Will these heads work

fsstnotch · #1 (**permalink**) 08-16-2007, 09:08 AM

I found a good longblock 351 that I'm going to use. I haven't finalized the plans for it yet but I'm wondering if these heads will work without machining the pistons for valve relief. The block is currently a stock bottom end. I plan to put a 408 or 418 rotating assembly into it but just in case that falls through....

The heads have specs 210cc (60cc chambers)

Lift 100 200 300 400 500 600 700
Intake 75.0 146.0 194.0 259.0 289.0 308.0 320.0
Exhaust 68.0 125.0 178.0 215.0 227.0 235.0 246.0

Spring: Intake, 130lbs @ 1.820 Exhaust, 145lbs @ 1.760, .500 Max Lift
Installed Spring Height-Intake 1.790/Exhaust 1.798
Coil binds @ 700lbs.

valves are 2.02 intake, 1.60 exhaust

I plan to use one of these 2 cams
Lift: .502"/.520" Duration @ .050": .228/235 Lobe Center: 112 rough idle
Lift: .479"/.479" Duration @ .050": 214/214 Lobe Center: 110 lopey idle

And I'd like to use 1.6 roller rockers

Any help? I did realize that the heads have a max lift of .500, so the 2nd cam may be the better option

Three Peaks · #2 (**permalink**) 08-16-2007, 09:41 AM

First thing to do is get rid of the crappy springs and put some decent springs in. .500 is not enough lift for a decent cam so you'd be wasting your time stroking the engine with the numbers the sub-.500 cam would put out.

What manufacturer's heads are these that you are looking at?

fsstnotch · #3 (**permalink**) 08-16-2007, 10:20 AM

Well, originally i had planned to go with a set of Vic Jr's, I probably still will if I do the stroker.

These are just some cheapie aluminum heads made by Pro Comp? I read some reviews about them on some mustang forums and everyone is very pleased with their performance. Especially for their price.

I am just trying to see if these could be an option is all. Most likely, I'll end up buying a set of Jr's or performers just for piece of mind.

Three Peaks · #4 (**permalink**) 08-16-2007, 12:17 PM

Nothing necessarily wrong with the Pro Comp heads, but you have to check to see if the parts are compatible with your build. Do the heads come bare or loaded?
If they come bare, you can spec the springs/ valves, etc... You'll probably also need the pushrod guides and rockers.

My Vic Jrs. came with springs rated to .650 lift and the guides already installed, so one less thing to worry about.

Once you check the head prices with the springs and other parts you'll need to make them work for you, there is a good chance you could buy AFR (which also come with lousy springs) or Vic. Jr for the same money or close.

Bob

fsstnotch · #5 (**permalink**) 08-16-2007, 08:27 PM

Thanks, looked into the springs last night and the Vic jr's would end up being about $150-200 more so I'll just be going with them. No point in buying the cheapies at that point. I was only looking at the pro comps because I read some good stuff about them on corral forums and they were almost 1/2 the price of the Jr's.

Thanks for the insight!

WildBill3 · #6 (**permalink**) 09-08-2007, 04:12 AM

hey fsstnotch we are running the brodox track 1 heads we gotm on sale before the end of the year only ran about 900 i didnt think that was to bad.they were set up for a Jessle shaft mount rockers because of the cam lift we are useing. worked out so far no problems.WB

fsstnotch · #7 (**permalink**) 09-08-2007, 05:18 AM

WB, What pistons are you using with your 408? CR?

I was figuring on the 19cc pistons to give me about 10.5:1 with 60cc heads. I didn't go with the flat top pistons cause I didn't want to run super high compression and most of the heads I liek are 60cc unless I have machine work done.

Dwight · #8 (**permalink**) 09-08-2007, 06:29 AM

I have a set of 195 Pro Comp heads. They look good and so far perform well. I need to change my cam for more top end HP/ rpms. I had a Ford mechanic with racing experience help me build my motor. He liked the way the head look. I know looks does not make HP. For $760 delivered, I thought I would try them. I hope these pics help.

Dwight

Rick Parker · #9 (**permalink**) 09-08-2007, 05:27 PM

Do the rocker stand holes have helicoils (thread inserts) in them? Without them, sometimes the threads will pull after some time. Otherwise they look real nice.

WildBill3 · #10 (**permalink**) 09-08-2007, 06:39 PM

wow 760$$ nice deal.hey we run JE custom pistons for very low compresion as this engine was built for a blowthrew Procgarger application 8.5 or 9 to1 on the base setup we have now I can put regular unleaded in HAHAHA oo yea.and still get 12.00 down at the strip @121 with a 3.08 gear

Dwight · #11 (**permalink**) 09-08-2007, 07:35 PM

Yes, they have helicoils.

