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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2022, 12:13 PM
MBE MBE is offline
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Default Classic Roadster Electric Power Steering

I have to switch to power steering on my 2007 model Classic Roadster. I think it currently has the Mustang 2 manual rack and pinion.
I think the easiest swap would be an electric power assist, the type that has the electric motor mounted right on the rack. It looks like there would be room for the electric power motor.
I have a 4.6 litre DOHC V8 installed and there is not enough room to mount the type that mounts midway in the steering column and I am not interested in mounting the remote pump on the engine with hoses going to the rack. I intend to put a supercharger on the engine and want to keep the front of it clean rather than adding pulleys and hoses.
What has worked for anyone else? I would need the wiring to power it too.

Thanks for any suggestions.
Bob
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Old 08-06-2022, 03:02 PM
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MBE,

No idea if this is appropriate for your car, but here's what one of our local Cobra guys did: https://www.firstcoastcobraclub.com/...power+steering

HTH,

Tom
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Old 08-06-2022, 03:15 PM
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Thanks for the thought but I am looking for something more like this:
https://www.buyautoparts.com/buynow/...h5gEALw_wcBike

If the link works, I tried to copy and paste the picture but the Buy Auto Parts site would not allow a copy & paste.
The unit in the link seems like it would be an easy install if the bolt holes line up and there is room for the electric motor and there is a wiring kit that will power it up to work on my car. I already have an Ididit chrome tilt column in the car so I would like to retain that.
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Old 08-06-2022, 06:22 PM
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MBE,

Looks like that rack fits some mid-teens GM cars. Unless you have that rack you'll have major work getting that one to work in your car.

I couldn't find a Mustang rack in their site - that's the one most of the replicas use.

Tom
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Old 08-07-2022, 08:29 AM
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Yes I know that is only an example of what I think would work the easiest if there was something "out there" that I am not aware of. Maybe Flaming River or Ididit or some other supplier has something like it that works or is easily adaptable.
Thank you for your help.
Bob
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Old 08-07-2022, 10:32 AM
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Thumbs up Electric power steering

Flaming River has several options, here's one.

https://www.flamingriver.com/electro...power-steering

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Old 08-07-2022, 11:48 AM
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I don't have a Cobra, but I do have a CR Sebring that I am currently redoing.

I added electric power steering from an 05 Chevy Equinox to my car so that my wife will have an easier time driving it. I grafted the electric steering to a C4 Corvette tilt and telescoping column. Not saying you need a Corvette column as it could be mated to whatever you wanted. This puts the steering unit out of the way under the cowl and keeps the engine bay clean.

This is how it turned out:



There is a boost controller available for this particular EPAS unit that allows you to adjust the boost level through a knob.

This is the controller:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/28439860755...sAAOSw~oNhYvX2

The same vendor has a controller that is adjusted by GPS. He also has another that apparently uses force feedback from the steering unit to self-adjust. I may try that one out.

I haven't driven the car yet. Hopefully that will come in a few weeks, but I have tested the whole setup on the car and it works as advertised. There appears to be 3 levels of boost control even though the potentiometer is infinitely adjustable.

FWIW - I also added a fast ratio rack (15 to 1) and increased the castor to about 6*.

Last edited by Hotrod46; 08-07-2022 at 11:50 AM..
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Old 08-08-2022, 06:59 AM
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I will be using a Ford Fiesta unit on mine, zero space taken in engine compartment, kinda like Hotrod46 setup. I will actually be using the entire column, so a bit different.
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Old 08-08-2022, 10:24 AM
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Thanks for the pictures and responses. I have a power brake booster under the hood at the spot that the electric assist drive motor would be located as shown in Hotrod46's picture. The headers are the next obstruction.
I have seen the Flaming River Micro Steer units online. I would have to mount it onto the manual rack that is inplace right now. I'd have to shorten the pinion to close couple it to the rack, build a support bracket of some sort, shorten my intermediate shaft and wire it in.
It could all be done by a person (me) that has built and modified cars through out their lifetime. I am looking for a simpler bolt in setup that someone else has discovered and adapted to this car. I like the ones that have the assist motor integrated onto the rack.
I did print the schematic with dimensions of the Flaming River Micro Steer to start figuring how it would fit and where I could secure it with a suitable bracket. While it is not my first choice, it looks as though it might be my only choice.
Thank you all for taking the time to respond to my search.
Bob
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Old 08-08-2022, 11:34 AM
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The Toyota MR2 electric powering steering pump with a Mustang 2 power rack is what Iíve been looking at.
With the weight of the 390 power steering sounds like a good idea.
Is anybody familiar with this setup? Itís new to me.
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Old 08-08-2022, 01:19 PM
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Sunman,
Can it be that simple?
I looked for the MR2 pump that you said. It appears they are available for a reasonable price and a small size that I can mount easily.
Do I understand that all I have to do is power the pump with 12 volts, connect it to a Mustang 2 power rack and pinion, that should bolt right in to place, and I will have power steering?
Is the pump variable speed/pressure depending on the flow of the steering fluid??
The thread that I found was from people building electric vehicles. They were concerned about how much power the pump drew at highway speeds etc. That would not be a problem in my application.
Please tell us more about this, this would work for me I think.
Thank you,
Bob
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Old 08-08-2022, 03:19 PM
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There is a video of one installed on a 47 Ford truck on the Ford Truck Enthusiasts forums.
Has a Mustang 2 front end and works good.
Drift cars and dirt track been using it for years.
Pump has an input for a speed signal and runs all the time without one.
I’ve read here years ago the best ratio is the power rack with the lines looped no pump.
The pump is loud needs a box around it to quiet it down.
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Last edited by sunman; 08-08-2022 at 04:13 PM..
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Old 08-08-2022, 03:48 PM
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There are some add on GM electric units like Hotrods, that the various crowds having been used in Europe. That 15:1 ratio i really wonder about. My 83 GT %.0 had that setup from the factory. You look a direction, you automatically start turning that way, it's fast, and you can get used to it. Very easy to get into trouble in that car let alone an even more squirrely Cobra.
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Old 08-08-2022, 04:00 PM
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The 15 to 1 (3 turns lock to lock) number came from Flaming River, who made the rack. The stock MII manual rack is listed as 20 to 1 (4 turns lock to lock). The factory Fox body power rack is 12.5 to 1 (2.5 turns lock to lock, I think). I think the stock MII power rack is the same. Again, these numbers came from Flaming River.

