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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 03-07-2005, 08:27 PM
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Default Where's Garrett when you need him?

I'm looking at buying a house with a leaking shower upstairs. While water falling on your head might seem normal for Victorians , it's not what I really want for the kitchen below.

I'd like to get a quote to have it fixed and factor that into my purchase price. I suppose it's too far to drive for a quote....

Seriously though, with an upstairs shower leaking, do you ever see much structural damage from water leaking onto the beams or does it generally just fall straight onto the ceiling below and seep out from there?
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Old 03-07-2005, 09:34 PM
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Fix that leak Craig, I had a leaky upstairs shower which I only found out about on the settlement day and it had rotted out the stud walls around the shower and some beams below plus all the surrounding plaster walls and below ceiling was stuffed. Total bill around $15k. Thank god insurance companies back then actually cared and paid out their clients. Get a builder to look into it.
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Old 03-07-2005, 09:58 PM
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Default Re: Where's Garrett when you need him?

Quote:
Originally posted by 750hp


I'm looking at buying a house with a leaking shower upstairs. While water falling on your head might seem normal for Victorians , it's not what I really want for the kitchen below.
Hehehehe ROFL

Obviously I'm not Garrett, I'm much better looking

Either two things are the problem. A simple plumbing leak, or a shower tray leak.

The first is not too bad depending on access to the plumbing but the second is a like "sell the cobra" type expense, if it's been leaking for some time.

The leaky shower can be a huge problem depending on what the top floor is made of. If It's timber which would be normal for a residence then the timber floor can just rot away over time, resulting in a major repair to the floor.

By major repair I mean removal of the shower base, usually tiles, cement base and shower tray if there was one. ( prolly a galvanised tray and it's rusted away). Repair the rotted floor/bearers/joists and then totally rebuild the shower again.

Not nice Craig...

But then you're pretty tall so you could prolly stand on the lower floor and take a shower on the top floor anyways.
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Old 03-08-2005, 12:58 AM
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Craig,

Just turn your main water tap off and the problem goes away!

Don't worry about having no water - you'll save on the rates!!!

Any more advise needed?
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Old 03-08-2005, 01:20 AM
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I think the problem is that there isn't any shower base to speak of - it's just tiled. Maybe they aren't sealed, and the water is leaking through the grout (or mortar, or whatever that stuff is between the tiles). Can you tell I'm not a handyman !!!

About the cost - I told the Real Estate agent, who is the most unapproachable, arrogant pr!ck that I've ever dealt with, that there was moisture present, and there is proof a water damage on the kitchen ceiling. He rang back to say the owner will get a quote to fix the problem. I'll insist on being there to see what work is actually carried out, and to make sure that the work is covered by a written guarantee. I think the guarantee is standard practice for leaking showers.

Peter - your engineering logic comes through loud and clear
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Old 03-08-2005, 04:14 AM
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Craig..There are very strict standards for "wet" areas in dwellings.

Make sure the repair is done to that standard.

All the best with it.
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Old 03-08-2005, 01:41 PM
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Actually craig i was going to be intouch, because of the emmence of heat we have been having down here i've decided to take the new wife for a bit of constant warmth to Main Beach, is that near to you guys ? If so might catch up. ( Leaving Thurs arvo back tuesday morn ).

Back to the topic at hand.
Leaking shower...

Craig if you want the house and the agent will drop 15k plus might be worth doing your self, we have complete shower kits that can take about 2 days to install with a 25 year guarantee, but as Reb and Leeroy said its a bit of work. Unless its been leaking for 5 years or more there wont be to much floor joist rot.
If you have Pic's i can help further or make a genuine claim on my Business class flights up north, it seems where ever i go the apartments we stay in have the same problem so you can see im always quoting .

Hope to see you up there.
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Old 03-09-2005, 01:31 AM
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Garrett - 5 years? That's a relief. The tenants say it has been leaking for no more than a few months. There are a few kids in the family, and they have frequent baths. There is no drain in the middle of the bathroom. When I was present for the pest inspection, one of the kids had just finished having a bath, and there was heaps of water lying on the floor. I wonder how much of the water comes from the shower, and how much is water seepage from the bath overflowing.....

