Roush Engine Failure – Pictures

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

I had Tom Lucas, my engine builder, check/retorque the heads, rocker arm assembly, oil pan, etc. after about 1,000 miles. As I said, I'm more anal than most.

Did you drop the oil pan and retorque the rods? What about the flywheel bolts? I submit that a properly installed valve train in our engines should never, ever require a retorque. And it would be awfully nice if one of the recognized engine builders replied here with "yes, the only time a valve train should require retorquing is if it was never torqued properly in the first place." And I bet that's the case.

[csx4910]

I would check to see if you can get the parts cheaper from somewhere else. There really isnt anything proprietary about a Roush engine other than thier EFI to my knowledge(they dont want anyone else being able to access the program to tune it) I didnt think they would honor anything out of warranty. The good old days of actually standing behind your product and doing the right thing for someone is out the door in large companies such as theirs.
Ron

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Did you drop the oil pan and retorque the rods? What about the flywheel bolts?

Yes, but since I was very lazy that day, I used my powers of x-ray vision and mental telepathy to check those.

I'll quote myself. "I'm more anal than most." And this beauty. "Don't check your hydraulic roller cam, no skin off my back. I don't care."

I'm sure none of this applies to 428's anyway.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

I'm sure none of this applies to 428's anyway.

Seriously, I had a prettly lengthy discussion on this subject with my engine builder when he finished my build for me. He was adamant on not retorquing the heads, but did want the intake manifold retorqued after 400 miles. A couple of other things as well.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Seriously, I had a prettly lengthy discussion on this subject with my engine builder when he finished my build for me. He was adamant on not retorquing the heads, but did want the intake manifold retorqued after 400 miles. A couple of other things as well.

Every builder is different. My engine builder retorqued the heads, but we're talking about the valvetrain here. We're not really discussing the heads, intake, oil pan or headers.

Aluminum heads and block may be different than your setup, because of thermal expansion.

Anyway, you know I drive my cars hard.

I can only aspire to a mileage figure of 2,300 miles. Man, that sounds like years away for me.

[patrickt]

Not driving a car is harder on it than driving it. I'll go one step further, no one in the history of the world has ever been instructed by his engine builder to retorque his valve train. Never, ever, no how, no way. Nada.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by patrickt

I'll go one step further, no one in the history of the world has ever been instructed by his engine builder to retorque his valve train. Never, ever, no how, no way. Nada.

So to use percentages, as you classically do, you mean 100% of the engine builders.

I must be special then and you're wrong. Because my engine builder did it and he instructed me that he was going to do it.

I protested and said NO WAY! But relented, when I found out he was only trying to amortize the cost of his new torque wrench by charging me extra.

[csx4910]

Where do I start with what it needs in 2300 miles? In short it SHOULD'NT need much but in my first 750 miles on my Roush 511 csx was in the shop 8 times for a total of 8 months, all Roush related problems. (1 time was the 4 1/2 months when the motor was shipped back to Roush) It had 5 oil changes for various reasons and just about everything that could go wrong went wrong with it.

Others have been without their Roush motor for months as well fighting with them about warranty work. I will NEVER buy another Roush product again. Maybe Keith Craft will take my 511 in on trade for his Alum 427 SOHC motor

[Rawkkrawler]

Wanted to add my rocker shaft experience....

How about a Comp Cam shaft? Broke one on each side! They charged me for the first and sent the second one for free. Happened within 100 miles of each other. Of course they said it was the first one they ever saw break...sure.

[Woodz428]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Did you drop the oil pan and retorque the rods? What about the flywheel bolts? I submit that a properly installed valve train in our engines should never, ever require a retorque.

I am no PRO engine builder, but have probably built close to a 500 engines in the last 40 years and I would submit that anytime you have aluminum and steel interacting ...re-torquing is not only a good precaution, but makes an extreme amount of sense. If I have aluminum heads on an steel block, I re-check the head bolt torque after an appropriate amount of miles. The Ford crate engine I installed in the Coupe had an instruction sheet that even detailed that. I think many time blown head gaskets, water leaks and other "failures" could be minimized by regular re-torquing. An all steel/iron engine doesn't have the expansion variables that are involved in an aluminum/iron engine. Aluminum expansion varies depending on what quality aluminum is used as well.

[patrickt]

Woodz428 -- I hear you.... But, how many of today's cars have aluminum heads and how many of the owner's manuals require a valve train retorque? Now, of course, no builder is going to go on record saying "even though that bolt is right in front of you, there is absolutely no reason to retorque it so you shouldn't even bother." It would be nice if some of the recognized builders would chime in on their view of the need for hydraulic lifter guys to pull their valve covers and retorque their valve train. Personally, I don't think that need is there unless the valve train was not installed properly to begin with.