Continuation of Thread: Drag race - Kirkham 65 side-oiler vs Ferrari 458 Italia - Page 7

blitzforce · #1 (**permalink**) 02-22-2011, 07:57 PM

Ok so after I was kind enough to change the date w/o a penalty to Tom and was allowing him to **** me on my tires after we specifically agreed i got slicks, he is now trying to cheat and have ferrari Wynn "tune" his car for race gas and change his shift points so he can rev higher. When we made the bet he agreed to have his car "bone stock" and as he bought it with nothing at all done to it. We have set the race date for March 9th and I already paid for the track, sadly for me the track is closed until the 8th, and I am gonna have to wait to see if my clutch is completely toast and how long it will take to replace it with the exact same one if it is unusable. I'll keep you posted as Tom continues to try and be a weasel.

Dimis · #2 (**permalink**) 02-22-2011, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blitzforce

I'll keep you posted as Tom continues to try and be a weasel.

Them's sounds like fight'in words!!!

Come on Tommy - take the bait, dam it...!

I have a heap more pop corn to get thru.

Ahhh, I'm loving this thread.

dcdoug · #3 (**permalink**) 02-22-2011, 08:19 PM

Blitz - I'm sure we could throw out some similar suggestions to help even things up if you'd like.

CobraDan · #4 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 03:38 AM

Blitzforce,

tommygold · #5 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 05:31 AM

Blitz is so funny late at night when he is, um, medicated. He gets his car tuned to race and screams (literally) when I go to have my car tuned. I can't change the car, so doing something that would make it more capable of taking race gas would be out of bounds. It takes 103 octane out of the box, and the hilarious thing is that Blitz knows it. I don't know what would make him think I was doing something to change its fuel capability other than those crazy chemicals, combined with the fact that each time something goes bad at the track he gets hyper-paranoid. If he's getting his car tuned, so am I; that's all. Blitz is also working hard to figure out whento shift. So I want to tell my car to shift at its max revs (9150) rather than redline (9000) but this is somehow a foul? Mods, are we sure we can't do another poll, because I wanted everyone to vote on whether his screenname should be blitzfarce or blusterf@ck. HeHe.

CobraDan · #6 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 07:02 AM

Novitec Rosso has wielded some magic with the Ferrari 458 Italia, a reprogrammed ECU with newly calibrated mapping for ignition and injection. The tuners raise output of the two-seat berlinetta to 609 hp--up noticeably from 570 hp in conventional configuration. Top speed is raised from 202 mph to 205 mph.

tommygold · #7 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 07:11 AM

CD -- Yeah all that kind of stuff is off limits. There are a variety of software upgrades that would let me humiliate Blitz rather than merely embarrass him badly. And my Ferrari guys wanted to take stuff out of the car to reduce the weight. I'm sure we could put in better spark plugs, etc. All of that is a physical (or near physical, in the case of the ECU software) change to the car; none of that is allowed. I do think there is at least a 25% chance that we'll find out that Blitz's shop did change his car by putting in better carburetors or something and he's just going to forfeit; my investigative team is working on that. -Tom

somedayaurora · #8 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 08:46 AM

To be clear , if a drag racer was driving on slicks , he would eat the ferrari for lunch correct ?
SDR

Don · #9 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 08:54 AM

Tom......are you controlling the shift points or full automatic ?

" I've mentioned several things that I believe will get me .3 to .4 in improvement. No doubt, Dan can do better as get gets more comfortable. We'll see! "

tommygold · #10 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 09:05 AM

SDR - It's not at all clear to me that the Cobra would win if we were both on full drag slicks. I'd improve a lot too. My 60' time (1.91) was really no better than his (2.01). I'm crossing the 1/4 line at 11.22, despite the fact that my trap speed is 132.5; I should be in the 10s with that. If I can get better traction (particularly with launch control) I could be well down into the 10s. The drag slicks are almost less about speed for Dan and more about the fact that he has booked a race in tires in which he has a 50/50 shot (at least) of putting his car into the wall at 110 mph. For those of you coming to LV, I have one piece of advice -- stand far back during Dan's runs; consider Reno.

Don - I intend to run full auto. I found out that my car can run launch control with full auto. That one pretty much caused Dan to have a stroke. He insists that I run the car as it came from the factory, except for the things that the car does (launch control, ability to run race fuel) that he doesn't like.

TerrysSPF · #11 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 09:36 AM

Tom- I'm not sure you would improve all that much with slicks. Your cars launch control is already keeping the tires from spinning too much, where Dan doesn't have that luxury. The Cobra would improve FAR MORE with slicks than your car would, IMHO.

I still say Dan is screwed unless he gets to change his rear tires.

Dan- Why replace the clutch with the same one that just fried? Is that all Tom will allow? I'd replace it with a better / stronger one and launch in 2nd gear. A better clutch will be better for you and your car's lifespan anyway, regardless of the race.

tommygold · #12 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 09:51 AM

SPF - You may be right about Dan benefitting way more, but I don't think so. My car apparently can do 0-60mph in 2.8 seconds on slicks, versus 3.4 on street tires. He'd have to pick up an awful lot. I'm still getting a fair amount of wheel spin with launch control and street tires, albeit in the cold. In any event, it's an academic discussion -- Dan specifically asked for the .2 second bump to keep his tires, and I accepted; so it's settled.

