seeking advice on shifter upgrade

[Got the Bug]

Originally Posted by blown871

.. so i m confused..
will updating the shifter not help the tranny?

The Tri-Ax will help reduce mis-shifts from 2nd to 3rd. I didn't like the transmission at all when I first got the car. it seemed quirky and hard to shift. After years of driving the car, the shifts seem effortless.

[SPF1061]

I have had a TKO 500 and 2 TKO 600 .82s in my 427R SPF. My experience is that a shifter will not fix a TKO. I am using a Pro5 with a Jordan arm and I think it is as good as it's going to get...which isn't great. The 2/3 shift at 6000+ rpm is not reliable in my car. I have just bought a new, modified 600 from these folks: WELCOME TO LIBERTYS HIGH PERFORMANCE. The car is in Dennis Olthoff's shop for some major work and will have the new transmission installed when I get it back in about a month. I will post my impressions after I have put a few miles on it. I am guardedly hopeful.

[RET_COP]

I have the Tri-Ax and really like the strong 2nd 3rd lockout. The stops are well constructed.
I have the 3550 Tremec and don't miss any shifts. I will say it's harder to hit the power shift with the wheels spinning. I have heard (and read it on this and other forums), the Tremec likes the GM syncromesh fluid and it helps with the shifts.

[eschaider]

Originally Posted by SPF1061

I have had a TKO 500 and 2 TKO 600 .82s in my 427R SPF. My experience is that a shifter will not fix a TKO. I am using a Pro5 with a Jordan arm and I think it is as good as it's going to get...which isn't great. The 2/3 shift at 6000+ rpm is not reliable in my car. I have just bought a new, modified 600 from these folks: WELCOME TO LIBERTYS HIGH PERFORMANCE. The car is in Dennis Olthoff's shop for some major work and will have the new transmission installed when I get it back in about a month. I will post my impressions after I have put a few miles on it. I am guardedly hopeful.

My prediction is that you are going to be very happy with the Liberty version of your TKO 600. If you did the upgrade and removed the old pieces, compared them to the Liberty replacements and how they worked / were timed, you would have no doubt in your mind about where the problem lies.

This is a Tremec issue yet again and right on par with their third gear mainshaft / countershaft misalignment that precipitates the premature third gear failures. Good shifters can mask the 2 - 3 shifting problem somewhat but they can not correct the bad internal design of the shifter rails. Liberty's upgrade does!

Ed

[SPF1061]

Originally Posted by SPF1061

I have had a TKO 500 and 2 TKO 600 .82s in my 427R SPF. My experience is that a shifter will not fix a TKO. I am using a Pro5 with a Jordan arm and I think it is as good as it's going to get...which isn't great. The 2/3 shift at 6000+ rpm is not reliable in my car. I have just bought a new, modified 600 from these folks: WELCOME TO LIBERTYS HIGH PERFORMANCE. The car is in Dennis Olthoff's shop for some major work and will have the new transmission installed when I get it back in about a month. I will post my impressions after I have put a few miles on it. I am guardedly hopeful.

Well my car was in the shop a lot longer than expected sorting out a Roush 427R rebuild that would not stop drinking oil. All good now. Regards the Liberty High Performance Mod on the TKO 600. YES! This is the best shifting TKO I have ever put through the gears. Excellent. Dennis test drove the car and he commented that it felt like the shifter was being sucked into the next gear. Highly recommended.

[Jim Norris]

Originally Posted by SPF1061

Well my car was in the shop a lot longer than expected sorting out a Roush 427R rebuild that would not stop drinking oil. All good now. Regards the Liberty High Performance Mod on the TKO 600. YES! This is the best shifting TKO I have ever put through the gears. Excellent. Dennis test drove the car and he commented that it felt like the shifter was being sucked into the next gear. Highly recommended.

Sweet! I am almost ready to order a modified TKO 600 w/.82 OD from Libertys. I now have the .64 OD and not only is the 3rd to 4th shift at 6000 rpm impossible to accomplish, the rpm drop from 4th to 5th is staggering. Hopefully both of my problems will go away all at once.
My questions are: do you think the addition of a Pro 5.0 or Steeda shifter is necessary after the Libertys upgrade? They offer an upgraded TKO version that includes a Pro 5.0 for $150 bucks more. Also, have you ever regretted going with .82 od version of the TKO?

