427 side oiler engine build "Blog"

Excaliber · #1 (**permalink**) 03-12-2005, 08:47 PM

I don't have a Web Site page, THIS is my home! Here I will post pics and dialog for my family and friends to follow my engine build.

All pictures from my gallery have been deleted.

The rest of you guys can watch too!

Friday, March 11th, 2005. Two boxes of parts arrive from Gessford Machine, Hastings Nebraska. Thanks to George for working out the specs for my parts "long distance". The custom road race oil pan should ship soon.

My local machine shop choice was Snyder Machine Works in Waipahu, Oahu. It's CRITICAL to have a close relationship with your machinist. I tried several local machine shops before I found Snyders, and could not be happier with their work and helpful tips! Thanks Mark!

Camshaft, lifters, springs, retainers, seats, adjustment shims and stem seals. Crankshaft bearings for connecting rods and main bearing journals, custom Arias pistons, pins and rings, full gasket set, high volume oil pump (VOLUME not pressure), oil pump\distributor drive shaft, and oil pan "stud" bolt set. Double roller timing chain and gears, crank gear adjustable for timing Advance or Retard in 2 Deg increments, and misc "stuff".

First step of a long journey:
I checked the pistons for fit in the cylinder bore, looks good, .0035 specified clearance. BIG money for the pistons and NO return if I measured wrong, WHEW, they fit!

The new ones are 9.75 to 1 compression ratio, down from the original 12.5 to 1. NOW I will be able to run "pump gas" instead of "racing gas".

I began the initial ball park "dry assembly" of the engine to check clearances and valve train geometry. Crank in the block first, then attach "a" rod to "a" piston and insert in block. Looking first for where the piston stops in relation to the top of the block ("piston deck height"). Looks good, I did NOT put any rings on the piston at this point. I installed #1 and #8 pistons.

Camshaft installed, timing gears on that, and lifters in their bore. I then put some modeling clay on the top of the pistons, head gasket and head, bolted down to specs. Some pushrods and the rocker arm shaft assembly per head. Set valve's to .022 clearance. Install the harmonic balancer on the engine crank front and rotate engine by hand for several revolutions. The valves opened and left their "mark" embedded in the clay. This is how I measured "valve to piston" clearance, which looked fine on the tear down. Alas, I discovered the push rods are now to short with the new flat tappet cam. I used to have a "roller" cam and the lifters were slightly taller then. I will have to order new custom push rods, bummer!

Tear down, clean up and put all the parts back in their boxes. Got to have just the right "mood" and "time" to begin final assembly! Large plastic bag to wrap up the motor and keep dust and debris out.

Excaliber · #2 (**permalink**) 03-12-2005, 10:16 PM

Traditional (old school) red for the bell housing "scatter shield" and chrome alternator. Classic "Le Mans" wrinkle finish black and polished valve covers.

Doing something new, not sure how it will work! Following up on the "theme" of black wrinkle finish is the timing chain cover, water pump and water pump pulley. The engine is Ford blue 500 Deg paint and the cylinder heads are blue 1500 Deg paint.

Will have to re-do the water pump pulley for a nicer finish, just experimenting!

Ron61 · #3 (**permalink**) 03-13-2005, 05:07 AM

Ernie,

Everything is looking good. Now that the engine is so nice and clean and pretty, will it go back in the car or onto a pedestal in your living room? It would make a nice conversation piece.

Ron

By the way, what brand are your roller rockers?

55312 · #4 (**permalink**) 03-13-2005, 07:52 AM

Cool thread.....I'll keep a close eye on your progress. As for the wrinkle finish.........looks like an undercoater gone mad but, who remembers undercoating anyway? I would have explored Eastman's for some sort of unique powder coating but to each his own.

Tim

LwCwb · #5 (**permalink**) 03-13-2005, 08:00 AM

Ernie, I will be following this thread. I want to build a 390 for my Senior Project and drop it in a Galaxie or Mustang. Looke good so far, can't wait to see pics of it finished and in your Cobra.

Thanks for posting this.

mr0077 · #6 (**permalink**) 03-13-2005, 08:14 AM

Ernie, great thread, looking good so far, keep the progress report coming!

IMHO, I'd go with the semi-gloss black (or powder coated) for the crank pulley, front cover and header tank. BTW, weren't the original Cobra FE blocks black? After looking at my assy, I painted the scattershield and transmission black too.

Excaliber · #7 (**permalink**) 03-13-2005, 09:39 AM

When I got the car EVERTHING under the hood was black, possibly correct, but kind of boring! I think the color will liven things up. Pictures just don't bring out the "look" of the wrinkle finish, it is not at all like an "under coating" appearance.

What year did Ford switch from Black to Blue for engines? 65-66?

Note the deeper "skirt" on the original "pop-up" high compression piston. The new one has a "dished" top end to reduce the compression ratio.

