Buzz]

No matter where you live, the grass elsewhere will always occasionally appear to be a lil' bit greener. We wouldn't appreciate the ups as much if the occasional downs weren't there to contribute a bit of perspective to the equation.

[lippy]

I've lived in CA for the past 21 years, and I can tell you that there is a reason people are leaving the state (net) for the first time in decades. They tax and regulate the s*** out of you in direct and indirect ways. More and more, the part of the population that foots the bill gets smaller and shoulders a bigger burden. Examples: traffic fines like right on red without a complete stop, enforced by cameras, cost >$500 near me. Many people can't pay it. So it effectively becomes a tax for those who can. Or free sex change operations for muni employees in San Francisco, paid by the tax payers. Or public schools in many areas (like the city of SF) that are so bad they are not an option, so you need to send your kids to expensive private schools...

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by lippy

I've lived in CA for the past 21 years, and I can tell you that there is a reason people are leaving the state (net) for the first time in decades. They tax and regulate the s*** out of you in direct and indirect ways. More and more, the part of the population that foots the bill gets smaller and shoulders a bigger burden. Examples: traffic fines like right on red without a complete stop, enforced by cameras, cost >$500 near me. Many people can't pay it. So it effectively becomes a tax for those who can. Or free sex change operations for muni employees in San Francisco, paid by the tax payers. Or public schools in many areas (like the city of SF) that are so bad they are not an option, so you need to send your kids to expensive private schools...

No disrespect Lippy, but please use facts or at least current facts.

touch.latimes.com/#section/-1/article/p2p-78722976/

A quote from the LA Times:

"California’s population growth again outpaced the national trend, with an increase of 332,643 year to year, or 0.9%."

[PANAVIA]

OK, so I didnt mean this to turn into a bash on CA post as that is not the purpose of this.

when Summit pointed this out to me that the state of California ( unsure of department, I thought they mentioned Cal EPA ) had demanded this stopping of sale of "non C.A.R.B. approved" crate engine packages to CA residents , my first thought was ; under who's authority was this enacted >?

--what citizens were involved in this decision >?
--what notification and proposal for remedy was given >?

Not to mention that its NOT legal that they do this , first its directly a violation of the 14th amendment for free trade between states.

Note ; -- for every SPCNS / kit car that California may have , there are 10,000 pre 1973 cars that would be in the possible pathway for receiving a crate engine to revive their 65 mustang, or 68 corvette , 32 ford or other vehicle.--all of which would run better and cleaner with a fresh mill under the metal.

The answer here is not capitulate and hide like rats , stalking someone at a 7-11 to buy things for you with their Nevada drivers licence, the answer is to unscrew the California governmental agency that did this.

If it is California EPA, god help them-- as they are criminally negligent elsewhere.

More News as it happens.

Steve

[GregAgrest]

Well, here's my two cents worth. I'm born and raised in CA and I'm with those who say we are over regulated. It's always been that way. CA has more laws than any other state. They make it more difficult on auto owners, businesses and the population in general. Emission controls are bad enough, try being a gun owner or buying a gun here!!!! Just a matter of time before they will have us down to shooting rubber bands.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by GregAgrest

Well, here's my two cents worth. I'm born and raised in CA and I'm with those who say we are over regulated. It's always been that way. CA has more laws than any other state. They make it more difficult on auto owners, businesses and the population in general. Emission controls are bad enough, try being a gun owner or buying a gun here!!!! Just a matter of time before they will have us down to shooting rubber bands.

And, with the increased rates of cancer and asthma, thankfully our CA air is cleaner:

Emission cuts lead to cleaner Calif. air - SFGate

Personally, I prefer clean air.

[lippy]

No disrespect taken. The LA Times certainly is credible, but from what I've read, it does appear to be a long-term trend that people are leaving. From the WSJ: "Over the past two decades, a net 3.4 million people have moved out of California for other states."

Here is that article, as well as some others that speak to the demographics:
Allysia Finley: The Reverse-Joads of California - WSJ.com
http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/...40531861056966
Jobs Aren't Leaving California For Texas, But People Are - Forbes
California demographic shift: More people leaving than moving in - Los Angeles Times
http://www.manhattan-institute.org/h...m#.UsooLRas6KM
http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/lo...182914961.html

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by lippy

No disrespect taken. The LA Times certainly is credible, but from what I've read, it does appear to be a long-term trend that people are leaving. From the WSJ: "Over the past two decades, a net 3.4 million people have moved out of California for other states."

Here is that article, as well as some others that speak to the demographics:
Allysia Finley: The Reverse-Joads of California - WSJ.com
The Weekend Interview with Joel Kotkin: The Great California Exodus - WSJ.com
Jobs Aren't Leaving California For Texas, But People Are - Forbes
California demographic shift: More people leaving than moving in - Los Angeles Times
Civic Report 71 | The Great California Exodus: A Closer Look
California's Population Is Moving Out, Census Report Shows | NBC Southern California

Lippy, I can't read it all, but the articles you linked were written 1-3 years ago. The LA Times article I used is from today. Also, we are the most populous state, and remain so even after the recession from 2008-2012. And we grew more than the average state.

If folks who live here think we're taxed too heavy, it's too hard to buy and own guns, the burdens of achieving clean air are too great or violating the traffic laws is too expensive, then move! Florida just passed New York in population, sun, no state taxes. That sounds like a great place to relocate.

Maybe I'm too tired tonight, but I think it's great to be alive and live in a wonderful part of the country and world. Here in CA.

