bronze gears - Page 4

spdbrake · #1 (**permalink**) 08-04-2019, 06:58 AM

Wolf,

I did have a time aligning the gear on the shaft. Depth was not an issue. Clocking was though.
Took me 3 tries to get it right.
I also should add I heated the Gear up on a hot plate. Becomes close to a slip fit.
On what was the input side on the the center shaft (where the roll pin would enter 1st) I lightly chamfered the hole with a suicide countersink.
Gear positioning when done was perfect.

hauss · #2 (**permalink**) 08-05-2019, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolf k

I brought this up earlier, and it is the practical fact that you can only replace the gear once. This is because you have to drill a new roll pin hole when installing a new gear. Like Brent said, it is nearly impossible to line up the hole in the the new gear with the existing hole in the shaft. Even if you could, that does not guarantee that the gear positioning will be correct.

Get it close as you can then ,retime with light. Really not that big of deal provided,you have a timing light and remember your original settings.

hauss · #3 (**permalink**) 08-05-2019, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hauss

Get it close as you can then ,retime with light. Really not that big of deal provided,you have a timing light and remember your original settings.

No new holes on my msd not sure what you are using just new roll pin. change gear as many times as you want.

hauss · #4 (**permalink**) 08-05-2019, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hauss

Get it close as you can then ,retime with light. Really not that big of deal provided,you have a timing light and remember your original settings.

No new holes on my msd not sure what you are using just new roll pin. change gear as many times as you want.

wolf k · #5 (**permalink**) 08-04-2019, 07:25 AM

After I wrote that, I wondered about what if you heat the gear prior to installing. You would have to act fast with the installation and have an alignment drift ready. Also, you would have to use the same gear from the same manufacturer to ensure the hole in the gear is located in the same exact place as the hole in the old gear.
As we know, distributor gear depth is critical on Fords. I recently diagnosed a customer's ignition issue due to worn distributor gear. Gear had been replaced prior and not installed deep enough on the shaft by .050". Well sure enough, his bearing pad in the block was ground down by the same amount. Metal shavings throughout engine, although his gear was iron.

69boss429 · #6 (**permalink**) 08-04-2019, 07:50 AM

Comp Cams did say to use a bronze gear with my camshaft. It is in a Boss 429 block and we drilled a tiny hole in one of the oil galley plugs then indexed it to squirt directly onto the dist and cam gear.
I still check on it though.

blykins · #7 (**permalink**) 08-04-2019, 11:18 AM

They are going to tell you to use bronze because they only sell bronze and polymer gears.

Don’t get me wrong, I love their products and they grind 100% of my cams but this advice is not correct, at least not on Ford products.

hauss · #8 (**permalink**) 08-04-2019, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolf k

After I wrote that, I wondered about what if you heat the gear prior to installing. You would have to act fast with the installation and have an alignment drift ready. Also, you would have to use the same gear from the same manufacturer to ensure the hole in the gear is located in the same exact place as the hole in the old gear.
As we know, distributor gear depth is critical on Fords. I recently diagnosed a customer's ignition issue due to worn distributor gear. Gear had been replaced prior and not installed deep enough on the shaft by .050". Well sure enough, his bearing pad in the block was ground down by the same amount. Metal shavings throughout engine, although his gear was iron.

Did you apply white grease or gear paint and check the pattern?

wolf k · #9 (**permalink**) 08-04-2019, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hauss

Did you apply white grease or gear paint and check the pattern?

No, since my diagnoses came after the damage was done. All I could do was install a new gear in the correct location and recommend his block be repaired.

On a Ford, it is the bearing pad in the block that locates the distributor gear for correct mesh. But you have to install the gear on the distributor to the correct tolerances given by Ford, so that the gear actually contacts the pad in the block.

If you set the gear too deep on the distributor shaft, then the downward thrust of the gear is absorbed by the small bearing in the distributor. This will shorten life of distributor. Also gear mesh will not be correct.

If you set the gear too shallow on the distributor shaft, then when the distributor housing is tighten via the clamp, this will jam the gear hard into the pad in the block and severe wear will result in short order.

hauss · #10 (**permalink**) 08-04-2019, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolf k

No, since my diagnoses came after the damage was done. All I could do was install a new gear in the correct location and recommend his block be repaired.