I use "plasti gauge" to double check clearances after measuring. You can't be "to sure" and lot's of professional engine builders also use it in the final assembly steps.

FFR428 · #8 (**permalink**) 03-17-2005, 04:38 PM

Ernie, Ford went to the dark blue on the engine paint in 66-68. 69 and later used a medium blue I think. Thanks for the great pics and please keep us posted with more as things progress. I like the wrinkle paint and gives things a different look. Mighty fine. G.

Bill Kesner · #9 (**permalink**) 03-17-2005, 08:59 PM

Ernie........

I'm curious as to why you checked piston to valve clearance, when your old pistons were a higher compression and worked?
Did you change heads, or modify your block in any way?

- Bill -

Excaliber · #10 (**permalink**) 03-17-2005, 11:44 PM

Thanks for the year of the color up-date FFR.

Good question Bill, heres why.

By the way, in explaining how/what/why I'm doing this rebuild I'm trying to walk the line between being "to technical" and "to simple". My 15 year old is one of those people following this adventure!

The old camshaft was a solid roller lifter cam with BIG duration but the "lift" is pretty much the same as my new cam (flat tappet) will be. The OLD pistons were .030 below the surface of the block, the new ones are right at being even (zero deck height). The pop-up portion of the old piston was not really a factor in valve clearance because of the "fly cut" valve clearance area similiar to the new pistons.

So whats REALLY changed is the new pistons have moved UP in the bore by .030. That reason alone would be enough to worry about valve clearance, but theres more!

Cam's are not always exactly what the manufacturer say they are. Thats ONE good reason to "degree" your new cam, just to make sure it IS all that the cam man said it was. You could "assume" the new cam is OK and you would be right 95% of the time, no worries! But "what if" it isn't? Are you willing to risk your HIGH DOLLAR side oiler? I'm not! I WILL degree my cam and I WILL check the valve clearance.

Now let's say you want to "advance" or "retard" the cam (via some kind of adjustable gear). This dramatically alters the relationship of "piston and valve" timing events. A cam installed "straight up" will clear, but advanced (or retard) and it might cause the valve to kiss the piston!

A two step process then. "Degree" the cam to make SURE of advance\retard\straightup AND check valve clearance in those positions. That way, if you want to change cam gearing later, you KNOW it will be OK (or not)!

My Comp Cam is all ready "factory set" for 4 degrees "advance" even when I install it "straight up". Thats just the way THIS cam is designed, I'll verify that with a degree wheel later in the build.

Advancing the cam increases lower rpm response while sacraficing some high rpm performance. I'm doing a "street" motor where that low end grunt takes your breath away!

Excaliber · #11 (**permalink**) 03-17-2005, 11:57 PM

In the above post I noted the old pistons were .030 below the deck. Oddly enough this WAS the correct spec "back in the day". But back then they either didn't care about "squish" and "quench" or didn't need to because 100 octane gas was readily available. Drop the piston and your ASSURED of plenty of valve clearance with even RADICAL valve lift.

...move ahead 40 years. 100 octane gas is hard to find! Combustion research has progessed big time! We NOW know that "squish" is a good thing. Note the flat area of the piston and how that part "matches" up with the flat part of the heads combustion chamber. When those two "flat" surfaces meet the compressed gases trapped between them are "squished". If the piston is to far below the deck (.030 plus head gasket thickness) there isn't nearly as much "squish" going on. So move the piston to "zero" and squish the heck out of it!

Those "squished" gases get accellerated out into the combustion chamber at very high velocity. This creates a kind of "swirl" effect or at least get the fuel/air mixture really excited! Thus, promoting better over all combustion. "Quench" is the cooling effect that occurs and this helps to control the "burn" across the face of the piston.

I'm NOT an "expert" at this "science" and may not have it exactly right, but thats basically whats happening.

Your gonna love the next installement. The pistons are going in WITHOUT being "soaked", "dipped" or "coated" with engine oil!! In fact I'm not even wiping down the cylinder bores with engine oil before putting them in the bore! SAY WHAT? Am I CRAZY???

Stay tuned........

Bill Kesner · #12 (**permalink**) 03-18-2005, 02:18 AM

Ernie......

I'll take your word on the piston theory. Are you going to CC the head and block, so you get your actual compression ratio? That should intrigue your 15 year old!

BTW.....Excellent idea showing some of the members a step by step build.

- Bill -

chuckbrandt · #13 (**permalink**) 03-18-2005, 05:50 AM

Hey Ernie,
Great thread, I'll be watching.

If you still have a piston out, can you take a shot of the new and old piston with a pin stuck through one side of each. I'd like to see how much the pin height has changed between the two. The one shot above looks like you lined them up by the rings so you really can't tell.

