Fact, F5 buying SAI - Page 3

Traveller · #41 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 01:44 PM

Come on fellas,

How many of you attribute your years of lusting about owning and driving a Cobra to its "resale value"?

Get .........REAL (hehe, sorry, couldn't resist)

BlueRooster · #42 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 02:08 PM

"I love taking money from guys with an attitude"

Hey Allan! SAI thinks the same thing!

REAL 1 · #43 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 02:59 PM

Thats not true. I bought a Shelby and I'm a REALly nice guy!

Allan A · #44 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 03:45 PM

Mr. Rooster,

I have not found that to be true.

Allan

Jim Colman · #45 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 03:50 PM

It's interesting how there are three different threads over here regarding FFR buying/not buying SAI but over at the FFR forum, it's ho-hum, business as usual.

My take on all this is that it's not going to change the value of SAI products much if at all. Shelby cars will always enjoy the heritage of the brand name. You cannot buy history but you can improve the marketing and price point of Shelby's products. Perhaps the price may drop a bit but the value will still be there. Anyway, this is all speculation so it doesn't really matter one whit at this stage. All I know is that I've been promised the first share if and when FFR/SAI ever go public.

Cheers
Jim

Edley Rondinone · #46 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 03:53 PM

If Venture sells out to whomever after going bankrupt or whatever, they will probably sell to the highest bidder. SAI would have minimal, IF ANY, control, over who buys out Venture. I dont think that FFR ownership of SAI would do much to the prices and value of SAI CSX cars at the start; I dont think that values of pre-FFR CSX cars would rise much, IMHO, but who really knows? A bigger question is what happens after Carroll Shelby dies.

BANDIT 1 · #47 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 04:36 PM

If FFR was to purchase SIA and just "closet" the operation, I think the CSX4000 series cars would go up in value for sure. After all, they would be the "last of the "real" Shelby Cobra's".

If FFR was to purchase SIA and continue the sale of "new" Shelby Cobra's, it would be a total loss. Like it or not, the two companies are concidered at each end of the Cobra food chain. I think this would make the CSX4000 series Cobra's that were already made go down in value, but then they would go back up in value as the initial "shock" of the sale went away.

There really wouldn't be much reason for FFR to purchase SIA, as several have pointed out before "the sales pitch of the CSX4000 car is that it is a Shelby Cobra". FFR and SIA aren't really ever in competition with each other. The only reason I could see anyone purchasing SIA is to put a end to the lawsuits.

Mr. Shelby has already said he is working with Ford on a new Shelby Cobra.

ToyCollector · #48 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 04:53 PM

For the lawyers in the group, if these rumors are untrue, can some of the members here and and on other forums be subject to libel? The one on FFR where someone says he heard it from "the horse's mouth", could be made up.

Secondly, it would have been better to announce something like this at Carlyle, not after. Other than wanting to buy them to put them out of business, what are they getting? Good prison labor? Some good production people and processes perhaps. Some good parts that they do inhouse? Does SAI have the rights to Shelby name? I don't think FFR needs SAI for FFR to continue as a business.

decooney · #49 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 05:00 PM

If this takes place, i wonder...

- was SAI being offered for sale at the time, and why?

or,

- was an unsolicited and unexpected offer presented?

FFR seems to have been very successful in business so far. It makes sense to me they would continue to make good business decisions, and this could turn out to be a good thing for the future of the Shelby Cobra.

REAL 1 · #50 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 05:24 PM

SAI already said its not true. I believe that. I think that this "rumor" is nonsense.

jhl1963 · #51 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 05:48 PM

So if this does indeed happen, do you guys expect aluminum
CSXs, or FFCSXs to be priced somewhere between Kirkhams
and the current CSX pricing? I cant imagine they would be priced less than Kirkhams......thus I wouldn't think this would cause any major change in the market at all, no?

Jordan

casaleenie · #52 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 05:52 PM

Duane,

You're making sense...

Evan,

You're believing the wrong people....

It's gonna happen.....

Excaliber · #53 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 07:28 PM

jhl1963,,,,,FFCSX? Thats to close to a four letter word for comfort! LOL

Ernie

DanElam · #54 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by REAL 1
By the way. Where is the proof and numbers that SAI is not doing good sales wise. Is this just another rumor?