Dwight

fsstnotch · #12 (**permalink**) 09-08-2007, 08:20 PM

Ya, those heads don't look bad. Looks like they could benefit from a gasket match but otherwise not too bad. The 210cc heds are $795.

Dwight, what cam are you running? Did you upgrade the springs? Anybody have spring recommendations if I were going to run one of thses cams?
http://store.summitracing.com/egnsea...splayPrice%7C0

I will likely use one of the track heat cams, edelbrock air gap dual quad setup, pro comp 210cc heads, 1.6 roller rockers, and reasonable compression 408 stroker roller motor. Something that can stay reasonably reliable to drive alot! My car will not be a garage queen! haha

Dwight · #13 (**permalink**) 09-09-2007, 07:11 AM

fsstnotch,
First let me say that Keith Craft can build and dyno a great 408 for "maybe" a $1000 more that you can. Coach Mike, my buddy has build a couple of motors or had them build by local speed shop. Last year he had KC to build a stroked 428/461 for his Hurricane. This year he has ordered a KC 408 for his new Dayton Coupe. Get a price list together of "all" your parts and then call Keith. He will pick the correct parts for you and get you more HP.

I build my own motor because I like doing working on cars (as a hobby). I build a 354 with fuel injection. My spec sheet gave me this info;

Pro Comp 190 cc heads with dual springs 120 lb. inst height, 390 lb. open.650 max lift (coil bind @ .795 lift) 99893-16 Superduty 21-4N SS one piece valve package 2.02" Int, 1.60" Ex .100 long 10 degree Chrome Moly Steel Race Retainers 10 degree Chrome Moly Steel Superlocks 1 set of Pro Viton Extreme Valve Seals 1 set of 3/8 rocker studs 1 set of Ford guide plates

I bought them from Direct Fit Brakes Inc Street Rod Performance off Ebay. He is in Glendale, Az 623-772-0053 streetrodperformance@yahoo.com
One of the reason I bought the Pro Comp was they had the correct spring set up for me. Be careful who you buy from. Some stores buy the bare head and put cheap parts on.

My Comp Cam is 35-518-8 XE274HR-12 with 1.7 roller rockers (long story) which gets me .590 - .600 lift. With the Pro Comp heads and this cam, all my power is at low rpm. Easy on the motor and very forgiving to drive. Start off in 2 nd or 3 rd, cruise at 1400 rpms, a lot different from the other 5.0's I've had in this Cobra. But no high rpms. I LOVE the sound of sidepipes at 6,000!

gross valve lift .555 int .565 ex
duration @ .006 tappet lift 274 int 282 ex
duration @ .050 224 int 232 ex
lobe separation 112.0
You can go to Summit and look at all the specs for this cam.
I may change the cam this winter but it's strong, fast and easy to drive. I'm going to drive it for a while and see.
Dwight

fsstnotch · #14 (**permalink**) 09-09-2007, 07:40 AM

Thanks dwight, that's the info I was looking for! The pro comps I found were through a dealer on racing junk. They come equipped with the .500 max lift springs and he said that is how he gets them from the factory so he doesn't mess with them. He gets them by the pallet.

I too like working on cars, or pretty much anything with an engine. I've already got the stroker kit on order. I'm gonna build this engine myself. Obviously have the machining done, but that's about it. the stroker kit I ordered is from CHP. Eagle cast crank, eagle forged H beams, probe 19.3cc pistons, all balanced to 28oz. Should be fun!

WildBill3 · #15 (**permalink**) 09-15-2007, 02:21 PM

um we were way under Keiths price with forged Crower crank and rods our engine didnt get the chinese stuff in it you can go that way if you please but i dont agree on building an engine that way for more money .he makes power for shure but we installed American rotating assembly for less,it may mean nothing to you but keeping the best U.S. parts in our car means something to us

hi-tech cobra · #16 (**permalink**) 09-15-2007, 07:41 PM

Amen to the "American Made" part. Chinese stuff is junk. It will always be junk.

The CEO's of American performance corps. (including Pro Comp's CEO) should be outsourced if they don't stop outsourcing to China.

So you can buy heads for a few bucks less. You get what you pay for. Look at the combustion chamber of the Pro Comp heads...10 years behind the times! A bad copy of Victory Jr. heads.

Don't support the Chinese. They are building nukes with our money. And one day we will confront their military. A military machine that would not exist if not for the Wal Mart mentality in our nation.

WildBill3 · #17 (**permalink**) 09-17-2007, 02:33 PM

I know being on a short budget is tuff but were allready spending cubic dallars on these cars i just like the idea of some nice Investment parts so it wont come apart as easly.Lord knows I can break anything so the tougher it is the better for us I dont want to do anything but a freshen up after a time,not a full on engine build after a lesser part failed,the extra time and expence is worth it for us,I understand that maynot be the case for everyone,but thats were our priorities and covictions lie.maybe a litte more than 2 cents..WB3