Thanks, I'll shut up now

Chuck

Excaliber · #14 (**permalink**) 03-18-2005, 09:04 AM

Head CC was 72-74 which is standard size for a 1964 high rise head. With the zero deck and MINUS 17cc dish on the piston the new C.R. is 9.8

Even looking at the pin's in "real life" you can't really "see" the difference. It seems to be a combination of piston top height as well as pin height. All the numbers went to Arias and "somehow" they got it right!

Excaliber · #15 (**permalink**) 03-19-2005, 05:18 PM

I've had the engine together and apart a couple of times now! Checking various clearances, etc. ALWAYS a good idea to assemble and rotate by hand before the final.

The Comp Cam spec is 106 degree centerline, sure enough the degree wheel confirmed it. I used an adjustable pushrod to determine the new length required due to "short" lifters.

Also checking for valve spring coil bind and clearance of the valve stem seal to the valve retainer.

Barry_R · #16 (**permalink**) 03-23-2005, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Excaliber

Your gonna love the next installement. The pistons are going in WITHOUT being "soaked", "dipped" or "coated" with engine oil!! In fact I'm not even wiping down the cylinder bores with engine oil before putting them in the bore! SAY WHAT? Am I CRAZY???

Stay tuned........

As somebody that gets to see a LOT of damaged pistons and piston rings - the answer to this is - unfortunately - yes. I manage the Speed-Pro line for Federal-Mogul. We sell a couple sets of rings.

Please don't assemble your pistons and rings dry, or with some kind of magic elixer or powder. They will be lubricated with OIL for their entire life in the engine. Lubricate them with OIL upon assembly. The oil will not dry up, clog up, gum up, turn to deposits, or any such thing.

At least 2/3 of the damaged parts we see here are caused by either dirt or lack of lubrication on initial startup. Keep things laboratory clean and use lubricant on everything that is supposed to be lubricated - - and you'll eliminate a whole host of woes. It's your money and your labor - why take the risk?

55312 · #17 (**permalink**) 03-23-2005, 10:49 AM

Busted ! Like Michael Jackson at a daycare center......

Ernie - Tell us your reasoning.

Excaliber · #18 (**permalink**) 03-23-2005, 03:52 PM

I'll have to post the pictures later during the install, but the "heat" is on NOW so here it is:

I've ALWAYS done my engine assemblies with engine oil coating the cylinder walls, pistons, rings etc. But after consulting on the matter with some proffesional engine builders, I like their advice!

Marvel Mystery Oil. Yup, and a light coating at that! Swab the cylinder wall, wipe down the piston and rings and put it in the hole! I actually did a couple all ready for a "test run". I LIKE IT a LOT! The engine turns over really easy with far less "drag" than I expected.

The concept is the Mystery Oil (and more than one proffessional builder even uses 2 cycle oil in a pinch) provides that initial protection better than engine oil. BOTH are "scrapped" away with the first stroke of the piston but the Mystery Oil leaves behind a more durable surface coating. Some have even suggested using to much engine oil during installation can PROMOTE "galling" of the piston\cylinder area.

...not to mention how much cleaner the install is! I was getting ready to take a "bath" in engine oil! Call me crazy, but I'm going with the Marvelous Mystery Man. The oil my Daddy always swore by, I guess I just didn't "get it" when I was young man!

30 wt oil will fill the crankcase for the initial "fire it up" run! Pre-primed oil and fuel and I expect it to "fire" within just a few cranks of the starter!

Excaliber · #19 (**permalink**) 03-23-2005, 04:18 PM

The good with the bad news!

Can you tell the good ring from the bad one? One was chipped right on the end during a recent "test" install. Hey, stuff happens. Gessford is sending me another, thanks George!

Bruce Edwards · #20 (**permalink**) 03-23-2005, 04:54 PM

As an engine builder who after 30 years has never had to warranty and engine, stick with engine oil on the rings, pistons and walls. It does not get scraped off as the rings move any more than it would if the engine was running. Remember that the pistons and walls get lube by splash from the rod spacing. The mist of oil finds it's way into and out of those little slots between the oil rings as well as splash on the walls as the piston moves up and down the cylinder.
If you plan on running the engine with 30 then lube it with 30. The only place I use any extreme style lube is on the cam and lifters and in some cases the rockers. Everything else gets engine oil. All engines I build are primed and rotated before firing for the first time to be sure every bearing gets a full load of oil.
No "magic" lubes in my engines. K.I.S.S. still holds for me.
By the way you can not put to much on the rings and pistons. Think about it. As you turn the engine over to install the other pistons you are removing any extra oil with every turn. If you are like me by the time you are done putting it together and setting the lash you will have turned the engine over many times with out any load on the bearings or pistons and rings. As such it will only take off any extra and leave a nice coating of lube to start it up for the first time.



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