Oh, enough with the rumors. Others have claimed to hear it directly from the Smiths. Well, why haven't the Smiths come on and told us about their new acquisition. Its public now. SAI posted here and said it ain't true.

Well, where are the Smith brothers? They supposedly have told others according to what some have said here. Let them say its true here. They've posted here before. Whats the problem?

A couple quick notes: In Autoweek Shelby has blasted Venture for not managing SAI correctly. We can't confirm it, but if SAI was throwing off plenty of cash, presumably he wouldn't be blasting them.

As for the Smith's not saying anything that is to be expected in M&A efforts. In some ways, particularly if they are doing a deal. Most due diligence efforts require a 'quiet period' where parties are not allowed to discuss anything until the deal is decided. Perhaps most telling, FFR hasn't said anything to deny it. If they weren't in due diligence, they would be free to deny it. Since they haven't, you would have to assume that either they are in due diligence or using the rumors as a feeler for a potential transaction. If it is the latter, then they don't have very good M&A representation since there are better ways to do this.

When you take everything into consideration, my guess would be that FFR and/or the Smiths are buying Venture which would give them effective control over SAI for the least amount of money. Since it seems to me that most of the value is goodwill in any potential transaction, my guess is that Shelby would have to get some form of compensation. I can't imagine that just getting the rights to use 'Cobra' are worth that much money if Shelby still got to go around and blast you.

KobraKarl · #55 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 08:12 PM

What happened when Henry Ford died?

KK

Excaliber · #56 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 08:25 PM

What happened when Enzo Ferrari died, same kind of question, but more to the point in this scenario.

Ferrari prices immediatly shot up, in the short term! Then dropped like a rock sometime after that. The "new" models after his passing were blasted as being "unreliable", NOT "friendly" and various other reasons. The OLD Ferraris held their value quite nicely thank you! In the last few years the NEW Ferraris have undergone major changes in design in the COCKPIT. They are much more "user friendly", more reliable, more cost effective. I wonder if Enzo isn't rolling over in his grave at this! Yet, Ferrari is doing OK, sales are up, they just "adjusted" to todays market.

I think a VERY similiar thing will happen when Shelby passes the torch. The Old CSX2000/3000 series cars will hold their own ANYWAY it goes down, increase steadily no matter what!

The NEW CSX4000 series cars and others WILL increase dramatically at least in the SHORT TERM (30% I estimate), then they will fall off a little down the road and finally stabilize and steadily INCREASE in the LONG TERM. I estimate they will increase at a rate of about 15% a year AFTER they stabilize for years to come, and then less after that. Making the Shelby Cobra a nice little investment for those with the money AND the balls to ride it out!

Hey Evan, is 15 to 30% return on your investment enough to put up with the stuff you do? LOL,,,,,might be!

Cars built AFTER Shelby passes will forever remain a mystery as to value and potential value. Much will depend on WHO runs the company and HOW it is run. I would not want to "bet" on Cobras built AFTER Shelby, to risky to tell. Try the old "8 Ball" on that one, it's about as accurate as your going to get!

Ernie

jhl1963 · #57 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 08:31 PM

Excaliber, if SA remains in business and produces the same car as today, even if Shelby Passes (and don't get me wrong I hope he lives a long, long time) why would the 4000 cars increase in value? The exact same cars are available, brand new. If on the other hand, the Company goes down with him, and the supply ends, then I can see prices going up.

Jordan

Excaliber · #58 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 08:37 PM

Ferraris were still available afte Enzo passed on,,,,so why did the cars built AFTER him show no substantial increase in earning power?

This is "really" more about "mystique" and "legend" than "quality" control issues! The cars being built NOW are the end of the road. There will NEVER be others like them, no matter how "correct" to specs they may be.

Ernie

REAL 1 · #59 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 08:44 PM

Lets just say I'll only believe it when there is an official announcement by FFR or SAI/Venture.

Until then were just like kackling old ladies buzzing about some unsubstantiated rumor.

I'm not wasting any more time on this nonsense until some official announcement or statement is offered by FFR. You guys can continue to waste you time talking about something thats nothing more than a "rumor" thats been repeatedly denied by people at Shelby.

Good night.

Ernie: Thanks buddy.

KobraKarl · #60 (**permalink**) 05-21-2003, 08:45 PM

The bottom fell out of the "classic" Ferrari market almost simultaniously with the death of Enzo, giving speculators a spectacular bath for betting the come.