If I'm not mistaken and I could be, gutting the 12.5 to 1 Fox body power rack and running as a manual was done on some Factory Five Cobra's many years ago, but the downside was high steering effort.
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Old 08-08-2022, 04:34 PM
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2.5 on the Mustang 2 power unit also, but disconnected a small block thing due to high turn effort without the pump.
Looks like pumps from newer cars work too and have a speed input with on as the default.
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Last edited by sunman; 08-08-2022 at 05:18 PM..
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Old 08-08-2022, 05:13 PM
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I have been thinking about adapting this one to my BDR.



https://epasperformance.com/products...ic-rack-pinion
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Old 08-08-2022, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sunman View Post
There is a video of one installed on a 47 Ford truck on the Ford Truck Enthusiasts forums.
Has a Mustang 2 front end and works good.
Drift cars and dirt track been using it for years.
Pump has an input for a speed signal and runs all the time without one.
Iíve read here years ago the best ratio is the power rack with the lines looped no pump.
The pump is loud needs a box around it to quiet it down.
I will have to research this further; there must be a "best" pump, maybe a Ford unit (other than the Toyota if it is too loud) that runs when needed at pressures that match up to whatever is needed to power the steering on my Cobra. From the pictures on the internet, it looks as though the Mustang 2 manual rack and powered rack are interchangeable using the same mounting holes, steering shaft and possibly tie rods and tie rod ends.

I will report back with what I find.
Thank you,
Bob
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Old 08-09-2022, 06:31 AM
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Volvo electric pumps have been used too. I studied them before going the route I did. There are some that have integrated reservoirs and some that have remote reservoirs. The remote units might be easier to package in a tight area like a Cobra. The Volvo units have been used it drift cars as well. Serious drifting puts a high demand on power steering. If they will work for that, they should work for anything.

Yes, they apparently are pretty loud. One guy on YouTube mounted his in the passenger compartment and I think he regretted it.

The same guy that has the Equinox controllers also has a variable speed controller for the Volvo unit.

FWIW -Not really pertinent to this thread, but I did leave room for regular hydraulic steering on my car as a plan B. There are some reported issues with the all electric DIY setups that I may not like if true. The main one being sluggish return to center after a turn. If that occurs with mine, it will be going on the shelf and a conventional power rack will replace it.

Here is a link to the Volvo speed controller:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/284900396770

No, I don't have any affiliation with this vendor. He just happens to have some neat stuff.
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Old 08-16-2022, 07:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobcowan View Post
I have been thinking about adapting this one to my BDR.



https://epasperformance.com/products...ic-rack-pinion
I don't know why this setup wouldn't work for my Classic Roadster too.
EPAS thinks the area between the dash and firewall is the best place for their Microsteer unit, which means removing the steering column and cutting it into two pieces. I would much rather buy their 1100 series electric assist rack that your picture shows and just bolt it in and hookup the wires. Otherwise mounting the Microsteer on my rack is my second choice.
Converting to a hydraulic Mustang 2 rack and mounting/matching an electric pump to it should work but it looks like there is not much room for that pump, I would have to look around for a "right size" pump.
I have sent pictures to EPAS yesterday of my steering column, u-joints, shafts and rack mounting.
I am waiting for their reply.
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Old 08-16-2022, 09:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Wells View Post
MBE,

Looks like that rack fits some mid-teens GM cars. Unless you have that rack you'll have major work getting that one to work in your car.

I couldn't find a Mustang rack in their site - that's the one most of the replicas use.

Tom
They have them on Speedway motors. Also they are called t bird racks. I have one on my VSE and it works really well.
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