On a Ford, it is the bearing pad in the block that locates the distributor gear for correct mesh. But you have to install the gear on the distributor to the correct tolerances given by Ford, so that the gear actually contacts the pad in the block.

If you set the gear too deep on the distributor shaft, then the downward thrust of the gear is absorbed by the small bearing in the distributor. This will shorten life of distributor. Also gear mesh will not be correct.

If you set the gear too shallow on the distributor shaft, then when the distributor housing is tighten via the clamp, this will jam the gear hard into the pad in the block and severe wear will result in short order.

On a msd dizzy, you can adjust the collar, that sits on top of block and set to recommendations. Then check the pattern that is what I was talking about.

Gaz64 · #11 (**permalink**) 08-04-2019, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hauss

On a msd dizzy, you can adjust the collar, that sits on top of block and set to recommendations. Then check the pattern that is what I was talking about.

That is the beauty of an adjustable collar, if you have one.

And mesh pattern checking is a good habit to be in, not many would do this.

Gary

blykins · #12 (**permalink**) 08-05-2019, 02:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hauss

On a msd dizzy, you can adjust the collar, that sits on top of block and set to recommendations. Then check the pattern that is what I was talking about.

Adjustable collars are only for GM distributors.

wolf k · #13 (**permalink**) 08-05-2019, 06:52 AM

^ Yes, in a GM, the axial thrust from the distributor gear is upward, the bottom of the distributor housing absorbs the gear thrust. Therefore, in a GM it is the depth of the distributor into the block that creates the correct gear mesh. Because GM distributors sit on top of the intake manifold, an adjustable collar is a good idea to compensate for decking of the block, milling of the heads, etc.

In our Fords, the distributor height is not effected by any block decking or cylinder head milling.

jacobsed · #14 (**permalink**) 08-06-2019, 04:20 AM

I had the same issue back in 2016. -9 billet steel core comp cam solid roller with an MSD distributor and bronze gear. Running a 460BB. My car just randomly quit running and I found the bronze gear wore away. I called Comp Cams and they told me to use a bronze gear but it would only be good for about 2500 miles as a wear part. Blykins told me to install a crane 5971 coated steel gear for my application so I went with that. I've got about 8K miles on it and both the the cam gear and distributor gear look perfect. I've checked the wear 3 times in that 8K miles just to be sure and I'm totally confident in it at this point.

HTM101 · #15 (**permalink**) 08-06-2019, 06:29 AM

I'll never use another bronze gear again. This gear had been installed on a "new" distributor, and installed in my engine by the seller of the distributor. The visible wear occurred in less than 2,000 miles.

spdbrake · #16 (**permalink**) 08-06-2019, 07:08 AM

Nice pic, looks much like mine I 1st changed. With the exception of the "Mongo Drill Hole!" in it. I'd steer clear of the shop or at least don't let them use a drill.

hauss · #17 (**permalink**) 08-06-2019, 08:00 AM

looks like the bronze did what it was supposed to do {save you ham!} oops I meant cam.

blykins · #18 (**permalink**) 08-06-2019, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hauss

looks like the bronze did what it was supposed to do {save you ham!} oops I meant cam.

You want me to send you a distributor gear? I'll do it for free so that your engine will live.

The whole point of this is to NOT have a sacrificial anything! Why put a gear on that will wear in a couple of thousand miles, when you can have both a cam and distributor gear without wear at all?????

Did you read the post from jacobsed????

For crying out loud.

patrickt · #19 (**permalink**) 08-06-2019, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blykins

You want me to send you a distributor gear? I'll do it for free so that your engine will live.

No. Giving away free advice is one thing, giving away free parts is another.

We've had this little chat before....

patrickt · #20 (**permalink**) 08-06-2019, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patrickt

No. Giving away free advice is one thing, giving away free parts is another.

We've had this little chat before....

Remember, that little girl of yours is looking at four years at Princeton then four more years at John Hopkins Medical School -- and ol' dad's going to be on the hook for the tuition.