And as to the clutch, yes -- we've said throughout that the equipment stays the same; no upgrades to the cars.

tommygold · #13 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 10:11 AM

RK - I'm sure you're right. To be clear: I haven't actually thought for a second that Dan would cheat; he (like me) couldn't possibly be more honest about this stuff. He has a complex that others are out to get him (which I really like to encourage, as you can see, because it's like poking a bear with a stick from 2000 miles away), but he's not out to get others (in this way). Neither of us places the value of the $ in this bet anywhere near the value of our character as people who do what we say we're going to. We just give each other a super-duper hard time.

tommygold · #14 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 10:25 AM

Is anyone able to descipher this graph of a 458's acceleration? Many thanks.

http://www.bimmerboost.com/images/im...box60130-1.jpg

UPDATE: I think it's graphing how long it takes the Ferrari to go from 60-130 -- 7.74 seconds.

Excaliber · #15 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 10:33 AM

An upgrade to the clutch will not provide an improvement of ET or launch over the existing clutch when it was new.

The reason "we" (Cobra owners) upgrade our clutches when needed is to make them last longer. When they are new, a decent clutch vs a racing clutch doesn't offer any advantage. When they get a few thousand miles on them, THATS when you see the advantage. One still works, while the other starts going away.

As for drag slicks on the Blitz car, it would help drop the ET, but by no means would gaurentee a victory. I suspect Blitz is running road race hand grooved slicks, which is exactly what I run. They are really good, on the ROAD RACE track, they aint "all that" on a drag strip. They have a very hard sidewall and the traction improves dramatically when the tires are heated. A simple burn out will not be enough to bring them up to temp.

Blitz, get some tire heating jackets to keep the tires warm. DON'T drop the tire pressure to much, those tires perform well with adequate pressure and when hot.

blitzforce · #16 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 10:34 AM

Look I have been as fair as humanly possible with this bet, but the bottom line is we agreed and I have the texts to back it up that his car has to be "completely stock" and "bone stock like it comes off the showroom" are the exact texts. What Tommy doesn't realize is I didn't tune my car for racing, it wasn't even dynoed after they rebuilt the exact same carbs b/c they were leaking. I already explained to Tom that the "tuning" they did on my car is what all the computers in his fuel injected car do already. They did my alignment and balancing of my tires, they changed all fluids, and tightened up all nuts and bolts, replaced the engine dampner with the exact same one, and I have the reciept. They took 4 days just to do my alignment and have in no way shape or form been trying to go the extra mile for this race, a cat was ****ting in the parking lot the other day and I think that was of more interest than them working on my car. Bottom line is his altering the shift points in his computer is 1000% altering the car and it's current computer settings and might even void the warranty.

tommygold · #17 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blitzforce

Look I have been as fair as humanly possible with this bet, but the bottom line is we agreed and I have the texts to back it up that his car has to be "completely stock" and "bone stock like it comes off the showroom" are the exact texts. What Tommy doesn't realize is I didn't tune my car for racing, it wasn't even dynoed after they rebuilt the exact same carbs b/c they were leaking. I already explained to Tom that the "tuning" they did on my car is what all the computers in his fuel injected car do already. They did my alignment and balancing of my tires, they changed all fluids, and tightened up all nuts and bolts, replaced the engine dampner with the exact same one, and I have the reciept. They took 4 days just to do my alignment and have in no way shape or form been trying to go the extra mile for this race, a cat was ****ting in the parking lot the other day and I think that was of more interest than them working on my car. Bottom line is his altering the shift points in his computer is 1000% altering the car and it's current computer settings and might even void the warranty.

Seeing every one of these paranoid posts from Blitz brightens my day so, so much.

RodKnock · #18 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 11:38 AM

We've only talked about the cars so far.

I was going to suggest to Dan that he could lose 10-20 lbs between now and the race to lighten the load, so to speak, but maybe he should gain some weight for more traction.

Dan could always go "Tonya Harding" on Tom before the race. But don't go for the legs, go for the fingers.

otomix · #19 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blitzforce

Look I have been as fair as humanly possible with this bet, but the bottom line is we agreed and I have the texts to back it up that his car has to be "completely stock" and "bone stock like it comes off the showroom" are the exact texts. What Tommy doesn't realize is I didn't tune my car for racing, it wasn't even dynoed after they rebuilt the exact same carbs b/c they were leaking. I already explained to Tom that the "tuning" they did on my car is what all the computers in his fuel injected car do already. They did my alignment and balancing of my tires, they changed all fluids, and tightened up all nuts and bolts, replaced the engine dampner with the exact same one, and I have the reciept. They took 4 days just to do my alignment and have in no way shape or form been trying to go the extra mile for this race, a cat was ****ting in the parking lot the other day and I think that was of more interest than them working on my car. Bottom line is his altering the shift points in his computer is 1000% altering the car and it's current computer settings and might even void the warranty.

I am aware of the Original Bet between tommy and dan, if tommy alters the Ferrari in Any way from stock - showroom cond, he has crossed the line and forfeited the Bet ..period. Dan has not altered the Cobra in any way, other than fixing the leaking carbs he informed me of, or repairing - tuning any part on the Cobra not in hi performance working order - worn clutch, agreed to tires, alignment, dampner etc..

tommygold · #20 (**permalink**) 02-23-2011, 03:34 PM

Otomix - thanks, but as a person who wasn't involved in any way in the discussions (and also who believes strongly in Dan's car) you're in a really poor position to say things like you know that if I do a certain thing I "forfeit" the bet, "period". Dan and I are completely capable of laying out the terms of the bet. -Tom