FE vs Roush vs Blueprint

[HUBBELL RACING]

You don’t need a ROUSCH for street driving

[incoming]

Patrick, sort of like the foam "diaper" under a Norton Motorcycle

[undy]

Originally Posted by HUBBELL RACING

You don’t need a ROUSCH for street driving

Yep, instead of dripping oil you burn it...

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by patrickt

I fabbed up using New Pig oil-only absorbent material. The material is used for oil spill clean ups and will actually absorb oil directly out of water without absorbing the water itself.

More info posted as per requests:

[Gus M]

Cobra gang,

Some very valuable insight that you share. Couldn’t get any better if I paid for it! Thank you all!

Patrickt, thanks for the sound clip! Question, could you not have stopped your oil leak by a gasket replacement? Can’t any oil leak on a FE be stopped with new gaskets? Why the diaper?

Olddog, interesting that some FE blocks are not drilled for hydraulic! That concerns me, ending the possibility of converting the motor over. I’ll need to call the builder of the motor and see if this block can be converted.

[jelfert]

There are also "modern" FE blocks that are far superior than the original FE and have the updated modifications. I ordered a FE engine for my BDR with a Robert Pond aluminum FE block.

[undy]

Originally Posted by jelfert

There are also "modern" FE blocks that are far superior than the original FE and have the updated modifications. I ordered a FE engine for my BDR with a Robert Pond aluminum FE block.

My Robert Pond aluminum block 482" FE built by Keith Craft still drips after several attempts to fix it. I finally gave up and decided it was just the nature of the beast. As a side benefit, it helps stop under chassis rust from forming (behind the engine)...lol

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by Gus M

Patrickt, thanks for the sound clip! Question, could you not have stopped your oil leak by a gasket replacement? Can’t any oil leak on a FE be stopped with new gaskets? Why the diaper?

When it comes to FEs, one drop would not be deemed an "oil leak." In fact, even 60 years ago the Ford dealer would call that dime sized drip that drops once a week or so as "commercially reasonable." (That's what they did and then they proceeded to do nothing to fix it.) There are a couple of reasons why a solid lifter FE is almost guaranteed to drip: 1) With solid lifters, you have to be able to remove the valve covers, so you can only go so far gluing them down; 2) The configuration of the FE engine is a little unusual because it has the intake manifold come in under the valve covers before it mates up to the head. That leaves four "spots," two on each head, where everything meets up, that is prone to letting oil out. Because of the rotation of the engine, the back of the passenger side head is the most prone; 3) The gaskets, and sealing material, around the intake manifold do not really leak, but they tend to lightly "mist" a bit. If you put fluorescent dye in the oil, and view the engine under a black light, you do not see an obvious leak but rather a gradual glow around the engine itself as oil ever so lightly mists out from a variety of spots; and 4) Regardless of where your FE is leaking, or misting, from the oil will migrate back to the block plate and bell housing area behind the passenger head and starter motor area. It will then drip from there. The old joke is that if you spill a can of oil on your workbench, the oil will still find a way to make it to the FE's bellhousing/block plate and drip from there. Placing the oil diaper along the bottom of the bell housing and block plate absorbs that one drop of oil and I can then pretend that the engine doesn't leak at all. Plus, that nifty fabrication of mine makes it look almost OEM. Had Ford done that back in the 60's they would have avoided a lot of customer come-backs for oil drips.

[twobjshelbys]

Q: How do you tell if a FE is out of oil?
A: It stops leaking.