I rang a place today that said they would guarantee their work for 10 years, and all they do is replace the grout on the vertical tiles (NOT vertical smiles, Les!). They then fill gaps in the grout on the floor tiles and put a sealing coat of something over the floor tiles. They do a moisture test before any work, then come back in 6 weeks to verify that all is dry once more. They quote around $440 to do the job.

The only photo I have shows what a mess the bathroom is without any specific damage. A builder mate couldn't actually see where the water was coming from. If the tenants hadn't told us (other than the small water marks on the kitchen ceiling) we wouldn't have known. To be honest, I had pretty much figured in the renovation costs of the bathroom in making my offer, but I can't afford to do it all now.
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Old 03-09-2005, 01:37 AM
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Main Beach is an hour or so from Brisbane. Holidaying in Queensland - does the Honeymoon never end? Don't waste your time with work stuff up here. If you want a copy of a pest inspection advising that due to moisture, a bathroom quote is recommended, I can fax it to you. If you can claim a deduction, all the better !!!

There aren't even any Cobra meetings this weekend to tempt you with....

Here's what the kitchen ceiling looks like:
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Old 03-09-2005, 02:56 AM
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Default Go For it

The co.s offer at $ 440.00 is worth it for the intum, i am guessing it a rental for you ?

The base looks like it was a conc one hence its shape with the angled base tile, possibly a small hair line crack has started thus the water.
Its been retiled hence the cut tile fitting to this angled tile, if they re grout and use stop leak sealer it will sop the prob, lomng with teaching the kids how to keep water in the bath.
I've also had kids having a shower the placing a face washer over the waste and using it as a bath untill they dont notice it gets to shower screen level then you know where the water goes, also checking behind the tap flanges of the shower to see from leakes in the spindal washers, and or water conning from the shower rose down the grout lines and behined these flanges to the wall space then into the kitchen roof.

will have to stop as can feel the moderator peering and might start a new thread on How to with the Bathroom Guys...

Looks like we are going to byron bay for a day for some topless work, good thing i dont have the cobra or you guys might of thought we were going for a drive.

Is Byron on the way to Bris ?
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Old 03-09-2005, 03:07 AM
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Thanks for the info. No - it's not a rental. I chose to sacrifice on the luxury of a nice bathroom, because the rest of the house is what I was looking for. It's on top of a hill, has four bedrooms and a big rumpus, is very private, has a nice outdoor area, but most importantly
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.
.
.
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THREE CAR LOCK-UP GARAGE !!!!!! I'm in heaven


Byron is about two hours from Brisbane.
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Old 03-09-2005, 04:43 AM
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Craig,

Yes you have to find the leak and yes you need to stop it too.

In Oz all showers should be sealed under the tiles. Simply sealing on top is not the best solution.

Wet sealing can be done by a professional for $200 a shower area or you can do it yourself using a rubberoid solution painted on the subsurface - Bunning sell it for $40 a tin.

After seeing those tiles I think it would be well worth the effort
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Old 03-09-2005, 05:23 AM
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Yep....I agree with Pete.

Depending on the age of the house, there have been two "accepted" systems in wet areas. ie. Shower recesses etc.

Going back maybe 20 years the accepted system (still in use by older plumbers) was to install a copper tray over the floor into which the waste flange was brazed. The sides of the tray would extend up the wall studs by about 20cm (8") and all joins were brazed making a totally water proof well.

Some plumbers tried to save by using a galvanised sheet but found it rusted out after about 10 years leading to leaks.

The shower wall lining (usually a hardie sheet) was then installed extending down into the tray to just off the bottom. A concrete base about 5 - 7.5cm (2"- 3") was then poured into the tray as a base for the tiles.

A 90 degree flashing was used behind the wall lining at the corner join which also extended down into the tray.

All of that was then dressed up by the tiles but note....the tiles were not to provide water proofness. Done properly, a shower recess is water proof without any tiles.

Advances in sythetic rubbers and urethanes lead to the system Pete refers to in which the tray is replaced by an applied sealer ( quite thick application and using a fabric reinforcement over a cement based sheet). Usually however this system is for use on slab floors. The tray system is still the preferred over a timber floor.