[lippy]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Lippy, I can't read it all, but the articles you linked were written 1-3 years ago. The LA Times article I used is from today. Also, we are the most populous state, and remain so even after the recession from 2008-2012. And we grew more than the average state.

If folks who live here think we're taxed too heavy, it's too hard to buy and own guns, the burdens of achieving clean air are too great or violating the traffic laws is too expensive, then move! Florida just passed New York in population, sun, no state taxes. That sounds like a great place to relocate.

Maybe I'm too tired tonight, but I think it's great to be alive and live in a wonderful part of the country and world. Here in CA.

The article I cited is from March 2013, but that doesn't change the fact (from the census) that, as a trend, over a period of years (not just one), people and businesses have moved from CA for several clear reasons, including high costs and regulation.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by lippy

The article I cited is from March 2013, but that doesn't change the fact (from the census) that, as a trend, over a period of years (not just one), people and businesses have moved from CA for several clear reasons, including high costs and regulation.

You cited six links. The one from 9-10 months ago (which is based research that is even older) states "Over the past two decades, a net 3.4 million people have moved out of California for other states. But contrary to conservative lore, there has been no millionaires' march to Texas or other states with no income tax. In fact, since 2005 California has experienced a net in-migration of households earning more than $200,000, according to the U.S. Census's American Community Survey."

Have you seen a chart of the CA population? It's a direct line upwards exponentially. We're the most populous state. People will come and go all the time. But the fact of the matter is that we continue to grow. From 2010-2012, we grew 2.1%. The USA grew 1.7% in total.

[lippy]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Have you seen a chart of the CA population? It's a direct line upwards exponentially. We're the most populous state. People will come and go all the time. But the fact of the matter is that we continue to grow. From 2010-2012, we grew 2.1%. The USA grew 1.7% in total.

First, CA population is not growing exponentially or anywhere near it. Second, domestic migration has been negative in CA in most years, and in aggregate, for the past two decades. That has been offset by foreign migration (including illegal). But of people that move from state to state, more people are moving out of CA than in. That is according to the US Census, so I count it as a fact. Enough of this, and more about the original point of the thread.

[Bartruff1]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

You cited six links. The one from 9-10 months ago (which is based research that is even older) states "Over the past two decades, a net 3.4 million people have moved out of California for other states. But contrary to conservative lore, there has been no millionaires' march to Texas or other states with no income tax. In fact, since 2005 California has experienced a net in-migration of households earning more than $200,000, according to the U.S. Census's American Community Survey."

Have you seen a chart of the CA population? It's a direct line upwards exponentially. We're the most populous state. People will come and go all the time. But the fact of the matter is that we continue to grow. From 2010-2012, we grew 2.1%. The USA grew 1.7% in total.

California has become a whipping boy for a segment of our society .... you are ruining a good story with your damn facts....

[347stroker]

Gentlemen as you probably know I transport exotics and classics for a living. I have made my last trip to California. Your CARB has determined that I should spend twenty thousand dollars to install a diesel particulate filter in my 1996 Peterbilt and plumb the auxiliary power unit in also. I maintain my equipment well and it has passed every roadside test the state of New Jersey has conceived. Believe me they are tough.
California has no authority to

[Bartruff1]

I believe Rod is absolutely right, not only has the population growing again, it is growing in the most vital sectors with highly skilled and educated workers and people with higher net worth.

That is one of the wonderful things about America ...the States are all different and if you don't want to live in one, you can move to another.

[Bernica]

Originally Posted by 347stroker

Gentlemen as you probably know I transport exotics and classics for a living. I have made my last trip to California. Your CARB has determined that I should spend twenty thousand dollars to install a diesel particulate filter in my 1996 Peterbilt and plumb the auxiliary power unit in also. I maintain my equipment well and it has passed every roadside test the state of New Jersey has conceived. Believe me they are tough.
California has no authority to

Yep, they are going after diesel trucks now too. As I said earlier, they put a big crush on the heavy diesel equipment, including diesel emergency generators that are only 2 years old! That diesel particulate filter can cost thousands.

[347stroker]

Sorry I don't know what happened. As I was saying they have no authority to impose a financial hardship such as the DPF on everyone who wants to truck in California. There are several parts of my anatomy that Moonbeam can kiss. They will realize too late that they have screwed up when the produce is rotting and the backup of goods is out of control. Please don't take this as an anti- California rant because I have great friends there I just can't stand the politicians. Just ask the valley farmers about the delta smelt. That is if you can find any. Panavia I know they have alway been nuts!!

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by 347stroker

Sorry I don't know what happened. As I was saying they have no authority to impose a financial hardship such as the DPF on everyone who wants to truck in California. There are several parts of my anatomy that Moonbeam can kiss. They will realize too late that they have screwed up when the produce is rotting and the backup of goods is out of control. Please don't take this as an anti- California rant because I have great friends there I just can't stand the politicians. Just ask the valley farmers about the delta smelt. That is if you can find any. Panavia I know they have alway been nuts!!

First of all the rules have been relaxed.

"Truckers and construction company officials mostly praised the new rules, which will cost 60% less than the original regulations. "Four of every 10 construction workers in California have lost their jobs," said Michael Kennedy, general counsel of the Associated General Contractors of America. "It is difficult to revisit decisions already made. This is an example of good government."

California eases diesel soot crackdown - Los Angeles Times

"The air board's crackdown on diesel has had strong political support, especially in such neighborhoods as those around the Ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach, where diesel fumes are blamed for high rates of asthma and cancer."

Saving people's lives, especially the financially-disadvantaged that live near these diesel fumes costs money.