[SPF1061]

Originally Posted by Jim Norris

Sweet! I am almost ready to order a modified TKO 600 w/.82 OD from Libertys. I now have the .64 OD and not only is the 3rd to 4th shift at 6000 rpm impossible to accomplish, the rpm drop from 4th to 5th is staggering. Hopefully both of my problems will go away all at once.
My questions are: do you think the addition of a Pro 5.0 or Steeda shifter is necessary after the Libertys upgrade? They offer an upgraded TKO version that includes a Pro 5.0 for $150 bucks more. Also, have you ever regretted going with .82 od version of the TKO?

Jim, I have the Pro 5.0 and it is an improvement over the stock TKO shifter. I would spend the extra $150. and get the whole package. What is your rear end ratio? I originally ran .64 with a 3.73 rear. The final drive ratio in that combination was good for highway cruising, but that was about all that was good about it. First gear was useless and the rpm drop between 4/5 took the engine way out of it's power band. I switched to a 3:27 rear gear at the same time I went to the .82 and I love this combo. Highway cruising rpm are not quite as mild as before, but it's fine, about 2600rpm at 70mph with 295/60/15 rear tires. Everything else about this combo is way better than before.

[Jim Norris]

Originally Posted by SPF1061

Jim, I have the Pro 5.0 and it is an improvement over the stock TKO shifter. I would spend the extra $150. and get the whole package. What is your rear end ratio? I originally ran .64 with a 3.73 rear. The final drive ratio in that combination was good for highway cruising, but that was about all that was good about it. First gear was useless and the rpm drop between 4/5 took the engine way out of it's power band. I switched to a 3:27 rear gear at the same time I went to the .82 and I love this combo. Highway cruising rpm are not quite as mild as before, but it's fine, about 2600rpm at 70mph with 295/60/15 rear tires. Everything else about this combo is way better than before.

My rear end ratio is 3.73 also, and my rear tires are 295/50/15. I agree that first gear is useless when you stomp on it; it just sends the tires up in smoke even after you're rolling. The acceleration in 2nd and 3d though, is phenomenal. l am worried about losing that if I change to a numerically lower rear gear.
I think you're right about having the Pro 5.0 included in the deal. It makes good sense.
Thanks for your help.

[SPF1061]

Originally Posted by Jim Norris

My rear end ratio is 3.73 also, and my rear tires are 295/50/15. I agree that first gear is useless when you stomp on it; it just sends the tires up in smoke even after you're rolling. The acceleration in 2nd and 3d though, is phenomenal. l am worried about losing that if I change to a numerically lower rear gear.
I think you're right about having the Pro 5.0 included in the deal. It makes good sense.
Thanks for your help.

Jim - Are you running a 427 stroker like it says in your sig line? If so, you do not need to worry about your car not pulling in 2nd and 3rd with a 3:27 rear gear. Have you ever had your car at the drag strip and gotten some time slips with your present gearing set up? I can pretty much guarantee you that your et will improve getting rid of that useless 1st gear. My car will run about 50mph in first and it will get there quick. The freight train keeps pushing hard right through all the gears. I consistently run 11:30s/125mph with Avons or Mickey Thompson drag radials on the rear. I'm not half way through 4th gear when I go through the traps. Also, 5th gear becomes a REAL gear on long straightaways on road courses. No bogging. It's very much like the 3>4 shift except that wind resistance is becoming such a factor in 5th that it is really affecting the engines ability to accelerate the car hard.

[eschaider]

Originally Posted by SPF1061

Well my car was in the shop a lot longer than expected sorting out a Roush 427R rebuild that would not stop drinking oil. All good now. Regards the Liberty High Performance Mod on the TKO 600. YES! This is the best shifting TKO I have ever put through the gears. Excellent. Dennis test drove the car and he commented that it felt like the shifter was being sucked into the next gear. Highly recommended.

Guys, you are just kidding yourself if you think throwing money at a shifter is going to fix this problem. This is yet another Tremec design screw up that needs hard parts internal to the transmission to correct it.

The fix is not expensive. The results are stunning as SPF1061 has already told you. Liberty took a lot of effort to diagnose and redesign the problem Tremec pieces. If you want to fix the problem buy the parts and put them in. If you are concerned about the complexity have Liberty do it for you.

If you want to continue to post threads asking what shifter to buy this week, skip Liberty's fix and buy a shifter - you'll be happier. Even better you can start another thread about which shifter to get next to solve the 2nd to 3rd shift problem after you install your new shifter.


Ed