How do I know you ask? , Cus I had to replace a bathroom and ensuite in this place at no small expense. The first wife goes right Pi$$ed off when carpets in adjoining rooms were getting soaked after a shower.

First Class PITW ( pain in the wallet)
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Old 03-10-2005, 03:59 AM
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Just a thought from a plumber....As explained in broken typing/english by Garrett.
1st test the base. Cover the outlet of the shower with a plunger/cloth/glad wrap and fill the base gently with a bucket being careful to only get water on the base tiles, keeps filling to just below spill level where the screen meets the tiles, make yourself a coffer & go downstairs and wait and watch. If you get no leaks after about 15 mins then let the water out & go back down to watch again. This second time will check the integrity of the waste pipe.
2nd..Check the pipework in the wall. Remove the shower rose, cap it off, take off the handles & flanges and turn on the cold tap only. Leave under pressure for an hour and then check around spindles and also wall behind shower.
3rd...Check the grouting including corners, the seal along shower screen, check the shower screen closes properly and that the rose doesn't shoot water at any gaps in the screen. Also check the grout seal where the floor tiles hit the shower base.

If you have no joy with any of these options then you may want to cut a small hole in the plaster from downstairs where the stains are and look in with a torch & mirror, with the shower running.

I have found (after 15yrs doing this sort of thing) that this process of elimination can sometimes save you from big dollar spending straight away. Little by little is the go.

I have heard of the companies that re-seal showers & the price is about what you've been quoted but look for others that will do a fully comprehensive job & guarantee the work they do. Some mobs down here back up the work with a 10yr guarantee.

I know it seems like a pain in the ass but you're making a major investment in the house so you want to make sure you get it right. If all else fails you should be able to rip out the whole bathroom and remodel it for under $10k.. EASY The most expensive renovation I ever did for a paying customer was $9,200 & that was an upstairs BR with bath, shower, basin & wc including demo, plumbing and tiling. Remeber that you can always do the demo yourself and load bins & carry boxes of tiles upstairs etc. Anything you can do to keep the cost down would help.

I must go & have another drink, all this typing is making me thirsty.

Cheers
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Old 03-10-2005, 04:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Batman


The most expensive renovation I ever did for a paying customer was $9,200
OK, so how much was the most expensive reno for a non-paying customer? I might be interested in that option. Heck, I'd even fly you up for that !

Thank you all for your thoughts. Who would have imagined the wealth of knowledge available here - and from both Qld and Vic !!!
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Old 03-10-2005, 02:47 PM
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Actually Craig....we are all as jealous as $hit.

Bachelor type fella with a 4 bedroom house could pay off any renovations real easy.

Just find 3 female boarders at say $120.00 each a week and you'd be laughing.

And...

That gets the cooking, washing and ironing sorted.

Is there a chemist nearby, you'd need some vitamins.
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Old 03-11-2005, 04:56 AM
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2 WORDS

MIKE'S APARTMENT



CHEERS
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Old 03-11-2005, 04:58 AM
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We're actually looking for our next holiday spot, so a trip up north might be worth discussing. How do you feel about lodging a 2 year old. She sleeps well but we're going through the toilet training bit so hopefully your carpets aren't too good


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Old 03-11-2005, 05:34 AM
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Les - sounds good to me! The house is only a couple of hundred metres from the local high school. Shame it's not a University. A few uni students would be fun. We could have some DORM PARTIES !!!!! Oh well, dreaming again.

Batman - after Les has stumbled into a cab in the early hours after the house warming party, the carpets will probably need replacing anyway. By the way, I notice you "HP challenged" sig line. I found the ultimate solution for you. It's still a Ford motor, but nearly exactly double your capacity. Go for it http://www.racingjunk.com/exec/ca/vi...0-BB-FORD.html
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Old 03-11-2005, 05:49 AM
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Stumble???

I don't stumble..thats like sorta half falling over.

When I drink I do a good job of it and really fall over..thats why I only drink stuff outta square bottles.

Square bottles dont roll far. easy to find in the dark.
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Last edited by Rebel1; 03-11-2005 at 06:02 AM..
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