[1795]

Originally Posted by patrickt

When it comes to FEs, one drop would not be deemed an "oil leak." In fact, even 60 years ago the Ford dealer would call that dime sized drip that drops once a week or so as "commercially reasonable." (That's what they did and then they proceeded to do nothing to fix it.) There are a couple of reasons why a solid lifter FE is almost guaranteed to drip: 1) With solid lifters, you have to be able to remove the valve covers, so you can only go so far gluing them down; 2) The configuration of the FE engine is a little unusual because it has the intake manifold come in under the valve covers before it mates up to the head. That leaves four "spots," two on each head, where everything meets up, that is prone to letting oil out. Because of the rotation of the engine, the back of the passenger side head is the most prone; 3) The gaskets, and sealing material, around the intake manifold do not really leak, but they tend to lightly "mist" a bit. If you put fluorescent dye in the oil, and view the engine under a black light, you do not see an obvious leak but rather a gradual glow around the engine itself as oil ever so lightly mists out from a variety of spots; and 4) Regardless of where your FE is leaking, or misting, from the oil will migrate back to the block plate and bell housing area behind the passenger head and starter motor area. It will then drip from there. The old joke is that if you spill a can of oil on your workbench, the oil will still find a way to make it to the FE's bellhousing/block plate and drip from there. Placing the oil diaper along the bottom of the bell housing and block plate absorbs that one drop of oil and I can then pretend that the engine doesn't leak at all. Plus, that nifty fabrication of mine makes it look almost OEM. Had Ford done that back in the 60's they would have avoided a lot of customer come-backs for oil drips.

Patrick,

I have a friend who races an Alfa and had an oil leak de to a leaky rear mani seal, the technical inspectors told him that he had to fix it before getting back out on the track. His fix was to make a diaper to catch the leak and change the diaper between sessions.

[patrickt]

Here's a front shot of the diaper. You know, I might be able to sell these for $250 a pop to OCD FE owners that make a BFD out of a small drop of oil.

[saki302]

That's fancy..

I have a wadded up piece of paper towel between my oil pan and trans plate that catches the one oil drip- usually.
On a track day the oil just goes everywhere from the cornering G's.

I blame the cobra vanity valve covers the previous owner installed- they look nice, but the baffles up top don't work worth a damn, oil eventually migrates up and out of the PCV/breather gaskets. The flat surface also has giant voids in it- after filling them with silicone, THEN gluing the gaskets to the valve covers, those leaks seemed to stop.

I may try wrapping paper towels around thePCV/breather with tie wraps next time out. Seems OK on the street though.

-Dave

[blykins]

Originally Posted by undy

My Robert Pond aluminum block 482" FE built by Keith Craft still drips after several attempts to fix it. I finally gave up and decided it was just the nature of the beast. As a side benefit, it helps stop under chassis rust from forming (behind the engine)...lol

Hard to get all-aluminum engines not to leak. Aluminum blocks squirm too much when they get hot.

[strictlypersonl]

Originally Posted by 1795

Patrick,

I have a friend who races an Alfa and had an oil leak de to a leaky rear mani seal, the technical inspectors told him that he had to fix it before getting back out on the track. His fix was to make a diaper to catch the leak and change the diaper between sessions.

When we raced an Austin Healey 100-4 back in the '60s and '70s, we did the same thing. The engine didn't even have a rear seal. It had what was described as a labyrinth seal: The back end of the crank was "threaded" to draw oil back into the sump. It didn't work very well.

[undy]

Originally Posted by blykins

Hard to get all-aluminum engines not to leak. Aluminum blocks squirm too much when they get hot.

I guess the OEMs have succeeded in stopping leaks by design changes? I've had quite a few LS/LT engines and nary a drop of oil. Maybe the 6 bolt design holds things together better.

[blykins]

The OEM have stopped leaks by putting millions of dollars into R&D. If you notice, most modern engines don't have gaskets, they have o-ring seals, one-piece rear seals, etc.

Doesn't matter how new the block is, the FE design is 62 years old.

[rodneym]

Maybe someday the Kirkhams will address this. They've fixed everything they've put an o-ring on (oil remote block, expansion tank, water neck, oil pan).
My engine has only one very minor leak, at the driver side of the timing cover where there's a 3 piece joint, it collects on the forward flat face of the block). I fashioned a steel spring mounted to a bolt (like half of a money clip) and it holds a piece of pig mat folded twice, final dimentions about 2"x3". I change this every thousand miles and the pig mat isn't exactly soaked. No other leaks, drips, mist, etc. It's nice coming home after an hour drive, lifing the hood a smelling a bone dry engine (bone dry on the outside, ).